Toxic effeminacy kills the Boy Scouts

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I believe there’s a parallel: the YMCA’s were forced to go co-ed, and now exist largely as lite health clubs that have courses (at least around here) in baby-sitting, Pilates, yoga, etc. Swimming pools, steam, weight rooms, etc., largely shut down. The YWCA’s, on the other hand, remain all-female. And don’t get me started on female reporters in male locker rooms. The pattern seems to be that boys / men aren’t allowed “their” space, while women are.
 
It’s no worse than when the kids won’t let the rabbit eat Trix cereal because it is for the kids only!

Only this time y’all would rather eat Jeff Sessions’ Keebler Elf branded cookies.
 
I still think, when you are talking about children, there is a difference in interests. Yes, there are always exceptions to the rule: boys that want to learn embroidery and have pressed flower collections, girls that want to learn knots and knife skills. But generally, children have different interests. Why can’t there be a group just for boys to be around other boys, or girls around other girls? Why are we “all just people?”
 
Irishmom2 said:
I really don’t understand what you are saying.
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Boy Scouts Of America Prior to 2017
Cub Scouts-Boys ages 6-10 with lots of family (name removed by moderator)ut and almost always sisters around anyway
Boy scouts- Boys of ages 11-21, typically more independant

Scouts BSA 2018 and beyond
Cub Scouts- ages 6-10. Boy only, Girl only, or Mixed family troops.
Scouts- ages 11-16 Girl only troops, Boy only troops.

City troops may have been different, but again, in rural communities girls ages 6-10 basically did all the scout stuff, just with no uniforms and no badges. If a troop went ponding or geochaching or whatever, and there were sisters, they usually allow those girls to participate because they are children. When cub scout aged boys tour a factory or learn survival skills as cub scouts, their sisters are often right there.

All this does is, in reality, is to legitimize what happens in cub scout troops anyway (which is sisters participating in activities) and to build upon that and allow girls an opportunity to have their own troops.
 
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Let’s agree to disagree then, XV.

I had two sons in scouts and the scenarios were not as you described. Families welcomed to come to the Pinewood derby for example, but girls (sisters) did not participate. The only girls that were there on trips, were sisters because the mom was a chaperone on the trip. Otherwise, boys were left to be with other boys.
 
This is a good move by the BSA. For starters, there isn’t much difference between boys and girls under 11. They do everything else together, why not scouting.

I also think it will be culturally beneficial in the long run. The less of an us vs. them mentality we can get the better. It’ll help marriages, military, workplaces and other things. The more men and women can respect each other’s contributions the better.

Which is more toxic…the BSA’s new policy, or the media?
 
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Irishmom2 said:
Let’s agree to disagree then, XV.

I had two sons in scouts and the scenarios were not as you described. Families welcomed to come to the Pinewood derby for example, but girls (sisters) did not participate. The only girls that were there on trips, were sisters because the mom was a chaperone on the trip. Otherwise, boys were left to be with other boys.
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But nothing, nothing, is lost by allowing girls to have their own troops under the BSA model. Girl scouts are just not the same.

While there was no official competition girls totally built their own cars and played around after the boys were done. Women and girls are always welcome at events whereas Girl Scouts basically ban men.

Boy scouts belong to the community and their sponsoring org, girl scouts can just be run out of someone’s home.

Boy scouts have 2 divisions- Cub scout and Scout. Girls have divisions by years. Boy scout uniforms are 2- Cub and Scout. Girls change colors faster than most people change socks.

Boys scouts have a set program with little changes, girl scouts change the program frequently.

Boy scout leadership is structured. Girl scout chooses their own.

Boy scouts focus on competency-based badges, Girl scouts just ‘try out’ things. Boys get ranks and badges, Girls get “special awards”

The fact of the matter is that “Girl Scouts” aren’t really the same at all, and there really isn’t a similar program for them.

Nothing changes if a troop don’t want. Nothing changes for Boy-only troops ages 11-17. Zero. All that is happening is that 6-10yos can be in a troop together if they wish and girls may have their own.

The boys still get their own space.
 
Yeah there is a difference, no arguing there. Though if you create a society where flower arranging is masculine, lots of boys raised up in the society would show an interest in it. We live in a society that is now kind of different, where things are not really seen as gendered.

I don’t disagree with girls only/boys only groups (as long as it’s reasonable) but I can definitely see the tension. We are living in a weird time…in the midst of a transition, if we call it that. Where old stereotypes/values are changing. Because of that, we see the tension because things are quite 50-50.

I was genuinely hoping they could make girl scouts a lot more fun though. Girl groups always suck, sigh.
 
I just don’t see that because someone doesn’t like girl scouts, that boy scouts should be changed to include them. And by change, I mean allowing girls.

I do think there is a place for separate activities based on gender. Not everything in the world needs to be for “everyone.” If people like the Boy Scout model of organization, why not start a new group based on it that is for “everyone?” Why change what worked for boys for so long, because what girls had doesn’t work? The fault lies with the Girl Scouts, and that is coming from someone that was in Girl Scouts for over 11 years.
 
Irishmom2 said:
I just don’t see that because someone doesn’t like girl scouts, that boy scouts should be changed to include them. And by change, I mean allowing girls.

I do think there is a place for separate activities based on gender. Not everything in the world needs to be for “everyone.” If people like the Boy Scout model of organization, why not start a new group based on it that is for “everyone?” Why change what worked for boys for so long, because what girls had doesn’t work? The fault lies with the Girl Scouts, and that is coming from someone that was in Girl Scouts for over 11 years.
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No one is forcing the boy scouts to change. They are making an org change based on the needs of their org and that includes the families the boys come from.

Their intellectual property is their own and there are smaller orgs that do just that, copy the BSA model for girls and boys. Scouting, as a whole, is on a major decline citing family issues. The BSA is trying to address this.

The BSA had an association with the American Heritage girls for many years, but the relationship between BSA and Girl Scouts has always been tenuous. Learning from Campfire which went way too “inclusion” and basicaly wrote out God they are trying something that seems very likely to work well.
 
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I love the story about the first girl Scouts.


Six girls got dressed up in borrowed Boy Scout uniforms and made their way into Britain’s first Boy Scout jamboree in September 1909. As luck would have it, they were noticed and confronted by the Boy Scout’s founder, Robert Baden-Powell.
Our patrol leader said: “We want to do the same thing as the boys. We want to be girl scouts.” Baden-Powell said: “That’s impossible, this is only for the boys.”

We thought he was going to send us away but in the end he said: “I’ll think about it.”
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He was true to his word and he wasted no time. Within months, the Guide Association (the original name of the Girl Scouts) was set up and launched.
 
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But the Boy Scouts are still excluding hundreds of other genders. Unacceptable!
 
They’ve opened a can of worms.

It’s the result of a society which has adopted arrogance, especially among females as a virtue in being a “strong woman.” It’s doing the opposite and destroying the culture as it teaches little boys that being born male is a disorder. Better to try and act like a girl.

Humility isn’t even in the radar of today’s society.

If you doubt me, watch the movies and television programs being produced. Heck if you can, watch the Lost in Space Series on Netflix, it’s filled with everything I’m stating here.

Jim
 
promethian_rule said:
Well, right now the change authorizes the creation of female troops of scouts, but does not authorize mixed-gender troops. That’s a good thing, IMO, because it reserves the space for boys to learn and grow within a male environment and to interact with male role models while discussing and learning lessons about what it is to be a good man. The same should go for female scout troops.
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Worth repeating!!!
 
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