Trayvon Martin: 'Shoot first' law under scrutiny

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mlund said:
He was a minor for a few more days yet. I’m not sure how much of his history can be made public without the consent of his parents. I did find out that at the time of his death he was a high school football player serving a 5-day suspension from school.

I agree. None of that, however, proves Zimmerman to be a racist, a murderer, or even having committed a felony or a hate-crime - despite the fact that the media has already convicted him.

If Trayvon actually took the first swing in that fight and Zimmerman had legitimate reason to fear he was going to be killed before he pulled his gun then Zimmerman may not even be legally guilty of manslaughter.

It’s tragic that this senseless death could’ve been easily avoided. That doesn’t automatically make it a murder.
  • Marty Lund
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The “first swing” would NEVER have happened if Anderson had
followed the advice the POLICE gave to him.

That advice was:
“DO NOT FOLLOW THE INDIVIDUAL.”
 
Lujack said:
Yeah, he must have been some kind of a real thug to get suspended from school. It isn’t like normal kids ever get that kind of a punishment.

And even if he was a genuine troublemaker, my God, he was shot dead in the streets! He could have been the most obnoxious kid in the world and that shouldn’t have happened to him!
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You missed my point. The media has already tried and convicted the case.

I"m not saying Trayvon deserved any of this.

Why are you always so quick to pounce on people who disagree with you?
 
catharina said:
The “first swing” would NEVER have happened if Anderson had
followed the advice the POLICE gave to him.

That advice was:
“DO NOT FOLLOW THE INDIVIDUAL.”
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It was not. It was “We don’t need you to be doing that.”

Who is Anderson?
 
According to NPR, Zimmerman fell and was bleeding from a wound to the back of the head. Martin was punching Zimmerman while he was down.

There’s a lot the msm isn’t reporting.

Edit to add, not saying Martin deserved to die. I do think a lot of people are making judgements without having all the facts.
 
Lujack said:
Or maybe, just maybe, perhaps a man with two young daughters is shaken by the shooting death of a young man who was walking home from a convenience store. Perhaps his statement wasn’t a calculated move, but a genuine expression of sympathy and grief from a parent.

I mean, I know people on here are not fond of the President, but he isn’t some kind of a robot. I think if he hugged his daughters in public, some people would try to find a political motivation.
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The problem is Obama has a history of making judgements before having all the facts. Racist ones at that.

He is the President, after all.
 
qui_est_ce said:
According to NPR, Zimmerman fell and was bleeding from a wound to the back of the head. Martin was punching Zimmerman while he was down.

There’s a lot the msm isn’t reporting.

Edit to add, not saying Martin deserved to die. I do think a lot of people are making judgements without having all the facts.
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AGAIN -
if Zimmerman had NOT followed the “suspicious
stranger” there would have been NO encounter.
 
qui_est_ce said:
The problem is Obama has a history of making judgements before having all the facts. Racist ones at that.

He is the President, after all.
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You plan to support that notion of yours?
As in, where’s your documentation?
 
qui_est_ce said:
You missed my point. The media has already tried and convicted the case.

I"m not saying Trayvon deserved any of this.

Why are you always so quick to pounce on people who disagree with you?
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I used sarcasm. I wasn’t pouncing on anybody. And what are you saying? A schoolboy received a schoolboy’s punishment (being suspended from school). That doesn’t change the fact that he’s still a schoolboy.
 
qui_est_ce said:
The problem is Obama has a history of making judgements before having all the facts. Racist ones at that.

He is the President, after all.
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And once you become the President I guess you no longer have human feelings?

There is something ironic, though, in criticizing Obama for making a judgment before having all the facts when a kid is dead because someone made a judgment without having all the facts (and regardless of what happened after Zimmerman started following Martin, without dispute is the fact that he ignored the urgings of the 911 dispatcher and started following someone instead of leaving it to the professionals).

Also, the “guns, God, and religion” remark, whatever you want to call it, is certainly not racist and really has no relevance to this case. The Skip Gates situation does, but I’m not willing to rehash that particular struggle all over again.
 
catharina said:
Verbatim is: “We don’t need you to be doing that.”

Meaning is perfectly clear to me -
but then I don’t pack a gun.
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The meaning isn’t so clear to me. Of course I do pack a gun. So maybe it is all in who you are. 🤷

I know I tell my husband all of the time that he doesn’t “need to” do something. Generally it is when he is trying to help out, and I don’t want to put him out. 🤷 NOT when I want him to stop doing something. If I want him to stop doing something, I say that.
 
qui_est_ce said:
People “sticking to their guns and religion.”

The white cop in the Harvard professor case.
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Relate that, please, to your words:

The problem is Obama has a history of making judgements before having all the facts. Racist ones at that.
 
Lujack said:
There is something ironic, though, in criticizing Obama for making a judgment before having all the facts when a kid is dead because someone made a judgment without having all the facts (and regardless of what happened after Zimmerman started following Martin, without dispute is the fact that he ignored the urgings of the 911 dispatcher and started following someone instead of leaving it to the professionals).
.
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I think you are getting a little extreme saying Obama is as bad as a possible killer, but then again you are entitled to your opinion.
 
Calgar said:
How can you possibly know any of this?
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Because it is documented in the 911 call and also confirmed by Travon Martin’s friend with whom he was speaking on his cell phone at the time. Both confirm that, once Martin realized Zimmerman was following him down the street in his car, he started briskly walking away at which point Zimmerman chased after him against the instructions of the 9/11 operator.
Calgar said:
I just want to point out that 911 dispatchers aren’t “officers” and even if they were we, as Americans, are not under any obligation to “obey” them.
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The rules for neighborhood watch are very clear. The purpose is to watch and report suspicious activity to the police and no member of the neighborhood watch is permitted to play cop and take matters into their own hands. You can argue that Zimmerman had no legal obligation to obey the 9/11 dispatcher but I submit that Martin was under no obligation to answer questions from a man he didn’t know and who had no authority to interrogate him in the first place.
 
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