Trayvon Martin: 'Shoot first' law under scrutiny

[Et_Cetera]

Untrue. That story is a fabrication from the police

And even if it were true, then Zimmerman would only have been pounded into the concrete for approaching someone else and starting the whole mess. Zimmerman had no need to leave his armed SUV. When he did so, he opened himself to attack. Has anyone heard of the transcripts of Trayvon’s last phone call where said that someone was suspiciously following him? Reasonably, Trayvon probably thought that Zimmerman wanted to attack and/or rob him. And Trayvon had the right to defend himself.

 

[Gift_from_God]

And even if it were true, then Zimmerman would only have been pounded into the concrete for approaching someone else and starting the whole mess. Zimmerman had no need to leave his armed SUV. When he did so, he opened himself to attack.

And when you keep in mind was a habitual cop caller and told people to be on the lookout for black people, it just all adds up to his motivation

 

[maryjk]

Okay

cnn.com/2012/03/27/justice/florida-teen-shooting-witnesses/index.html

Now can you prove to me that Zimmerman was mortally wounded and had to take a kid’s life? There is no evidence for such a claim. The police are covering up for Zimmerman and they’ll say anything to protect themselves from scorn

Whoa…he had to be morally wounded before he could use his weapon. That sounds like it would be a little too late to try to protect yourself.

You may also want to notice that Martin’s girlfriend’s statement came from the family lawyer. She hasn’t made a statement to the police, even though they have asked any witnesses to come forward.

 

[Dawnia]

And another thing; Martin was around 140 lbs and Zimmerman is about 250lbs. How could a kid much smaller than him honestly beat him up?

Was he anorexic? 140 lbs is not a normal weight for someone 6’ 3".

 

[maryjk]

And even if it were true, then Zimmerman would only have been pounded into the concrete for approaching someone else and starting the whole mess. Zimmerman had no need to leave his armed SUV. When he did so, he opened himself to attack. Has anyone heard of the transcripts of Trayvon’s last phone call where said that someone was suspiciously following him? Reasonably, Trayvon probably thought that Zimmerman wanted to attack and/or rob him. And Trayvon had the right to defend himself.

There are no transcripts. Martin called his girl friend. His girl friend hadn’t, the last I read, made a statement to the police.

Now, there is a transcript of Zimmerman’s phone call, since he called 911. He said, while on the phone, that he was walking back to his SUV. At that point there wasn’t anything for Martin to defend against.

 

[Gift_from_God]

Whoa…he had to be morally wounded before he could use his weapon. That sounds like it would be a little too late to try to protect yourself.

I should have worded that better. It would have required his life being in mortal danger. And if Martin was beating this man who’s much larger than him, where’s his wounds? When I fell off my bike when I was 15, I was bleeding. Being smashed on the concrete would have brought about a ton of physical damage

 

[Faith1960]

Okay

cnn.com/2012/03/27/justice/florida-teen-shooting-witnesses/index.html

Now can you prove to me that Zimmerman was mortally wounded and had to take a kid’s life? There is no evidence for such a claim. The police are covering up for Zimmerman and they’ll say anything to protect themselves from scorn

Did you even bother to READ the article you linked us to?

<<<<"Zimmerman said Martin pinned him to the ground and began slamming his head into the sidewalk. The police report described Zimmerman’s back as wet and covered with grass, as though he had been lying on the ground.

Zimmerman was also bleeding from the nose and the back of his head, the police report said.">>>>

The written police report, written by officers who were actually at the scene states that Zimmerman was injured. suggesting he’d been attacked by Trayvon prior to the shooting.

<<<<“Zimmerman’s call to police was among the 911 tapes released by police. Some people hear what sounds like a POSSIBLE racial slur. CNN enhanced the sound of the 911 call, and several members of CNN’s editorial staff repeatedly reviewed the tape but COULD REACH NO CONSENSUS on whether Zimmerman used a slur.”>>>>

Thank you for proving that we don’t know if Zimmerman used a racial epithet or not. I am curious, though, how is it that you are able to listen to a tape on YouTube and hear something that even the professional staff at CNN can’t decipher?

<<<<"Selma asked him three times, ‘what’s going on over there?’ " Cutcher said. "He looks back and doesn’t say anything. She asks him again, ‘everything OK? What’s going on?’ Same thing: looked at us, looked back. Finally, the third time, he said, ‘just call the police.’ ">>>>

George the accused and alleged perpetrator was wanting help from the police. Not typical of murderers to request the police.

<<<<"Another resident who identified himself as John contradicted Cutcher’s account. He remembered Martin being on top of Zimmerman.
He told the Orlando TV station WOFL that a guy wearing red yelled to him, “Help! Help!”
“I told him to stop and I was calling 911,” he said. “And then when I got upstairs and looked down, the person that was on top beating up the other guy was the one laying in the grass. I believe he was dead at that point.”>>>>

Your account of this horrible incident and the CNN article you linked us to reflects nothing at all about established facts of the case. In fact, this article only underscores what some of us have been trying to get you to understand.

<<<<Corey’s homicide staff, meanwhile, continues to work round the clock.>>>>

They’re still investigating and yet some people are all gung-ho about slamming the police and insinuating that they’re not doing their jobs.

 

[Gift_from_God]

<<<<“Zimmerman’s call to police was among the 911 tapes released by police. Some people hear what sounds like a POSSIBLE racial slur. CNN enhanced the sound of the 911 call, and several members of CNN’s editorial staff repeatedly reviewed the tape but COULD REACH NO CONSENSUS on whether Zimmerman used a slur.”>>>>

They don’t know. That means it’s inconclusive

 

[Faith1960]

They don’t know. That means it’s inconclusive

But earlier you said that you knew Zimmerman made a racial slur and that this is a fact because you heard it all on YouTube.

 

[Gift_from_God]

But earlier you said that you knew Zimmerman made a racial slur and that this is a fact because you heard it all on YouTube.

Inconclusive for them. Not for me. I listened about a dozen times before I made up my mind

 

[Faith1960]

I should have worded that better. It would have required his life being in mortal danger. And if Martin was beating this man who’s much larger than him, where’s his wounds? When I fell off my bike when I was 15, I was bleeding. Being smashed on the concrete would have brought about a ton of physical damage

Zimmerman’s wounds? It’s in the police report.

 

[Faith1960]

Inconclusive for them. Not for me. I listened about a dozen times before I made up my mind

You watched or listened to a video on fun-time YouTube and made up your mind about what the tape says, even though the professionals involved in the case itself and those reporting on the case are unable to know what was said?

 

[Stjudeprayforus]

Inconclusive for them. Not for me. I listened about a dozen times before I made up my mind

Well, Thank God… you sitting behind a computer listening to you tube have solved the whole thing.

Stop the presses! We no longer need professional investigators! You have done what police just couldnt figure out.

Why do we need due process…when all it takes is an armchair detective, biased new reports and you tube.

Sleep well , America!

 

[GaryTaylor]

Was he anorexic? 140 lbs is not a normal weight for someone 6’ 3".

Doubt it, at that age playing athletics, He was 6’2 and 140+. Probly a couple lbs underweight. But I suppose it depends on which sight of misinformation one happens to be reading regarding the facts. Sure is an abundant amount of contradicting information.

The court system will resolve the issue.

 

[GaryTaylor]

If he had survived his assault on Zimmerman he would likely have been charged as an ADULT.

“If” … Speculation is all this is. Cannot be proven.

 

[GaryTaylor]

A grand jury will be impanneled and we we find out if they feel there is enough to warrent an arrest in this case.

Exactly its called “Probable cause” due process. And we can proceed from this point. The rest does little else but fuel the fire.

America believes a arrest should have been made immediately 75% in fact, I agree. It wasn’t so now if we could get all to calm down a bit, till the hearing we can proceed with the Court Process of America.

Does it work perfect? No, but its the best we have and what they decide we live with.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Scott, the kid is dead and was murdered by a gunshot. How is that not probable cause?

FIrst, he hasn’t been charged with anything, so it isn’t murder. YOU may consider it murder, but not in the eyes of the law. SInce that is what matters in this case, I’ll go with real legal definitions. Under the law and at the scene, the police did not have probable cause to arrest him. In American, even in Florida, police and criminal prosecutors are bound by the law and the Constitution, not the opinions of internet chatroom posters. Maybe things are different in Canada?

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Exactly its called “Probable cause” due process. And we can proceed from this point. The rest does little else but fuel the fire.

America believes a arrest should have been made immediately 75% in fact, I agree. It wasn’t so now if we could get all to calm down a bit, till the hearing we can proceed with the Court Process of America.

Does it work perfect? No, but its the best we have and what they decide we live with.

Lets also not forget that in the criminal system fails, then the family will still have the option of pursuing a civil lawsuit for wrongful death.

 

[Holly3278]

The only thing I can’t figure out with the Trayvon Martin issue is why his shooter has not been arrested yet. I mean, it seems to me that clearly the guy who shot him was in the wrong and that he violated the law. It seems to me to be a clear cut case of murder.

 

[Geist]

Your post was condescending and filled with extreme hyperbole.

No, it was not. You’re very defensive fact master.

My original post contained no such thing, and that’s how you responded to it. You think I owe you any deference when you act like that in a reply? Come on now.

Your post contained three “facts” that you apparently made up on the spot. What deference is owed to at best fantasy and at worst outright lies?

You really thought that I think someone should be arrested for acting in self-defense? Of course not. But you don’t just determine that immediately upon arriving at a scene.

Here’s the funny thing;; you called for the arrest of Zimmerman. SO, why would I think you think that? Because you said it.

And in this case, the killer wasn’t acting in self-defense, so it’s hard to prop that argument up.

Yes, he was. When someone strikes you the victim is not the one blamed for starting violence.

Give me a break. It was not. I said he should be arrested for shooting and killing someone

.

In self-defense. You seem to keep leaving that out…why? Agenda much?

Yeah. That’s what you do when someone shoots and kills somebody. It’s not really that hard to get.

Actually, see, it is hard to get. A man that just was assaulted, injured, denied medical treatment, and had to take someones life in self defense really shouldn’t be handcuffed, stuck in a cell (with more criminals), put before a judge, get a lawyer, spend thousands of dollars, etc.

Its not right.

Yes, this guy was just walking around with a bag of skittles when he, for no apparent reason, decided to beat down a man who totally wasn’t stalking him, right? (except the transcript says otherwise). Said man also coincidentally happened to be an armed neighborhood vigilante. Big coincidence, huh?

“Vigilante”? Hyperbole much? You people out to crucify a guy for defending himself like loaded words. Prolly because “facts” wont work for your agenda eh?

He was a volunteer, exercising his Constitutional and God given right to be armed…given the recent crime in the area not a bad idea to do so either.

A “vigilante” is one who takes the law into their own hands. This was a dude who got attacked by a thug and defended himself. C

Why didnt Skittles the Lamb I don’t know…just go home? Nothing was stopping him from doing so and Zimmerman had left anyway.

Why did he come back and attack Zimmerman?

Right, so if one black male did one thing, they’re all suspects? What?!

Uh, at least eight did actually. Profiling works. Should he have been keeping an eye on an old Jewish man instead? Those old retired Florida jews man…they’ll strip a house in seconds!

“Avi, help me grab this flatscreen”

“I don’t know Mordecai, my discs are acting up, give me my ointment”

1. If the killer had not been pursuing the victim, none of this would have happened.You know why? Because the victim WASN’T pursuing the killer.
2. There’s no evidence that the victim was a burglar or for that matter, that he was engaged in any criminal activity at the time.

Zimmerman was doing nothing wrong and operating as a watch volunteer and n ot harassing anyone, just keeping a distance.

I repeat this quote, because I have now posted the transcript twice. This is demonstrably false. Where did you get this?

Actually, you left out most of the transcript fact master.

And Zimmerman being sucker punched and pounced is from the eye witness account leaked to the press from the police report a few days ago.

So explain to me how its demonstrably false? Lay the “facts” on me!