Trinity and contradictions in the Holy Bible

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That verse does not prove what you say. It does not prove that are one! Instead proves that are three different.

The father is one God and the son One Lord.
 
Could you please post a verse from the Holy Bible that proves that the Holy Spirit is God?
 
Csst0286 said:
The father is one God and the son One Lord.
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And the Father and son are one. Jesus said he was one with the father.

Here the Holy Spirit shows he is God:

Hebrews 3:7-10
7 Wherefore, as the Holy Ghost saith: To day if you shall hear his voice,

8 Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation; in the day of temptation in the desert,

9 Where your fathers tempted me, proved and saw my works,

10 Forty years: for which cause I was offended with this generation, and I said: They always err in heart. And they have not known my ways,
 
If it was so important, why Jesus never explain the Trinity?
 
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Csst0286 said:
That means that
  1. the Father is the God and Jesus is the Son of the highest.
  2. Jesus is the Son Of the God.
In John 1:1 says also that Jesus is God, which means

that either Jesus is God and Son of the highest God or
that have been made mistakes during translation of the Holy Bible.
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From a reading of the Bible, you have come to the conclusion that:

There is one God.
The Father is God.
Jesus is the Son of God
The Son of God is not the Father
And since a Son always shares the same nature as the Father, therefore, the Son is also God.

So your first conclusion is in fact correct. Jesus is both God and the Son of God, because, as said, almost ad nauseam, there is One God, and the Son of God is God. THIS is the correct conclusion.

And since John 1:1 is first-year Greek for any student, you cannot say the Bible is mistakenly translated. You, unfortunately, are not competent to judge that the Bible is mistakenly translated. Since you’re a Greek speaker, you should have little trouble reading the Koine of the New Testament. Yes, it’s not the same flavour of the modern Greek you speak, but the learning curve should be much less. We have tons of English translations that say pretty much the same thing, and all we need to do is crack open a Greek New Testament to see how correct they are. So your “the Bible is in error” argument does not hold water, because you set yourself up as the authority, an authority you do not possess.
 
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Csst0286 said:
Post a verse that proves that the Holy Spirit is God please.
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Not yet. As I said, we approach this systematically. Before we even go to the Holy Spirit, I want to know where you stand on the relationship between the One God, the Father, and the Son.
 
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Csst0286 said:
If it was so important, why Jesus never explain the Trinity?
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Who said he didn’t? What does “Baptize them in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit” mean?

Why is the Father, Son and Holy Spirit all mentioned when people are baptized? To welcome these people into the faith. If Jesus didn’t believe he was God or the Holy Spirit was God, why does he wish for people to be baptized with all three? The answer is because they are three divine persons, but One God.

“Also the Bible clearly teaches that Jesus is God (cf. John 8:58, 10:38, 14:10; Col. 2:9). It also clearly teaches that the Holy Spirit is God (cf. Acts 5:3–4, 28:25–28; 1 Cor. 2:10–13). Everyone agrees the Father is God. Yet there is only one God (Mark 12:29, 1 Cor. 8:4–6, Jas. 2:19). How can we hold all four truths except by saying all three are somehow the one God?” (Catholic Answers).
 
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Csst0286 said:
Post a verse that proves that the Holy Spirit is God please.
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Fine. I’ll still await your answer on your stand on the relationship between the Father and the Son, and the One God.

Now that said, about the Holy Spirit.

Turn to Psalm 95, verses 9-10.

Who is the speaker?
 
Hey @porthos11 another good way to show the Holy Spirit is God is in the Acts of the Apostles

Acts 5:3-4

3But Peter said: Ananias, why hath Satan tempted thy heart, that thou shouldst lie to the Holy Ghost, and by fraud keep part of the price of the land?

4 Whilst it remained, did it not remain to thee? and after it was sold, was it not in thy power? Why hast thou conceived this thing in thy heart? Thou hast not lied to men, but to God.
 
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Joe1 said:
Hey @porthos11 another good way to show the Holy Spirit is God is in the Acts of the Apostles

Acts 5:3-4

3But Peter said: Ananias, why hath Satan tempted thy heart, that thou shouldst lie to the Holy Ghost, and by fraud keep part of the price of the land?

4 Whilst it remained, did it not remain to thee? and after it was sold, was it not in thy power? Why hast thou conceived this thing in thy heart? Thou hast not lied to men, but to God.
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Yes, but don’t overwhelm the OP. Take it systematically. You can see I am the one asking the questions, which I’m letting the OP answer, such as, who is the speaker of Psalm 95:9-10. It’s best to let him draw the conclusions.

One thing at a time. Approach the Trinity systematically.
 
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Csst0286 said:
Could you please post a verse from the Holy Bible that proves that the Holy Spirit is God?
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Here are all the verses that contain “Holy”, “Ghost”, and “God”
Luk_1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Act_2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
Act_4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act_5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.
Act_7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
Act_10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
Act_15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act_20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
Rom_5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
Rom_14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
Rom_15:13 Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.
Rom_15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.
1Co_6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
1Co_12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
2Co_13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. The second epistle to the Corinthians was written from Philippi, a city of Macedonia, by Titus and Lucas.
Heb_2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
2Pe_1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
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JoshuaIsLord said:
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Csst0286:
Could you please post a verse from the Holy Bible that proves that the Holy Spirit is God?
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Here are all the verses that contain “Holy”, “Ghost”, and “God”
Luk_1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Act_2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
Act_4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act_5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.
Act_7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
Act_10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
Act_15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act_20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
Rom_5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
Rom_14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
Rom_15:13 Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.
Rom_15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.
1Co_6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
1Co_12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
2Co_13:14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen. The second epistle to the Corinthians was written from Philippi, a city of Macedonia, by Titus and Lucas.
Heb_2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
2Pe_1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
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Let the guy answer first. Don’t flood him.

Who is the speaker of Psalm 95:9-10?
 
JoshuaIsLord said:
Here are all the verses that contain “Holy”, “Ghost”, and “God”
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Here are all the verses that contain “Holy”, “Spirit”, and “God”
Dan_4:8 But at the last Daniel came in before me, whose name was Belteshazzar, according to the name of my god, and in whom is the spirit of the holy gods: and before him I told the dream, saying,
1Co_12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
Eph_4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
1Th_4:8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.
Rev_21:10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
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porthos11 said:
Let the guy answer first. Don’t flood him.

Who is the speaker of Psalm 95:9-10?
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Concerning the Psalms, What must be said … is that the Psalms are poems, and poems intended to be sung: not doctrinal treatises, nor even sermons. … Most emphatically the Psalms must be read as poems; as lyrics, with all the licenses and all the formalities, the hyperboles, the emotional rather than logical connections, which are proper to lyric poetry. They must be read as poems if they are to be understood; no less than French must be read as French or English as English. Otherwise we shall miss what is in them and think we see what is not.

Point blank. The Psalms are just Songs. The attempt to make a doctrinal point from them is flattering but…
 
Csst0286 said:
If it was so important, why Jesus never explain the Trinity?
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Well…for one thing…how do you know he did not? Was everything Jesus said written in the Bible?

And why did he state in Matthew…to baptize in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit?
 
JoshuaIsLord said:
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porthos11:
Let the guy answer first. Don’t flood him.

Who is the speaker of Psalm 95:9-10?
Click to expand...
Concerning the Psalms, What must be said … is that the Psalms are poems, and poems intended to be sung: not doctrinal treatises, nor even sermons. … Most emphatically the Psalms must be read as poems; as lyrics, with all the licenses and all the formalities, the hyperboles, the emotional rather than logical connections, which are proper to lyric poetry. They must be read as poems if they are to be understood; no less than French must be read as French or English as English. Otherwise we shall miss what is in them and think we see what is not.

Point blank. The Psalms are just Songs. The attempt to make a doctrinal point from them is flattering but…
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There is a point to be made in the question. Just wait.

Psalms, despite being “just songs”, are still inspired Scripture, and fall under the value described in 1st Timothy 3:16. As with any Scripture, they can be used as tools for teaching and correction, which is what I’m doing now.

Just hang on and see what the OP says.
 
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These very poor arguments are stolen straight from Jehovah’s Witnesses. So if you can admit where you got these arguments from, it will be useful to show you their lack of knowledge and contradiction elsewhere because of these poor understandings. As a Greek speaker, I hope you know the history of the priest Arius that brought up a lot of these arguments against the Holy Trinity and was easily defeated by very knowledgeable Saints. Writings from Sts. Basil, Gregory the Theologian, Athanasius, Cyril of Alexandria, John Chrysostom, and others dealt specifically with the heresy known as Arianism. JWs have added so much other heresies to their religion, that the JWs would not consider Arius a JW, but the arguments that he made and the defense of Orthodoxy would be good for you to read if you are serious about knowing God.
 
Since you mention it. I am an Ex-Jehovah witness.

When I was 17 I baptized as Jehovah Witness. I was always a good example in their church. Since then I started searching a lot of things about their religion.

I left their religion when I was 30 years old because of the date of 1914, the false prophesies they gave, the cross etc.

Now, I am 33 years old and the last 3 years I study the differences between Jehovah witnesses and catholic and orthodox religions.

Trinity is something really important and something witnesses they reject it. That’s why I have to study it really carefully to see what do I believe, which verses proves trinity. Why I have not seen them before etc…

With my comment here I want also to
Thank All of You
for the conversation and the verses from the Holy Bible.

I am so Sorry for my comments in case I offended someone wit my remarks.

I will need time to study again the verses you pointed about our conversation (Specially the last ones for the Holy Spirit that is God) . I will return again for continuing the conversation.

If someone wants to post some extra things, please post it.

If someone is also Ex-Jehovah Witness it would be nice to contact me.
 
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