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mary_bobo
Guest
:banghead:
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ProdglArchitect
Guest
Why?
People are punished for single decisions all the time; and this is far more than a single decision. This is a series of decisions that occur over the course of twelve years. This is a mentality, one which will hopefully be removed when they realize there is no safety net to catch them; when they see that no one is going to pay for their decision to fail.
To make it more “nice”, If they go back and get their GED, they can have their access reinstated. At least then there’s some indication of initiative and effort.
It’s not nice, but that doesn’t make it wrong. When there is nothing to fall back on, maybe they will begin to understand that they should actually put forth some effort.
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7_Sorrows
Guest
I think there are many people in this country that would rush to fund PBS and NPR privately.
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Xystus
Guest
I agree. We should help those truly in need but we should not enable those who wish to exist on govt welfare and have no desire to get off of it.
2 Thess 3:10 “In fact, when we were with you, we instructed you that if anyone was unwilling to work, neither should that one eat.”
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Ridgerunner
Guest
I agree. You and I are not in total agreement on this, but we are partially. I personally favor “means testing” both SS and Medicare. Both are welfare programs, and should be dealt with as such. Some guy over 65 making $100,000 or more/year should NEVER be given money taken from some poor devil trying to raise a family on $30,000.00/year. Some, I realize, would put the cutoff at a lower amount, but I think the $100,000 is a good place to start, experimentally.
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lmachine
Guest
From a moral standpoint I recall some guy who used to forgive sinners. From a practical standpoint the implications of what you’re proposing will result in people dying in the street or turning to crime.
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ProdglArchitect
Guest
He forgave sinners, and called them to repent and change their ways. If you read my post, I provide a similar out. If they get their GED, they can be eligible for benefits again. They repent, and change their ways, so they get forgiven. Jesus’s forgiveness never came without conditions. It was freely given, but it always required change on the part of the person being forgiven.
As for the practical standpoint, you’re probably right, some people will use this as an excuse to engage in criminal activity. That doesn’t actually make my position wrong though. It’s their choice. If they can chose to commit a crime, they can also chose to get their GED and improve themselves. The fact that some will chose the “easy way,” is not my fault. As for people “dying int he street,” that’s grand hyperbole, but the fact is that people are dying in the streets with and without government assistance programs, and those places that receive the greatest aid do not improve, but persist in their squalor. If giving them money isn’t working, perhaps it’s time to try something else.
As a small aside, I personally feel that purposefully being a drain on society due to an unwillingness to put forth any effort is itself a crime, but that’s neither here nor there.
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Boatswain2PA
Guest
SS should be self-funded. Not enough money, then simply raise the retirement age. There isn’t enough money to support people being retired for an average of 12 years.
Medicare - yes, needs fixing.
Defense - Defense is one of the few actual roles of the federal government, and needs to be robust. Americans whine and cry about how terrible war is on television, yet have no idea that it is our military that keeps those war zones away from your neighborhood.
Schools that use such things to compete for students is part of the problem. Kids flush with student-loan money will seek out the best quality-of-life for 4 (or 5, or 6) years. Meanwhile, kids struggling to pay their own way will seek out the best education for their money.
That is because you have no idea about the risks of the world, or how our military keeps those wolves away.
A nation without borders isn’t a nation.
Agreed, there needs to be more cuts. I wish Trump would simply say that he will not sign a budget that wasn’t balanced, period. I believe the people would be behind him if he did that.
Our military needs to be strengthened. It also needs drastic reduction of waste.
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J_Peterson
Guest
There’s context to that quote that has nothing to do with government assistance.
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stinkcat_14
Guest
I agree, $100,000 is a good place to start. I have a friend who is over 65 and makes over $100k per year. Yet under current rules he can and does collect SS. There is something wrong with that imho.
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tomarin
Guest
Why exactly, if he paid into it all these years?
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stinkcat_14
Guest
Because it has always been a redistributive welfare program, not a retirement investment. His money is gone. Now others have to sacrifice for him. The guy working at McDonalds should not have to subsidize his lifestyle.
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tomarin
Guest
Ah I see.
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ProdglArchitect
Guest
On the flip side, why should he be forced to subsidize the guy working at McDonalds? If both people are working, and both people are paying into the system, then it is only fair that both people be allowed to draw on it.
The fact that someone makes more doesn’t mean we have the right to exploit them or steal from them.
po18guy
Well-known member
Does it matter to you at all if any of these programs have made things worse? Or is it all “feel good”?
Sour grapes and nothing more. You are free to send them your money.
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LeahTherese
Guest
What this say to me is that Trump (or those running the country while he morosely watches cable news and tweets about Snoop Dogg), seem only to understand material strength - concrete, guns, etc - rather than intellectual, moral or spiritual strength (no big surprise: I see no evidence of intellect, morality or spiritual understanding in him, but I will charitably say that’s just the chronically inept way he wants to present himself in public). America doesn’t become greater except in the very crudest and shortest-term sense by having more warships or a complex and illogical wall running along its southern border. If he’s serious about improving the country rather than boosting his idiot-strongman/toddler image further, more money goes into diplomacy and foreign aid, more into science (and more into the arts and culture which is also both an inherent good and another source of ‘soft power’ but I totally understand the reticence about bodies like the NEA even if I think they’re a good thing personally).
And as others have already said, these proposals don’t put a dent in where the bulk of government money actually goes, which into welfare. This is kind of cutting off one’s hand to spite one’s face only it’s also cutting off the other hand, both feet and putting a few gashes in the abdomen to boot, while entirely ignoring the great cancerous polyp clearly visible.
And as others have already said, these proposals don’t put a dent in where the bulk of government money actually goes, which into welfare. This is kind of cutting off one’s hand to spite one’s face only it’s also cutting off the other hand, both feet and putting a few gashes in the abdomen to boot, while entirely ignoring the great cancerous polyp clearly visible.
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Erich
Guest
Thomas Ruin:
Why stop at 19? I can think of a couple of cabinet-level departments we were better off without, starting with the Department of Education.
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starshiptrooper
Guest
This is a good start, and way better than the Republicans would have ever done by themselves.
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Xystus
Guest
Why don’t you provide it for us?
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YADA
Guest
So lauding Snoop Dog who acts out killing the President of the US and his nephew who would pimp out the First Lady illustrate the adults in the room and great public discourse
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the Endowment for the Arts that brings the world Our Holy Mother in elephant dung and a Crucifix in urine as art is an inherent good.
Gee - some posters here remind me a College I had sent some employees to for training … I told them to take my company off their mailing list… several times. When I did so very strongly in a letter explaining why I would never send another employee there and that I did not want to ever receive any mailings from them again … the President of the College called me to attempt to change my mind and then tried to tell me that argue that I was punishing the Civil Engineering Department for something the Humanities Department did …
They had an art exhibit that featured the work of some artist called “Two Popes Boinking” … it depicting two naked men except for Bishop’s Miters … having homosexual relations …
Suffice it to say - while I had no say in how my tax dollars supported that community college - I had every say in how and with whom my business training funds were spent … That college never saw another cent
Some of those agencies were meant to be temporary - one was created over 40 years ago … 40 years ago is not “temporary”
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