Trump v. Clinton matchup has Catholic leaders scrambling

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Ridgerunner said:
The Church does not endorse any political party.

But failing to oppose evil when we can is, itself, evil.

Supporting evil is, itself, evil.

What political candidates that have any chance of defeating the party of abortion are there?

If one is going to oppose evil, one has to oppose it, not just talk about how one sure would if only its opponent was perfect in every way one thinks he should be perfect.

This reminds me so much of Edward Rowland Sills’ poem “Opportunity”. So many of us are cowards, slinking around the edge of the battlefield excusing ourselves because we don’t have a perfect sword. No, Trump isn’t a perfect sword. Nor was Romney. Nor was McCain. Nor is anybody.

But to break the sword we have in hand, out of disdain for its lack of perfection and slink away from confrontation with the greatest evil of our time is moral cowardice.
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Ok. You are getting ridiculous. Now we are BEING evil if we vote 3rd party? Even if the 3rd party option is MORE prolife than Trump? :confused:

You aren’t making sense, but you ARE making a lot of enemies.
 
GaryTaylor said:
Whats the elephant? Listen , these Catholics speaking objectively if I may, believe the Church is Christ. The Bible itself states the Church is the pillar of truth of which they compiled the NT-27 and named it “Bible”?. That may be a point to non Catholics though.
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**Our Divine Teacher was not shy about telling us which of our Creator’s many Laws were worthy of emphasis.
But we allow our nation to violate those two Laws on a daily basis and say nothing about it.
A Catholic or an Anglican may attend services on Sunday and then go to work at Y-12 Complex or on SSBN Ohio on Monday, no questions asked.

The building and deployment of a nuclear weapon violates our Creator’s Law that we love and trust Him, and I believe that He is greatly offended that we place our trust in evil devices of mass human incineration.
These evil works also violate our Lord’s admonition to always treat others as we would like them to treat us.

Sure abortion is a bad thing, but our Lord did not command us to go around trying to prevent others from doing evil. Rather He told us to get our own houses in order.
With all due respect, I truly think that this obsession with human reproductive issues is really just a way of deflecting attention from the real evil that we have created.

Today I received a call from a Trump operative asking for financial support.
I asked her where Mr. Trump stood on the the Unilateral Nuclear Disarmament issue, and she could not give me an answer!
Talk about a mis-direction of attention!

**
 
GaryTaylor said:
Ah, I don’t “think” I said that but OK I can see your logic. Is that proven factual? 🙂
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I know Ridgerunner believed that. It appears EstesBob does to. They have been calling us cooperating with evil simply because we vote 3rd party instead of Trump.

Sorry you were the last person to reply to me, didn’t mean to falsely lump you in with the others. :o
 
Ridgerunner said:
The Church does not endorse any political party.

But failing to oppose evil when we can is, itself, evil.

Supporting evil is, itself, evil.

What political candidates that have any chance of defeating the party of abortion are there?

If one is going to oppose evil, one has to oppose it, not just talk about how one sure would if only its opponent was perfect in every way one thinks he should be perfect.

This reminds me so much of Edward Rowland Sills’ poem “Opportunity”. So many of us are cowards, slinking around the edge of the battlefield excusing ourselves because we don’t have a perfect sword. No, Trump isn’t a perfect sword. Nor was Romney. Nor was McCain. Nor is anybody.

But to break the sword we have in hand, out of disdain for its lack of perfection and slink away from confrontation with the greatest evil of our time is moral cowardice.
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I’m a coward. Hmm…I think I’m just smart.
Trump has supported and continues to support much evil. He is FAR FAR FAR from perfect. Not just a little, a LOT!

He will not get my vote and I refuse to be bullied by you and others who are insinuating our cooperation or siding with evil simply because we choose a 3rd party option.
 
GaryTaylor said:
Are we now questioning peoples intellect before you make any point? I disagree completely with you so lets be clear and get to the point, The only rhetoric I have heard is in regards to Trump who in fact killed no-one. 🤷 Thats not rhetoric?

Are you saying its not a fact the abortion industry kills 1-million a year and Hillary is not a avid supporter of abortion and PP and abortion on demand. Thats not rhetoric its factually documented.
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Repeating over and over that Hillary kills one million people a year makes it sound like she personally is committing murder. While I understand that you feel anyone who supports abortion under any circumstances is incorrect, accusing them of personally killing people is not only incorrect, but does nothing to convince those who are considering voting for Hillary to change their minds and vote for Trump instead.

I get that abortion is a highly emotional issue. But telling people they are murderers, saying they don’t care about women, or whatever highly charged epithets both sides throw at each other only serves to make each side dig in their heels more.

I would suggest saying a rosary each day for Hillary specifically. You might also want to say an additional rosary for those who will be voting for Hillary. I believe that will be a much more effective approach.
 
Ridgerunner said:
Which one of them said it was okay to support an abortion-promoting candidate?

Answer: Neither of them. .

And when one party is everything Cupich is appalled by, and promotes abortion on demand besides, he couldn’t.

And Bp Kicanas? Does anyone imagine he supports voting for a pro-abortionist who also started two wars with no justification whatever, has done nothing at all for the poor, is in bed with Wall Street, and sells influence?

I’ll wait for the quotes from both in which they endorse Hillary Clinton.
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I would think that Bishop Kicanas would find the election a slam dunk if abortion was the only issue that a Catholic need consider when determining who to vote for. Now, in the case of Archbishop Cupich, I am sure that he is also appalled by abortion and has said so. His point is that Catholics should take care about a variety of issues.
 
sallybutler said:
Hillary kills one million people a year makes it sound like she personally is committing murder. .
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Cooperating with Hillary/abortion in my mind as I have said is basically conspiracy to commit murder. The fact that I’m not there in person means nothing to me. I guess it depends on how you feel about conspiracy.
 
Crossbones said:
“Other direct assaults on innocent human life, such as genocide, torture, and
the targeting of noncombatants in acts of terror or war, can never be justified.”
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No one made one but Hillary with more promised. Thus the first principle applies as I quoted.
 
GaryTaylor said:
Cooperating with Hillary/abortion in my mind as I have said is basically conspiracy to commit murder. The fact that I’m not there in person means nothing to me. I guess it depends on how you feel about conspiracy.
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Then I hope you are praying for her daily.
 
Sure abortion is a bad thing, but our Lord did not command us to go around trying to prevent others from doing evil. Rather He told us to get our own houses in order.
With all due respect, I truly think that this obsession with human reproductive issues is really just a way of deflecting attention from the real evil that we have created.
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Contrary the Catholic Church documentation on abortion is linked. You’ll have to take that up with the Church its a secondary point to the conversation.
 
How nice that Trump is willing to make exceptions to some of his proposed new policies:
Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump, who has called for a temporary ban on Muslims entering the United States, has suggested he would make an exception for London’s newly elected Muslim mayor, the New York Times reported.
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“There will always be exceptions,” the Times quoted the real estate billionaire and presumptive Republican nominee as saying when asked how his controversial proposal would apply to Sadiq Khan, the son of a Pakistani immigrant bus driver and a seamstress, who was sworn in as London’s mayor on Saturday.
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theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/10/donald-trump-london-mayor-sadiq-khan-exception-muslim-ban

If a Muslim is the Mayor of London there will be an exception. If he’s some ordinary Muslim, forget it. :rolleyes:
 
Voting for the “lesser evil” hasn’t gotten us fewer abortions, it has gotten us a pro-choice Republican nominee. The Republican Party will slide further in this direction because it is enabled by pro-life people who are willing to allow the pro-choice viewpoint to creep in to the conservative movement without challenge.

If you will always give your vote to the person with an (R) by their name because they are “less pro-choice” than the one with a (D), then you only encourage them to adopt a more and more pro-choice stance. What is the consequence for Trump espousing pro-choice views? Pro-lifers backing him regardless. If that is the case then expect more pro-choice Republican nominees in the future, as it makes for a smart political stance to appeal to those who might be turned off by an actual pro-life politician. After all, if you’ve got the pro-life vote no matter what you might as well be pro-choice for the cross-over vote.

It is not the people voting third party in this election that are encouraging the shift towards a pro-choice political environment, it is the people that are pro-life who refuse to hold politicians accountable and vote for pro-choice politicians on the grounds that they’re “the lesser evil”. Pro-lifers should make a stand, a vocal stand, and not vote for Trump. Show the Republican Party that it must uphold pro-life values if it ever plans to put someone in the White House again. That would be a stand for life, and for the future of our country.

Peace and God bless!
 
Ghosty said:
Voting for the “lesser evil” hasn’t gotten us fewer abortions, it has gotten us a pro-choice Republican nominee. The Republican Party will slide further in this direction because it is enabled by pro-life people who are willing to allow the pro-choice viewpoint to creep in to the conservative movement without challenge.

If you will always give your vote to the person with an (R) by their name because they are “less pro-choice” than the one with a (D), then you only encourage them to adopt a more and more pro-choice stance. What is the consequence for Trump espousing pro-choice views? Pro-lifers backing him regardless. If that is the case then expect more pro-choice Republican nominees in the future, as it makes for a smart political stance to appeal to those who might be turned off by an actual pro-life politician. After all, if you’ve got the pro-life vote no matter what you might as well be pro-choice for the cross-over vote.

It is not the people voting third party in this election that are encouraging the shift towards a pro-choice political environment, it is the people that are pro-life who refuse to hold politicians accountable and vote for pro-choice politicians on the grounds that they’re “the lesser evil”. Pro-lifers should make a stand, a vocal stand, and not vote for Trump. Show the Republican Party that it must uphold pro-life values if it ever plans to put someone in the White House again. That would be a stand for life, and for the future of our country.

Peace and God bless!
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:clapping: :clapping: :clapping:
 
GaryTaylor said:
Cooperation with Hillary and the democrats is evil. Not because they are “democrats” but because they continue to cooperate with intrinsic evil. The evil is accepted and thus its cooperated with and then as we see its promoted by default like right now with Hillary. 🤷

Its a far cry from Trumps meandering which we know not what will come of it yet and is still being discussed. To date he hasn’t killed anyone compared to the Hillary 1-million a year and every year and promised another 4-years. I fail to see a comparison. 🤷
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Which is why I will not be voting for Hillary.

As a registered Republican, I will not be voting for Trump either.

I will vote third party.
 
Sarcelle said:
Which is why I will not be voting for Hillary.

As a registered Republican, I will not be voting for Trump either.

I will vote third party.
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Don’t you think voting third party helps Hillary Clinton?

What if Donald Trump has a VP that you like as a choice? Would you consider voting for them as a ticket?
 
_Abyssinia said:
Don’t you think voting third party helps Hillary Clinton?

What if Donald Trump has a VP that you like as a choice? Would you consider voting for them as a ticket?
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I do not buy your assertion. Voting third party on a candidate that is pro-life is voting pro-life not giving my vote to Hillary.

If Trump has a VP that I like than I will consider voting for him.
 
Sarcelle said:
Which is why I will not be voting for Hillary.

As a registered Republican, I will not be voting for Trump either.

I will vote third party.
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Im independent but I;m voting for the best statistical probability to beat Hillary, admittedly it looks like Trump. 👍

Body count Hillary 1-million plus, Trump 0. 🤷 Now if Bernie amends his pro-everything stance I would “consider” him, I’m not endorsing anyone at the moment though.

It must have to be a gloomy thing to actually want to vote for Hillary. Thats like volunteering to go along with pure evil. Almost on a equal playing field with Isis. Its like in a moral comparison cooperating with Isis. 😊
 
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