Ukrainian president says his country is ready to go to war with Russia and says the crisis there is more dangerous than the spread of ISIS

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If the online rumors regarding what a Russian Su-24 was able to do to the USS Donald Cook in the Black Sea last April are accurate, he might not want to bite off more than he can chew.
 
Honestly, I think he’s not afraid of war with Russia mainly because he sees it as almost inevitable. It’s the idea that he might be forced to war with Russia to make sure his country remains free. Pray that this doesn’t happen, because such could easily spiral into a much, much larger war, involving more than just Ukraine and Russia. Ukraine is not in the EU as of yet, though they’ve been moving in that direction.
 
The Ukrainians are not afraid of the Russians. A study of the public military literature shows the Ukraine will get outside support to regain control of its national sovereignty.

When the Russian occupiers left the Ukraine within recent memory, parents demanded their children be taught Ukrainian, not Russian, in school. They demanded their own coinage. This will not go well for Russia which is caught between two power blocs: the EU and China. The UK will also not stand by idle, regardless of whether it stays with the EU or not. The former Soviet satellite countries of Eastern Europe will not avoid conflict if necessary.

Ed
 
Just talk, they’ll be crushed by Russia in a serious military engagement. They’re barely able to contain the rebels.
 
SeanF1989 said:
dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2838094/Ukrainian-president-says-country-ready-war-Russia-says-crisis-dangerous-spread-ISIS.html
  • Kiev convinced Moscow is strengthening troop presence on its borders
  • President Petro Poroshenko said: ‘I am not afraid of a war with Russia’
  • He claimed his army is now better prepared to defend its territory
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IMHO, the best solution is to separate the country into West and East Ukraine, two regions, or even better, two countries. I say that because from the news reports it appears that neither side is too fond of the other. Some on the west have been calling for all Russians to leave the country, and there were reports a while ago of Russian priests being beaten up. While in the East, they don’t seem to want to have anything to do with Kiev. Why not stop the fighting, and break the country up in two and let each side live in peace separate from the other?
 
Tomdstone said:
IMHO, the best solution is to separate the country into West and East Ukraine, two regions, or even better, two countries. I say that because from the news reports it appears that neither side is too fond of the other. Some on the west have been calling for all Russians to leave the country, and there were reports a while ago of Russian priests being beaten up. While in the East, they don’t seem to want to have anything to do with Kiev. Why not stop the fighting, and break the country up in two and let each side live in peace separate from the other?
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Problem is: one side would have the oil and the other wouldn’t.
 
Russia is returning to Christianity, healing the wounds of the atheist empire that was.

They have banned propagating homosexuality to under 18’s and have banned the advertisement of abortion.

It is understandable that the West is angry as are doing the devil’s work allowing more and more evil to flourish.

I like Putin, he isn’t perfect but no head of state is.

We must pray and pray for things not to get out of hand.

ISIS is more dangerous, Poroshenko would realise that if they were in Ukraine.

Besides, Russia would steamroller Ukraine like someone rolling a carpet across their floor, I hope it doesn’t come to that because we will all get dragged in; Ukraine would have to attack first though which is probably what Poroshenko would do.
 
Petro Poroshenko is talking a lot because he thinks he has the EU to back him up on a war with Russia. I wouldn’t be so confident. Europe doesn’t want a war, most of the EU countries as of right now have a frail economy. Going for a war with Russia would tear the EU apart. Unless Poroshenko believes the EU is France Germany and the Uk… 🤷
 
amrin said:
Petro Poroshenko is talking a lot because he thinks he has the EU to back him up on a war with Russia. I wouldn’t be so confident. Europe doesn’t want a war, most of the EU countries as of right now have a frail economy. Going for a war with Russia would tear the EU apart. Unless Poroshenko believes the EU is France Germany and the Uk… 🤷
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Possibly having Russian tanks in his country is also a factor:rolleyes:
 
Nelka said:
Russia is returning to Christianity, healing the wounds of the atheist empire that was.

They have banned propagating homosexuality to under 18’s and have banned the advertisement of abortion.

It is understandable that the West is angry as are doing the devil’s work allowing more and more evil to flourish.

I like Putin, he isn’t perfect but no head of state is.

We must pray and pray for things not to get out of hand.

ISIS is more dangerous, Poroshenko would realise that if they were in Ukraine.

Besides, Russia would steamroller Ukraine like someone rolling a carpet across their floor, I hope it doesn’t come to that because we will all get dragged in; Ukraine would have to attack first though which is probably what Poroshenko would do.
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The communists were pretty tough on homosexuality too. They put homosexuals in Siberia.

And the “Christianity” of the Russian state is very far removed from what we would recognize. Unless, for example, you think closing Catholic churches is a good thing.
 
Nelka said:
Russia is returning to Christianity, healing the wounds of the atheist empire that was.

They have banned propagating homosexuality to under 18’s and have banned the advertisement of abortion.

It is understandable that the West is angry as are doing the devil’s work allowing more and more evil to flourish.

I like Putin, he isn’t perfect but no head of state is.

We must pray and pray for things not to get out of hand.

ISIS is more dangerous, Poroshenko would realise that if they were in Ukraine.

Besides, Russia would steamroller Ukraine like someone rolling a carpet across their floor, I hope it doesn’t come to that because we will all get dragged in; Ukraine would have to attack first though which is probably what Poroshenko would do.
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If you compare abortion rates and church attendance rates, the U.S. is massively more Christian than is Russia. That’s not to make a claim of virtue for the U.S., but simply to say that deifying Russia just because Putin makes a gesture about adult homosexual advances toward children (illegal in the U.S. for a long time) is not justified by the facts.

And can there be “healing” when the shrine to Lenin is still in Red Square, visited by newlyweds who still lay the bride’s bouquet at the monster’s grave? Can there be healing when Putin reinstitutes honoring that murderer Dzerzhinsky and names a segment of the armed forces after him? Can there be healing when 40+% of Russians admire Stalin?

Russia will “heal” only when it faces its past squarely, which it has not done. In fact, the direction is away from that and toward oppressing and killing its neighbors anew.

One of the reasons why the Soviets did not invade western Europe in the 1980s (the high command did have a plan for it) was that their forces would a) have to de-activate the Polish army, and b) fight the west with the Poles at their backs and across their supply lines. This was a very big consideration in the Soviets failure to invade and thereby save their robber economy from collapse.

If Russia decides to conquer all of Ukraine, it will have progressively more enemies at its back and across its supply lines as it goes. It will also lose a lot of men. Putin might take that chance, and Russian chauvinism might see him through the losses and the cost to the economy. But maybe not. I certainly can’t read the dictator’s mind, but I’m guessing he will conquer only the easternmost part of Ukraine, incorporate it into the new Russian empire (or Soviet Union if one prefers) and divide the spoils among himself and his oligarchs. Despite the destruction Putin has caused in Eastern Ukraine, there are still significant resources and industry there.
 
amrin said:
Petro Poroshenko is talking a lot because he thinks he has the EU to back him up on a war with Russia. I wouldn’t be so confident. Europe doesn’t want a war, most of the EU countries as of right now have a frail economy. Going for a war with Russia would tear the EU apart. Unless Poroshenko believes the EU is France Germany and the Uk… 🤷
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Russia is already at war with Ukraine, and Ukraine is at war with Russia. I don’t know that changing what it’s called will change the reality.
 
Russia would play to win if war is declared.

Has everyone forgotten the Russian invasion of Georgia in 2008?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Georgian_War

President Dmitry Medvedev said on Tuesday that he had ordered an end to the ‘peace enforcement’ operation in Georgia, after five days of fighting.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_(country)#Russo-Georgian_War_and_since
Both during and after the war, South Ossetian authorities and irregular militia conducted a campaign of ethnic cleansing against Georgians in South Ossetia,[63] with Georgian villages around Tskhinvali being destroyed after the war had ended.[64] The war displaced 192,000 people,[65] and while many were able to return to their homes after the war, a year later around 30,000 ethnic Georgians remained displaced.[66] In an interview published in “Kommersant”, South Ossetian leader Eduard Kokoity said he would not allow Georgians to return.[67][68]
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Through mediation by President of France Nicolas Sarkozy, the parties reached a ceasefire agreement on 12 August.[69] On 17 August, Dmitry Medvedev announced that Russian forces were to begin withdrawal on the next day.[70] On 8 October, Russian forces withdrew from the buffer zones adjacent to Abkhazia and South Ossetia. The control of the buffer zones was handed over to the EU monitoring mission in Georgia.[71]
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Russia recognised Abkhazia and South Ossetia on 26 August 2008.[72] In response, the Georgian government cut diplomatic relations with Russia.[73] Since the war, Georgia has maintained that Abkhazia and South Ossetia are under Russian occupation and remain, legally, part of Georgia.
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It’s almost a carbon copy.
 
amrin said:
Petro Poroshenko is talking a lot because he thinks he has the EU to back him up on a war with Russia. I wouldn’t be so confident. Europe doesn’t want a war, most of the EU countries as of right now have a frail economy. Going for a war with Russia would tear the EU apart. Unless Poroshenko believes the EU is France Germany and the Uk… 🤷
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Exactly.

It’s all propaganda and scare mongering, in keeping with the G20 accusations against Putin that he is ‘perpetuating’ the civil conflict in Ukraine.

If Russia is rolling its’ tanks over the Ukrainian borders, each week, as reported - where is the evidence - i.e. photos of the tanks/soldiers on the ground, or satellite pictures of same.
 
Just because people want Russia to be saved, and sanctified and consecrated doesn’t mean it is.

Russia is a third rate country with a first rate nuclear arsenal.

That’s the only reason it gets the attention it does.

If Russia and America were really christian they would destroy the warheads.
 
I believe that most humans are just inherently sadistic and cruel. It’s not really necessary to complicate this news story. People love hurting others, They derive the greatest joy in causing others to suffer. The sight of bloody, mangled corpses just gives a lot of people pleasure. So war analysis is ultimately pointless; people just love to hurt other people. Sadism is never offered as an explanation of world events and human history, but it’s the driving force in many human hearts. There are people who lie awake at night dreaming of it, they laugh about it, they derive supreme satisfaction from the thought of it and they are never so content as when they daydream about gore and emotional mutilation. I believe we should acknowledge that people look for excuses and reasons to war and vicariously thrill at ruined lives. People will say that evil is too simplistic an answer, but just look at the world, it’s all around us.
 
Ridgerunner said:
And can there be “healing” when the shrine to Lenin is still in Red Square, visited by newlyweds who still lay the bride’s bouquet at the monster’s grave? Can there be healing when Putin reinstitutes honoring that murderer Dzerzhinsky and names a segment of the armed forces after him? Can there be healing when 40+% of Russians admire Stalin?

Russia will “heal” only when it faces its past squarely, which it has not done. In fact, the direction is away from that and toward oppressing and killing its neighbors anew.
Click to expand...
Exiled_Child said:
I believe that most humans are just inherently sadistic and cruel. It’s not really necessary to complicate this news story. People love hurting others, They derive the greatest joy in causing others to suffer. The sight of bloody, mangled corpses just gives a lot of people pleasure. So war analysis is ultimately pointless; people just love to hurt other people. Sadism is never offered as an explanation of world events and human history, but it’s the driving force in many human hearts. There are people who lie awake at night dreaming of it, they laugh about it, they derive supreme satisfaction from the thought of it and they are never so content as when they daydream about gore and emotional mutilation. I believe we should acknowledge that people look for excuses and reasons to war and vicariously thrill at ruined lives. People will say that evil is too simplistic an answer, but just look at the world, it’s all around us.
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So it’s the simple sadistic impulse that makes newlyweds lay the bride’s bouquet at Stalin’s grave?
 
triumphguy said:
Just because people want Russia to be saved, and sanctified and consecrated doesn’t mean it is.

Russia is a third rate country with a first rate nuclear arsenal.
That’s the only reason it gets the attention it does.

If Russia and America were really christian they would destroy the warheads.
Click to expand...
Yes, Russia gets world attention because it does have a first rate nuclear arsenal. And it is maintaining and upgrading that arsenal. That will keep the world’s attention. The U.S., meanwhile has a nuclear arsenal that has been neglected and allowed to deteriorate. The more that happens, the less it deters Russia. And it’s purpose in the past, and increasingly so once again, is to deter Russia, and any other nation which might think of using such an arsenal. A neglected and deteriorating deterrent force does not deter. It rather signals weakness and encourages aggression.
 
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