US Bishops on George Floyd Killing: ‘Racism is Not a Thing of the Past’

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Unions are typically the same party as progressive Democrat mayors.
To govern. Yes. They do not have infinite power though.
They have enough power to require their employees to obey the law.

But my goodness. If they can’t control their police, how on Earth Is Trump expected to? They aren’t in his chain of command.
It would be a quick way to identify the racists on the police force because of the aforementioned blue wall of silence. But I am glad you are concerned with preserving individual rights because you must be highly offended by the assault on protesters outside the White House who were exercising their First Amendment rights.
I am. I found it to be the kind of move I’d expect from a progressive, not a conservative.
 
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It does show up in statistics. That’s why so many police departments end up on the radar of the DOJ. Now, you claim that “real studies” do not show this, so feel free to supply those “real studies” for us to review.
I already cited two studies back about post #29, and a BJS report in #28; have you reviewed those?

How do you determine when an instance of interracial force is an example of racism? How do you know when white on black violence is racist, and when black on white violence is not? If you look at crime statistics what you will find is that it is overwhelmingly of the black on white form rather than white on black.

“By those [FBI] 2007 numbers, a black male was 40 times as likely to assault a white person as the reverse.”

"Interracial rape is almost exclusively black on white — with 14,000 assaults on white women by African Americans in 2007. Not one case of a white sexual assault on a black female was found in the FBI study.”


Are these statistics irrelevant in understanding the real nature of racism in this country?
 
Unions are not people, so they are not members of any political party.
Oh, please. Unions are made up of people.
They do. And when their employees don’t obey the law, they should be fired, but if you cannot get other officers to tell the truth on what happened, it’s awfully hard to prove that an individual broke the law.
You’re having to work very hard to explain away either ineptitude or complicity on their part. If the mayor of Minneapolis was a Republican, Ellison would indicted him/her already, and the DNC media would have convicted him/her.
That’s why this has become an issue now.
It isn’t an issue now. It has been an issue for decades. Meanwhile, every four years Republicans are accused of being racist.
The blue wall of silence gets broken down by a cell phone camera showing what actually happened and illuminates the lies told to cover it up.
In the big cities, that blue wall is headed by a progressive Democrat mayor.
Then you haven’t been paying attention to the rhetoric coming from this conservative President.
The president has done nothing to defend that cop. In fact, he called for a DoJ investigation immediately.
He has, rightly, condemned the violence. He wrongly broke up that peaceful protest.
 
Is it your claim that the unions defend racism?
They don’t do it very well anymore, it seems. The percentage of black cops is just slightly higher than the percentage of blacks in the population. Now, one could argue that the percentage of black cops should be much higher than their percentage of the population, sort of like Irish cops once were in major eastern cities. But regardless, the percentage is still higher.


And the killing of blacks by black cops is no different from that of white cops. One could argue that ALL cops are taught to hate blacks, even black cops. But that really invites incredulity.
 
Well, many Republicans are racist all the time
I suspect most Repubs admit they have racist elements in their psyches. The ones who resolutely resist ever admitting to their own racism is the Dems, notwithstanding their racism is just as common if not more common.

But no matter what, just about everybody harbors some racist feelings, and it needs to be admitted.
 
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It isn’t an issue now. It has been an issue for decades. Meanwhile, every four years Republicans are accused of being racist.
Actually, in the PBS show “Created Equal,” Clarence Thomas very rightly pointed out that he was the target of racist attacks that would never have been tolerated, had he not been a Republican. (Yes, PBS.)

What he didn’t say, however, was that the attacks on him weren’t racist. They were.
I suspect most Repubs admit they have racist elements in their psyches…
But no matter what, just about everybody harbors some racist feelings, and it needs to be admitted.
Yes! Don’t you think everybody needs to ask themselves on a regular basis about whether they make assumptions about other people based on accidental attributes such as race or politics? That’s an unjust prejudice. Humans are wired to make pictures of reality from a limited amount of information. Fallen humans are wired to do it in unflattering, uncharitable and unfair ways. It is something we need to understand about ourselves, both personally and when dealing with others. It calls for both vigilance and mercy.

Another problem, though, is denying that people who feel they are experiencing unfair treatment are experiencing what they do. If someone feels they’re being made unwelcome, why argue with them? (I think there are a lot of professional athletes who have been shocked at the racist treatment their teammates have suffered, treatment that they might not have believed if they hadn’t seen it with their own eyes.)
 
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Well, first paper: #1: doesn’t take into account that there are many more whites than blacks, so equal numbers does not mean equal percentages.
This paper, by a (black) Harvard professor and published in the National Bureau of Economic Research, does not make such a high school mistake. It suggested that police were more violent toward minorities, but were no more likely to shoot blacks than whites. According to the author (Roland G. Fryer) “It is the most surprising result of my career."

The second paper I cited (still within the first of the seven sections discussed in the article), was by an assistant professor at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice, and explicitly discussed rates of homicides at the hands of the police, and concluded "… whites are 1.3 times more likely than blacks to die at the hands of police.”

The table I cited from the BJS also (unsurprisingly) referred to percentages. Your dismissal of those citations is spurious, but clearly easier than responding to them.
 
Yes! Don’t you think everybody needs to ask themselves on a regular basis about whether they make assumptions about other people based on accidental attributes such as race or politics?
Agreed. But more than anything we need to pay close attention to our actions, much more than our thoughts. Do we pay somebody less when we know that person is a minority (e.g. Hispanic, recent immigrant)? Do we open a door for a black woman as readily as we would a white woman? (yes, I know, could get in trouble for it, but I do it anyway) Do we speak more slowly to a black clerk, unconsciously assuming he/she’s “slower” in understanding?

Are we patronizing toward minority people, pretending to be “hurt” over a grievance that is hurtful to them in a way it can’t possibly be to us? Do we “steal” their sense of outrage for ourselves by unconsciously insisting on our “rightful” place at the head of a protest?
 
There is this to:

A new study debunks a common myth.

The Democratic presidential candidates have revived the anti-police rhetoric of the Obama years. Joe Biden’s criminal-justice plan promises that after his policing reforms, black mothers and fathers will no longer have to fear when their children “walk[] the streets of America” — the threat allegedly coming from cops, not gangbangers. President Barack Obama likewise claimed during the memorial for five Dallas police officers killed by a Black Lives Matter–inspired assassin in July 2016 that black parents were right to fear that their child could be killed by a police officer whenever he “walks out the door.” South Bend mayor Pete Buttigieg has said that police shootings of black men won’t be solved “until we move policing out from the shadow of systemic racism.” Beto O’Rourke claims that the police shoot blacks “solely based on the color of their skin.”

A new study published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences demolishes the Democratic narrative regarding race and police shootings, which holds that white officers are engaged in an epidemic of racially biased shootings of black men. It turns out that white officers are no more likely than black or Hispanic officers to shoot black civilians. It is a racial group’s rate of violent crime that determines police shootings, not the race of the officer. The more frequently officers encounter violent suspects from any given racial group, the greater the chance that members of that racial group will be shot by a police officer. In fact, if there is a bias in police shootings after crime rates are taken into account, it is against white civilians, the study found.
 
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Victims can be majority white and still be disproportional to the population.
This is true, but look at what @josie_L wrote: that it is in proportion to the criminals of the various races whom police in a given place encounter.
It is a racial group’s rate of violent crime that determines police shootings, not the race of the officer.
This was quoted from an article about a study on this topic.
 
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True. Do you have a possible alternative explanation that fits the facts?
 
One conclusion from one paper, that a comprehensive analysis shows that predictive factors include the racial composition of criminals within the area rather than the race of the police officer or the victim.
 
Look, I believe we need a lot of reform in our criminal justice system and I would like to see that happen. However, I think that an understanding of the true problem is necessary to helpful solutions.
 
It’s hard to keep track when there is a gish gallop of bad data poorly analyzed from right wing sites. What do you think we’re talking about?
Then the better response would be to provide data that says otherwise rather than use a logic fallacy like an appeal to common knowledge. Sure, correlation does not equal causation, but it also does not prohibit it by any means, and beats assumptions with no data.
 
Many inner city police are racist and break the law by targeting people of color.
Proof, please.
We don’t even have evidence that this case was racially motivated.
The blue wall of silence prevents the government from firing these questionable police.
This is such a flimsy defense of the progressive Democrat mayors who, over decades in many major cities, have either been tolerant of or complicit in bigotry.
 
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We don’t even have evidence that this case was racially motivated.
We know that it was a product of a class society that tends to leave black communities as some of the most impoverished and brutalised, and in this sense it was racist. Black-on-black violence, high rates of crime from black people, black poverty, police brutality towards black people - all of this is connected and points to the racism inherent in the way our society is organised.

It doesn’t matter whether any of the police involved were personally motivated by racism. Even if it were confirmed, I think it would be a distraction to focus on it.
 
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