US bishops warn of errors in feminist sister's book

[Dale_M]

People who get their works per reviewed and critiqued don’t get to collaborate with the critics, they only find out afterwards when the critique is published, (just like the bishops were not given the opportunity to review her book before she published it).

I think peer review typically works behind the scenes, providing feedback to the author so that corrections or revisions can be made. The author does not get published unless the peer reviewers and editors are satisfied. Professional book and move critics, of course, act independently of the author, and after the book (or movie) has reached the market.

You make an interesting comparison and it raises a number of questions. Do theologians undergo any kind of peer review process, other than a nihil obstat/imprimatur? Should an imprimatur be required before publication of theologians’ works? If so, would this be too burdensome for the bishops, either collectively or individually? Is the recent critique of Sr. Elizabeth’s work best regarded as a professional book review?

 

[grannymh]

Thanks for quoting it: Lakeland’s is a fine article:

“Inside the church similar crimes are being committed when a sub-group of the community, in the name of its convictions of what purity looks like and persuaded that it can speak for God, marginalizes others, whether they are the divorced, or gays and lesbians, or religious sisters going about their jobs, whether they are working in Catholic hospitals or in Congress, or, indeed, even if they are just theologians.”

There are more great sessions on tap for Saturday!

Whose Church?

 

[grannymh]

looked more into CTSA…

Catholic Theological Society of America (CTSA)
Promotes dissent against Magisterial teachings and questions the authority of said teachings. A “theological wasteland” according to Bernard Cardinal Law (June 18, 1997).

Also was not impressed with article I read today:
ncronline.org/news/theology/fairfield-theologian-calls-more-humility-church
Said Lakeland: “Whether we are engaged in invidious and often ignorant comparisons between the holy church and the sinful world or spiritually empty comparisons between the fullness of truth in ‘our’ tradition and the defects of others, we are about the business of exclusion, sweeping aside God’s holy mystery to impose our fallible human considerations about where saints can be found.
Am I the only one who gets a slight distaste in their mouth reading this?

Personally, I find the language of Jesus Christ easier to understand.

Guess, I better read the whole article to see if it is connected to Jesus’ Holy Mission (no mystery there) which is being carried out by the Catholic Church. Obviously, people acting in the tradition of Judas are always trying to tear apart the Catholic Church. Jesus was up front, in simple words, about that – dissent will not work no how.

 

[grannymh]

Fairfield theologian calls for more humility in the church

’World wants a church that doesn’t have all the answers’

Jun. 10, 2011 By Thomas C. Fox

Last paragraph: “Because the world needs the Gospel as much as ever, it needs a church that doesn’t think it has all the answers but that is prepared to work in solidarity with others in the search for the truth that will set us all free, a church that sees dialogue with our secular world as an encounter of grace with grace and sinners with sinners, and saints with saints.”

Why doesn’t this educated man know that it is Jesus Who is the truth which sets us free?

Is it possible that he never heard of the Catholic Church?

 

[po18guy]

Fairfield theologian calls for more humility in the church

’World wants a church that doesn’t have all the answers’

Jun. 10, 2011 By Thomas C. Fox

Last paragraph: “Because the world needs the Gospel as much as ever, it needs a church that doesn’t think it has all the answers but that is prepared to work in solidarity with others in the search for the truth that will set us all free, a church that sees dialogue with our secular world as an encounter of grace with grace and sinners with sinners, and saints with saints.”

Why doesn’t this educated man know that it is Jesus Who is the truth which sets us free?

Is it possible that he never heard of the Catholic Church?

I will stick to my own gender, but I maintain that it is possible to educate the common sense out of a man.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I always thought the process of the Books approval had to go through the elect and scrutiny of the other Sisters or Brothers anyway?

I never heard of a book being published without prior approval from the elect of the church from within the Church?

I have seen those who decided to walk outside there vocation present works in their own thinking. Any many are contrary to the deposit of faith. I can’t think of the Catholic Mystic whos mixing Catholic Morals with Zen teachings after walking away from the Sisters after 40-years. She’s in Colorado with retreats etc now. Anyway I don’t think its uncommon to have happened.

Even back when Thomas Merton was writting on subjects of controversy. They were read and approved through the abby before they were published.

God Bless, Gary

 

[grannymh]

The link in post 154 goes to an article by Thomas C, Fox, NCR Editor.

Having worked in a news bureau, I find it very interesting to read what the media considers important in someone’s speech. According to Fox, Paul Lakeland’s talk was titled “I want to be in that number: Desire, Inclusivity and the Church.” While Lakeland makes a case for humility, in my humble opinion, it seems that the gist is founded on the relationship of a church with the world. I say “a church” because, in my humble opinion, it sounded as if Lakeland wants to form a new church that has its foundation in the world.

In this linked article, Fox closes with a church description as part of a quotation. “… a church that sees dialogue with** our secular world** as an encounter of grace with grace and sinners with sinners, and saints with saints.” emphasis mine.

It so happens that this kind of secular world theology has been part of comments elsewhere. Hopefully, readers know why this is not Catholic theology. Do not be fooled by the rest of the article which refers to the parable of the Good Samaritan. The parable is not based on a church dialogue with our secular world; it is a direct teaching of Jesus Christ Who is God.

Secular theology is known for its avoidance of Divine Revelation and its dependence on the current (earth) world.

Blessings,
granny

John 15: 18-19

 

[grannymh]

Fairfield theologian calls for more humility in the church

’World wants a church that doesn’t have all the answers’

Jun. 10, 2011 By Thomas C. Fox

Last paragraph: “Because the world needs the Gospel as much as ever, it needs a church that doesn’t think it has all the answers but that is prepared to work in solidarity with others in the search for the truth that will set us all free, a church that sees dialogue with our secular world as an encounter of grace with grace and sinners with sinners, and saints with saints.”

Why doesn’t this educated man know that it is Jesus Who is the truth which sets us free?

Is it possible that he never heard of the Catholic Church?

Please Note.
The quoted last paragraph is from Thomas C. Fox’s report on the speech by Paul Lakeland which was mentioned in post 154.
ncronline.org/news/theology/fairfield-theologian-calls-more-humility-church

My apology for any confusion.

 

[Tigg]

As a Franciscan Brother CAF member maintains: If a Catholic cannot give assent to Catholic teaching in good conscience, they should consider leaving the faith. Does not this stand as evidence that modernists seek to impose their beliefs on others?

Yes…I believe it does and if they were honest, they would admit it. At least the Protestants started their own churches. What do these people really want? All has been revealed that is necessary for the ultimate goal - eternal life - what more do they want? They cannot admit that revealed truth trumps human reason. What is needed is FAITH and a new appreciation for the sacred mysteries. The gift of HIS presence on our altars - the enduring love and mercy shown in the sacraments - why, we should all be on our knees with the most grateful of hearts praising and thanking Him for all His benefits and the constant evidence of His love. Shame!! Instead they rebel and continually question and in their hubris they place themselves as gods, intellectually superior and constantly seeking that which they do not need to know. Isn’t this the reason we were expelled from the Garden?

 

[Tigg]

Please Note.
The quoted last paragraph is from Thomas C. Fox’s report on the speech by Paul Lakeland which was mentioned in post 154.
ncronline.org/news/theology/fairfield-theologian-calls-more-humility-church

Last paragraph: “Because the world needs the Gospel as much as ever, it needs a church that doesn’t think it has all the answers but that is prepared to work in solidarity with others in the search for the truth that will set us all free, a church that sees dialogue with our secular world as an encounter of grace with grace and sinners with sinners, and saints with saints.”

Translation = The Light on the Hill, the Shining Beacon, the Bulwark and Visible Presence defending against error and leading us away from sin, should now be tolerant of the ways of the sinful world and reconsider the truth promulgated by the Sanctifier.

 

[StAnastasia]

Yes…I believe it does and if they were honest, they would admit it. At least the Protestants started their own churches.

You’re being silly.

What do these people really want? All has been revealed that is necessary for the ultimate

 

[Corki]

Please Note.
The quoted last paragraph is from Thomas C. Fox’s report on the speech by Paul Lakeland which was mentioned in post 154.
ncronline.org/news/theology/fairfield-theologian-calls-more-humility-church

My apology for any confusion.

Thanks for the link. I also read the article on the opening address given at the CTSA conference by Maureen Tilley (Fordam University).

ncronline.org/news/theology/respect-holy-spirit-church-life-theologian-says

Ok, I’m keeping in mind that it’s the NCRep and they have never published anything that doesn’t contain at least one slam against the Church or the heirarchy, but seriously?!?

Is this what passes for theology these days? Both of these speakers seemed more focused on Church reform than theological thought and academic pursuit.

 

[StAnastasia]

Is this what passes for theology these days? Both of these speakers seemed more focused on Church reform than theological thought and academic pursuit.

You’re threatened by Maureen Tilly, right? You’re threatened because she is a woman who dared to earn a doctorate, rather than staying barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen and bearing dozens of babies. Do you think Bishop McGrath should excommunicate her? Do you think he himself should be censured for welcoming her, rather than excommunicating a woman who has an original thought of her own? Work with me – I’m trying to discern the parameters of your anti-female, anti-intellectual thinking here.

 

[StAnastasia]

Having worked in a news bureau, I find it very interesting to read what the media considers important in someone’s speech.

They picked out some excellent points.

According to Fox, Paul Lakeland’s talk was titled “I want to be in that number: Desire, Inclusivity and the Church.”

 

[Corki]

You’re threatened by Maureen Tilly, right? You’re threatened because she is a woman who dared to earn a doctorate, rather than staying barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen and bearing dozens of babies. Do you think Bishop McGrath should excommunicate her? Do you think he himself should be censured for welcoming her, rather than excommunicating a woman who has an original thought of her own? Work with me – I’m trying to discern the parameters of your anti-female, anti-intellectual thinking here.

Threatened? Now whose being silly? I just pointed out that the parts of her speech that were quoted in the NPRep article were not representative of theology and sounded more like a call for church reform.

I didn’t even disagree with her. I simply stated that her speech seemed tangential.

Why do you think she should be excommunicated? Has she made a practice of dissent or heresy? Has she publically denied Church teaching?

What is this anti-female junk? I posted some comments on two speakers - one a man and one a woman. Isn’t that equality?

How can I be anti-female? FWIW, I am female, with a Masters degree and two post-graduate certificates. I am currenty discerning whether my next journey will be a second Master degree or a PhD. I never saw an “either/or” choice between pursuing higher education and raising a family.

Anti-intellectual? Is there something about being pro-intellectual that requires that one cannot criticize the work or delivery of any other “intellectual”?

 

[grannymh]

You’re being silly.

That’s what you may wish.

You’ve never set foot in a Roman Catholic college or university, have you? If you had, you wouldn’t ask such silly questions.

Christ gathered little children to Himself. Was that silly?

We have daily Mass at the CTSA…

The Holy Sacrifice of the Mass was often said on battlefields.

More anti-intellectual silliness.

Christ confounded the wise.

You mean the garden in the symbolic Genesis story?

Bingo!

The" symbolic Genesis story" is the war chant of those who teach and preach secular theology with the hope of bringing Catholicism down to their level of enjoyment.

However, in the spirit of charity, my comment couldn’t possibly apply to any posters.

 

[StAnastasia]

If you didn’t hear her speech, or Paul Lakeland’s, you shouldn’t shoot your mouth off about them. Theirs were great talks. Members of CTSA are as good and holy people as other Catholics. It’s odd how posters on this forum – who seem threatened by academics – do nothing but attack a meeting they are not even attending!

I didn’t even disagree with her. I simply stated that her speech seemed tangential.

It was not tangential; it was central to the theme of the CTSA meeting.

Why do you think she should be excommunicated? Has she made a practice of dissent or heresy? Has she publically denied Church teaching?

I don’t; No; No.

How can I be anti-female? FWIW, I am female, with a Masters degree and two post-graduate certificates. I am currenty discerning whether my next journey will be a second Master degree or a PhD. I never saw an “either/or” choice between pursuing higher education and raising a family.

That’s a relief. There are some characters from Ave Maria University dressed in black suits running around at the conference, and they have harassed at least one female theologian for daring to have an original thought.

Anti-intellectual? Is there something about being pro-intellectual that requires that one cannot criticize the work or delivery of any other “intellectual”?

No; you just seem anti-intellectual in shooting off your mouth about a plenary speaker whose thought you don’t know, and whose talk you did not even hear. There is a lot of anti-intellectualism in the Church these days. I’m glad you are thinking of studying for a Ph.D.!

 

[the_phoenix]

Praying from today’s Liturgy of the Hours:

Lord God,
you filled Saint Barnabas with faith and the Holy Spirit
and set him apart for the conversion of the nations.
Grant that the gospel of Christ,
which he preached so strenuously,
may, in our day, be faithfully proclaimed
by word and deed.
[We make our prayer] through our Lord Jesus Christ, your Son,
who lives and reigns with you in the unity of the Holy Spirit,
God for ever and ever.
Amen.

 

[StAnastasia]

Praying from today’s Liturgy of the Hours:

Lord God,
you filled Saint Barnabas with faith and the Holy Spirit
and set him apart for the conversion of the nations.
Grant that the gospel of Christ,
which he preached so strenuously,
may, in our day, be faithfully proclaimed
by word and deed.
[We make our prayer] through our Lord Jesus Christ, your Son,
who lives and reigns with you in the unity of the Holy Spirit,
God for ever and ever.
Amen.

Beautiful prayer – thanks for posting it!

StAnastasia

 

[Chaldean_Rite]

You’re threatened by Maureen Tilly, right? You’re threatened because she is a woman who dared to earn a doctorate, rather than staying barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen and bearing dozens of babies. Do you think Bishop McGrath should excommunicate her? Do you think he himself should be censured for welcoming her, rather than excommunicating a woman who has an original thought of her own? Work with me – I’m trying to discern the parameters of your anti-female, anti-intellectual thinking here.

There will never be a greater vocation for women then the model of the Blessed Virgin: Motherhood. Your statements minimize it. You’re Phd won’t make you a saint, being fruitful at least has a chance to do so.