Vatican calls Muhammad cartoon "blasphemous"

[CHESTERTONRULES]

This can be interpreted to fit Muslim beliefs. For example:

Jesus forgives sins, he believes Jesus said it metaphorically, while its literal meaning is not intended, thus Jesus forgiving of sins is not done directly, but since Jesus has a good relationship with God, Jesus can ask God forgive people sins, and it will be forgiven. Thus there is no different in asking Jesus to forgive you or God to forgive, you will be forgiven.

When Jesus said, I and my father are one, it is again metaphorical, if you read the verses the follows, Jesus clearly called all people god, and thus one with the father. Everyone is connected to God, is not the Word in every soul (Refer to the beginning of John), did not God blow into man His spirit (this is also in the Quran). Prophets become connected to God through Wahy and non-Prophets become connected to God through ilham.

He believes he is following Jesus when Jesus said to follow the Comforter, he believes the comforter is Muhammad Ibn Abdullah.

Muslims just don’t agree with Christian dogma.

It seems to me that no matter what religion you follow, there will always be some contradictions between the said scripture and the actual dogma or belief systems. It is always said, it is because you did understand that verse properly.

This is just an elaborate explanation of my point, which is that he denies the words of Jesus.

 

[TruthBearer]

Which is impossible to conclude based on the documents available.

Sure, it’s possible to re-interpret every passage of Scripture (Thomas’s “My Lord and my God”) and also claim the other part is corruption (Jesus dead on the cross, buried 3 days resurrected). But it just doesn’t make sense to me.

Then the Muslim has to fight with other ‘corruptions’ like

“who divorces his wife, except on the ground of sexual immorality, makes her commit adultery” - Matt 5:32

Which Muslims don’t accept, as their Qur’an permits marriage and divorce for other reasons. Or how about

Matt 5:34I say to you, Do not take an oath at all, either by heaven, for it is the throne of God,

35 or by the earth, for it is his footstool, or by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King.

36 And do not take an oath by your head, for you cannot make one hair white or black.

37 Let what you say be simply ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything more than this comes from evil.

And yet, not only does Allah take oaths on everything under the sun; but Muslims are given instructions on oath taking.

The problem with using the Bible as a Muslim to prove any position is that the entire Bible is ‘corrupt’ except when it’s taken out of context to ‘prove’ an Islamic position.

There’s no sense arguing that Islam is proved from the Scriptures; it’s just plain stupid.

I am not going to spend alot of time, coming up with other possible explanation for verses that Christians and Muslims differ on. I only mentioned those, to show that is it possible to understand things in more than just one way.

 

[TruthBearer]

This is just an elaborate explanation of my point, which is that he denies the words of Jesus.

SO you didn’t understand my point.

 

[CHESTERTONRULES]

SO you didn’t understand my point.

He denies the words of Jesus. It is not a difference in interpretation.

I understand your point but it is wrong.

 

[TruthBearer]

Why you think the whole world must not do something just because Islam says no? sorry. Expecting people to live under rules of a religion they don’t believe is just childish. Those are the rules of your religion not mine. Asking me to obey the rules of a false religion according to my belief is not much sense. But I disagree with mocking Islam for no good reason because I think it is disrespectful to the people of islam muslims, but not because I accept your expectation that I do something just because it is said in your religion because I don’t care what your religion says. To me it is not truth like it is to you. Christianity is true!

what would jesus do?

 

[adrift]

what would jesus do?

What was the point of this question? What did Jesus do? Jesus taught and one of His teachings was to leave a living Church that is protected by the Holy Spirit.

 

[adrift]

If Islam is wrong so that there is no any true religion on the world.

I am sure that all the religions believe this if their religion isn’t true than there are no true religions. I believe that about the Catholic Church.

Because Islam is founded on unaltered revelation

.
This is your belief that is not possible to prove.

But Christianity is founded on fabricated revelation and emerged from mysteries and experiences of people.

Again this is your unfounded belief and borders on insult. Christianity is founded on following Jesus not on anything false but true.

They claim to God (Holy Spirit) lead them which is very weak assert. Because neither Holy Spirit is God nor God lead directly but through prophets.

You state this as fact which it is not it is just your personal belief which cannot be proved. That after all is what is faith.

So which religion is unfounded?

You say Jesus ascended into Heaven. Right. If Jesus was God so there should not be any boast to say that because God created Heavens. God get not into matter. But God create matter. God do not create matter and later settle into it. God is infinite and bound to non matter and time. I can count many contradictions.

This makes no sense. You limit God. God can do all things. You base this on your faith what you believe but not on truth.

So which religion is contradictory?

Which religion launched crusades and violences?

Why were there crusades? Muslims committed no violence and for that matter who are committing violence today. Who are cutting people heads off and throwing Christians into the water?

Which religion claim that "woman has no soul?

I don’t know of any religion who makes this claim. Do you have a source? I did see that Islam believes this but I don’t believe it is true.

Which religion gave woman all rights and proptect she from obscenity?

The Catholic Church. Women were not treated very well before Christianity. It was when people started to follow Jesus and the Christian Church began that the lot of woman improved. But which religion says that women can’t drive a car, can’t go to school and can be beaten by her husband who needs her husbands permission to divorce but he doesn’t need hers? Where women Lesser inheritance rights compared to men
and Lesser status as witnesses. I could go on but I think this demonstrates the point.

if Jesus were alive He would love Muslims very much.

Jesus is very much alive and does indeed love Muslims and wishes them to come to Him through the Catholic Church.

 

[adrift]

Christians differ on interpretations as well. Even with the Holy Spirit, Christians are divided.

Catholics trace their origins to Paul and Peter. Greek Orthodox trace their origins to Andrew. Coptic Orthodox trace their origins to Mark. Indian Orthodox trace their origins to Thomas. etc etc. Yet they are divided. And they don’t interpret everything the same, yet they claim to follow the same one Holy Spirit and Divine person.

Then you have all the protestant Christians as well, who indirectly have their origins with the Catholic church, (ie they broke away from the Catholic Church). Anglican, Lutheran, etc etc. All having the Holy Spirit and this one divine person they follow. And they don’t interpret the scriptures the same.

Etc etc.

So you don’t have a point.

Catholics trace their origin to Jesus as do the Eastern Church’s that you mention. The point he was making was we don’t base our faith on Scripture alone. A point which seemed to miss. Of course it is my view that they all don’t have the Holy Spirit.

 

[CHESTERTONRULES]

what would jesus do?

Throw the money changers out of the temple?

 

[TruthBearer]

Throw the money changers out of the temple?

Or say, he who has no sin cast the first stone???

 

[TruthBearer]

Catholics trace their origin to Jesus as do the Eastern Church’s that you mention. The point he was making was we don’t base our faith on Scripture alone. A point which seemed to miss. Of course it is my view that they all don’t have the Holy Spirit.

I didn’t miss that point.

How do you determine who has the Holy Spirit and who doesnt?

 

[Eddie_Mac]

I am not going to spend alot of time, coming up with other possible explanation for verses that Christians and Muslims differ on. I only mentioned those, to show that is it possible to understand things in more than just one way.

Possible to understand something in more than just one way?



The truth can only be understood one way, as the truth. Insisting that the truth can be understood in more than one way is relativism.

 

[adrift]

I didn’t miss that point.

How do you determine who has the Holy Spirit and who doesnt?

Of course that is a matter of faith. Warren Carroll converted to the Catholic Faith because of the history of the Catholic Church. It impressed Him that through out the long history it never succumbed to heresy despite the attack of the many heresies.
Now I believe I know what you will say here. Who decided what heresy was? The Church of course guided by the Holy Spirit. Again I will say it is a matter of faith.

 

[Rohzek]

Criticism: “personally, I fail to logically and reasonably see how Muhammad could be a prophet”

Insult: “Muhammad is a voice of Satan”

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I don’t see the difference. Could you provide actual definitions please? Cannot one logically and reasonably arrive at the conclusion that Muhammad was the voice of Satan? I am not trying to insinuate an insult here, but rather asserting that it seems to me that your implied distinguishment between the two examples is superficial or meaningless. So again, I ask that you please provide concrete definitions rather than only examples.

Painting prophet Muhammed is banned in Islam! Is that not enough clear? And if you reject Muhammed you should do that by evidences but not through insulting.

This statement is nonsensical and doesn’t even begin to answer my initial question.

 

[ProdigalSun]

I understand that the Vatican wants us to act more ‘lovingly’ towards Islam, but why call a cartoon of a false prophet “Blasphemous”?

It’s not blasphemous; it’s Islam.

For hundreds of years Muhammad has been depicted in a not exactly pleasant light, many paintings referring to Dante’s inferno showing Muhammad in Hell.

Also, in the past Popes and Theologians have criticized Muhammad and Islam as evil, without hesitation. What has changed that the Vatican sees Muhammad depictions as blasphemous?

religionnews.com/2015/05/06/vatican-blasts-muhammad-cartoons-pouring-gasoline-fire/

So a “Semiofficial” newspaper is now the Vatican… good grief:shrug:

 

[graciew]

I love all prophets.

Jesus is alive but we do not know if He is on the world!

Thanks.
I really did not know you also believe He is alive.

 

[CHESTERTONRULES]

Or say, he who has no sin cast the first stone???

The first stone was cast centuries ago by Mohammed.

 

[Servant19]

The first stone was cast centuries ago by Mohammed.

What is the evidence for this please??

.

 

[TruthBearer]

Possible to understand something in more than just one way?



The truth can only be understood one way, as the truth. Insisting that the truth can be understood in more than one way is relativism.

That is my view of religion (islam, christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism etc), they are relative truth, with aspects of absolute truths or universal truths.

 

[Eddie_Mac]

That is my view of religion (islam, christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism etc), they are relative truth, with aspects of absolute truths or universal truths.

Then nothing is true.