Was Muhammad a Prophet of the Judeo-Christian God ?

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Kaninchen said:
For a start, understanding religions on their own terms might help.
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In which case we have a world forever fighting.

At some point we have to go back and see what was “revealed”, not how the Revelation was “interpreted” over time.

Unfortunately interpretations by “groups of men” has too often led to oppression and strife historically. I care about those sorts of fruitless outcomes.

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Servant19 said:
In which case we have a world forever fighting.

At some point we have to go back and see what was “revealed”, not how the Revelation was “interpreted” over time.

Unfortunately interpretations by “groups of men” has too often led to oppression and strife historically. I care about those sorts of fruitless outcomes.

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Well, the thing is that, from a Jewish perspective, this is all ‘same old, same old’ - Christians, Muslims, Baha’is: “believe like us and universal wonderfulness will follow.”

Not a great track record, though.
 
Kaninchen said:
Well, the thing is that, from a Jewish perspective, this is all ‘same old, same old’ - Christians, Muslims, Baha’is: “believe like us and universal wonderfulness will follow.”

Not a great track record, though.
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I must admit I do have a supreme soft spot for a lot of the things my Rabbi friends in Australia say as an expression of their beliefs. A big, big soft spot 🙂

However, universal wonderfullness is a possibility for Judaism, but how do you eliminate all the divisions within it?

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Servant19 said:
I must admit I do have a supreme soft spot for a lot of the things my Rabbi friends in Australia say as an expression of their beliefs. A big, big soft spot 🙂

However, universal wonderfullness is a possibility for Judaism, but how do you eliminate all the divisions within it?

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What divides Jews, Servant19?
 
Kaninchen said:
You do realise that you’re just doing what the Baha’i posters are doing to you, don’t you? 😃
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The similarity is formal and superficial, not substantial.

Unfortunately, the Baha’i posters traffic in vague and obscurantist similarities which is why they keep insisting all religions are the same and can be reconciled. Provided you don’t look too deep, and keep things vague and obscure, I suppose.
 
Servant19 said:
I must admit I do have a supreme soft spot for a lot of the things my Rabbi friends in Australia say as an expression of their beliefs. A big, big soft spot 🙂

However, universal wonderfullness is a possibility for Judaism, but how do you eliminate all the divisions within it?

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I have to admit a soft spot for Jewish rabbis, as well. AND an even bigger one for Jewish grandmothers and grandfathers.

However, I tend to get cavities very easily, so I don’t have much tolerance for the promotion of sugary sweetness in the form of “universal wonderfullness.”

How do you account, say, for all the divisions within the animal kingdom? I suppose divisions help to define and delineate differences. That, in itself, is not a bad thing. Although, it might be for those who think they belong to one group when, in reality they are part of a different one.

If God, I suppose, were all for “universal wonderfullness” he could have made all of creation with no divisions or distinctions, with universal sameness abounding. He didn’t, though, did he?
 
Servant19 said:
Wasn’t there recently a push to disenfranchise non-orthodox Jews?

Isn’t there repeated trouble between orthodox and reform Jews?

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Those are not answers, Servant19. They’re avoiding answers by asking questions.

There are answers hidden in your questions though, if you think about it.
 
Peter_Plato said:
The similarity is formal and superficial, not substantial.

Unfortunately, the Baha’i posters traffic in vague and obscurantist similarities which is why they keep insisting all religions are the same and can be reconciled. Provided you don’t look too deep, and keep things vague and obscure, I suppose.
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It is in fact the incredibly deep depths that unites religions.

The superficial and worldly interpretations made by men is what has divided religions. Claiming things like Holy Tradition as sacred and infallibility bestowed upon men is what has caused divisions between religions. The problem is not with the Scriptural origins of religions themselves.

There is the claim that there is “twisting” of meaning and interpretation to introduce unity, but it is easy to say this when there is plenty of “twisting” of meaning and interpretation to introduce disunity and superiority.

The reality is that God has not just spoken to a small population of Israelis at a few points throughout history. Reconciling this fact is what faces those who claim exclusivity over God.
 
Servant19 said:
Wasn’t there recently a push to disenfranchise non-orthodox Jews?

Isn’t there repeated trouble between orthodox and reform Jews?

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Beware of wolves masquerading as sheep.

Why are you taking such pains to harp on divisions when you are supposed to be promoting “universal wonderfullness” and the message that we are all the same? Suddenly, you want to make distinctions?

What business is it of yours, this “trouble” between orthodox and reform Jews? Let them work it out.

Or are you looking for some bones? That wouldn’t make you a predator, then but a…

…never mind. We won’t go there.
 
Kaninchen said:
Those are not answers, Servant19. They’re avoiding answers by asking questions.

There are answers hidden in your questions though, if you think about it.
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Of course dear Kaninchen.

The answer is that Judaism has no answer to how to unite the world into “universal wonderfullness” without everyone becoming Jews, and Orthodox Jews at that.

That is my answer to your question 🙂

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Servant19 said:
The reality is that God has not just spoken to a small population of Israelis at a few points throughout history. Reconciling this fact is what faces those who claim exclusivity over God.
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Judaism doesn’t claim exclusivity over God, it claims to have a specific ‘contract’ with God. What arrangements God makes with others is entirely up to God.
 
Servant19 said:
Of course dear Kaninchen.

The answer is that Judaism has no answer to how to unite the world into “universal wonderfullness” without everyone becoming Jews, and Orthodox Jews at that.

That is my answer to your question 🙂

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Nope, you haven’t got a clue, Servant19.
 
Kaninchen said:
Judaism doesn’t claim exclusivity over God, it claims to have a specific ‘contract’ with God. What arrangements God makes with others is entirely up to God.
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That was more a statement towards modern Christianity. 🙂

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I think that the reply given by Jeffrey Erwin is so good and kind to accept, becasue our only God, True. living and lovely God has promised both the sons of Abraham namely, Issac-thro Jacob later and Ishmael the son of Abraham and Hagar. To Hagar it is told " Get up, pick the boy (Ishmael) up and hold him safely, for I will make him into a great nation." This nation is now formed under one religion Islam. So it may be true that both religion are worshiping the one same and one God.
 
This topic is incendiary anyway, so let’s stick with the question in the OP.
 
fjoseraj said:
I think that the reply given by Jeffrey Erwin is so good and kind to accept, becasue our only God, True. living and lovely God has promised both the sons of Abraham namely, Issac-thro Jacob later and Ishmael the son of Abraham and Hagar. To Hagar it is told " Get up, pick the boy (Ishmael) up and hold him safely, for I will make him into a great nation." This nation is now formed under one religion Islam. So it may be true that both religion are worshiping the one same and one God.
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What a wonderful and spiritually uplifting insight!!

God bless you 🙂

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Kaninchen said:
Which we weren’t talking about.

By the way, look up ‘covenant with the sons of Noah’.
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Which is why it was a response to Peter Plato and not you dear sister 😉

Tell me about sons of Noah. Your understanding please 🙂

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