What do you admire about islam/muslims?

[ralphinal]

As can be seen in Exodus 40:30&31, the Lord commanded Moses (pbuh) to do external washing before doing spiritual washing when praying.

Since it was commanded to Moses (pbuh) and Jesus (pbuh) himself did this, then why don’t Christians consider ablution before prayer to be an admirable act?

Because Jesus explains that it is what is INSIDE a man that makes him impure, not outside. Sin comes from your thoughts and desires, not the dirt on your feet.

Basically, God allowed common sense to enter into our faith

 

[algebra]

i do understand hambas point though.

There is much to admire in muslims that they want to appear their best physically and spiritually before approaching our Lord.

I personally think this is a custom that Christians could adopt.

I am not suggesting that wudu be mandatory as it is for muslims.
But certainly things like washing ones self is a positive thing, and something to be admired.

 

[ralphinal]

i do understand hambas point though.

There is much to admire in muslims that they want to appear their best physically and spiritually before approaching our Lord.

I personally think this is a custom that Christians could adopt.

I am not suggesting that wudu be mandatory as it is for muslims.
But certainly things like washing ones self is a positive thing, and something to be admired.

In America at least, most people shower or take a bath at least once a day. By and large, American Christians dress well for church. Honestly, the comparison is worthless to us. We are probably physically cleaner than most nations on earth. Most of the roads are paved, most of us never touch dirt/mud. Sewer lines are far from water, and we have extensive water treatment.

However, how does cleaning the outside make you clean on the inside? It does not.

I do agree that the devotion to these kinds of things is commendable. I will not comend those who do it under penulty of punishment. Those who are forced to pray are not really praying.

 

[algebra]

I do agree that the devotion to these kinds of things is commendable. I will not comend those who do it under penulty of punishment. Those who are forced to pray are not really praying.

Muslims do not pray under penalty of punishment anymore or less than Catholics do.

We too have days of obligation, and not attending Mass on these days is a sin.

 

[katy_kt]

Something along the lines of wudu is unnecessary, but to me at least people should be watchful about their clothing as Muslims are. They are required to cover up during their prayers. We don’t need to cover up as much as they do, but at least people should try to dress up nicely when they go to church. I am not asking for a suit and dress requirement, but if you know you are going to church dress modestly and avoid shorts, mini-shirts and t-shirts with inappropriate lines on it.

 

[Charlotte2008]

Prior to making formal prayer, Jesus (pbuh) used to wash his limbs according to the teachings of the Torah. Moses and Aaron (pbut) are recorded as doing the same in Exodus 40:30&31

“30 And he set the laver between the tent of meeting and the altar, and put water in it for washing,
31with which Moses and Aaron and his sons washed their hands and their feet… as the Lord commanded Moses.”

In the Qur’an, Chapter al-Maa’idah, (5):6, ablution for prayer is prescribed as follows:

“O you who believe, when you intend to pray, wash your faces and fore-arms up to the elbows, wipe your heads and wash your feet up to the ankles …”

And so you see, Muslims “baptise” themselves 5 times a day before their prayers.

Don’t Christians consider this to be an admirable trait?

In those days they did not have things like baths and showers. Basically you are cleaning most of your body. Surely it makes better sense to clean your whole body. For that reason I believe it is exhibitionist. Most Christians probably take showers/baths before going to Church so how are Muslims better in this regard considering the rest of your body is dirty? “Admirable trait”? No.

 

[Charlotte2008]

It was probably me who said Muslims are dangerous (cannot remember but stand by that if it was). Do you realise that if they are called to arms for Allah they will fight against you? Yes they will.

Please watch these sites:-
vicmord.com/ (why does he get death threats if not speaking the truth?)
shoebat.com/ (ditto the above)
apostatesofislam.com/

This girl is married to a Muslim - read about her life faithfreedom.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=52374

Go on Yahoo Answers some time and see how many are posting questions on how they want to die for Allah in Gaza etc because they hate the west!

Here are some testimonies from people leaving Islam - you should read them. It will give you further insight into the islamic mentality which incidentally is completely contrary to western values.

faithfreedom.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=30

They all also believe you will go to Hell for being a non-believer (even your friends). My ex who said he loved me daily said “We will see on judgment day who goes to Hell”. Nice! So, next time you are with your muslim friends that is what they think about you.

 

[Reuben_J]

In the Qur’an, Chapter al-Maa’idah, (5):6, ablution for prayer is prescribed as follows:

“O you who believe, when you intend to pray, wash your faces and fore-arms up to the elbows, wipe your heads and wash your feet up to the ankles …”

And so you see, Muslims “baptise” themselves 5 times a day before their prayers.

It’s rather a stupid thing to do if it is for the sake of doing it especially if you are already fresh and clean after a thorough shower / bath and cleansing.

BTW folks, this guys is talking about “baptizing” every one or two hours or so. Plain stupid I should say, not that I have anything against personal hygiene and cleanliness. I’d rather emphasize more on the right heart/attitude before prayer not some ritual cleansing which does not clean your heart. You can be clean on the outside but filthy on the inside. Jesus has the words for these people - woe, you, who are hypocites. …

 

[hamba2han]

Read carefully these verses of Exodus 40:30&31

“30 And he set the laver between the tent of meeting and the altar, and put water in it for washing,
31 with which Moses and Aaron and his sons washed their hands and their feet… as the Lord commanded Moses.”

Did the Lord command Moses (pbuh) to take a bath before praying?

No, the command according to the Bible is to wash the hands and feet.

BTW, in Islam, being in a state of major impurity like after having sex does indeed require bathing before prayer can be performed.

And many scholars are of the view that that this mandatatory bath i.e. ghusl negates the need for performing ablution i.e. wudu before prayer… provided that one does not then break his or her wudu before the prayer.

 

[Charlotte2008]

Read carefully these verses of Exodus 40:30&31

“30 And he set the laver between the tent of meeting and the altar, and put water in it for washing,
31 with which Moses and Aaron and his sons washed their hands and their feet… as the Lord commanded Moses.”

Did the Lord command Moses (pbuh) to take a bath before praying?

No, the command according to the Bible is to wash the hands and feet.

BTW, in Islam, being in a state of major impurity like after having sex does indeed require bathing before prayer can be performed.

And many scholars are of the view that that this mandatatory bath i.e. ghusl negates the need for performing ablution i.e. wudu before prayer… provided that one does not then break his wudu before the prayer.

Yes, but as I said before they did not have modern washing facilities all those hundreds of years ago. These days we do so hence you should take a full shower instead of being partly dirty. How about leading your life as you wish instead of listening to scholars etc. They won’t be there on judgment day - only you will and you will be judged on your life not theirs. What would you say when he asked you why you followed the false prophet you were warned about? You have been told that by Christians so cannot say you did not know. God loves you btw. The truth will set you free.

 

[ralphinal]

Muslims do not pray under penalty of punishment anymore or less than Catholics do.

We too have days of obligation, and not attending Mass on these days is a sin.

I cannot think of a place on earth where a Catholic “police” force forces complience with any laws. That is not true all over the Muslim world. There are places where you can be punished for not being “Muslim” enough

 

[algebra]

There are places where you can be punished for not being “Muslim” enough

True.

However my time with islam has shown me that those places do not represent true islam.

True islam is a system that attempts to implement justice and morality.

It attempts to bring peace and prosperity to everyone (including non-muslims) living under it.

There are 2 problems with this utopic islamic state.

1. like communism its impossible to implement, because its successful implementation rests on having good leadership.
2. Its a manmade system, so it is flawed, and even though its goals are lofty there will never be a successful islamic state.

 

[hamba2han]

… How about leading your life as you wish instead of listening to scholars etc…

We should lead our lives according to what the Lord has commanded us as written in the scriptures instead of merely listening to and then following our heart’s desires … and BTW, ‘heart’s desires’ is very often synonymous with ‘Satan’s whisperings’.

The fact that Christians are so very reluctant to prostrate when praying to the Lord is really so indicative of them listening to and then happily following their “heart’s desires” to kneel and clasp their hands instead of falling on their faces in prayer like how the Biblical Prophets prayed (peace be upon them all).

 

[Charlotte2008]

We should lead our lives according to what the Lord has commanded us as written in the scriptures instead of merely listening to and then following our heart’s desires … and BTW, ‘heart’s desires’ is very often synonymous with ‘Satan’s whisperings’.

The fact that Christians are so very reluctant to prostrate when praying to the Lord is really so indicative of them listening to and then happily following their “heart’s desires” to kneel and clasp their hands instead of falling on their faces in prayer like how the Biblical Prophets prayed (peace be upon them all).

You are avoiding my question and are changing the subject. Why do you not question your religion instead of just blindly believing the utterings of scholars etc? Please re-read my posting ( No.214) and answer the question. Thank you.

 

[Baloo]

I don’t admire anything about Islams, sorry. Some of their practices are really bizarre and plain wrong, and they warped a lot of different teachings. The one that really throws me for a loop is that Abraham built statues to pagan gods in mecca. That doesn’t make any sense to me.

 

[Verisimilitude]

True.

However my time with islam has shown me that those places do not represent true islam.

True islam is a system that attempts to implement justice and morality.

Define Islamic justice. For the Moslem it is embodied by Mohammed who would cut the hand off of his own daughter if she were caught stealing, it is stoning men and women that commit adultary, and waging offensive war against the non-Moslem for being non-Moslem.

Define Islamic morailty. For the Moslem it is embodied by Mohammed who married a 6 year old girl consumating the deed when she was 9 years old, marrying his adopted sons wife, assassinating those who mocked him, and showing contempt for the non-Moslem dhimmi.

True Islam is the life of Mohammed.

 

[Appleby]

No. The point Appleby made was that all Muslims are dangerous. That is an idiotic statement, having been the subject of such statements I can tell you that they are wrong. You cannot say that all people of a certain culture are dangerous. I responded to that post.

I stand by my statement: Thinking like that is dangerous, applying attributes to all the members of a certain religion or race is wrong, simple as.

No, the point Appleby made is that I THINK Muslims are dangerous.

And I certainly CAN say that I THINK Muslims are dangerous – in fact, I have now said it twice.

Thinking is not dangerous. Knee-jerking along with the Popular Crowd lest you be beheaded, stabbed to death or otherwise disposed of by the angry Muslims while the 5,000 of them stand in downtown Toronto shouting DEATH TO AMERICA! waving Hamas and Hezbollah flags (with our NDP politicians shouting right along with them, as well as those who are afraid to speak up against them) is dangerous. It is, as Winston Churchill suggested, feeding your friends to the crocodile in hopes that he will eat you last.

You come and stand across the street defending Israel with 200 brave souls – separated by policemen on horseback from 5,000 people screaming for your death and waving flags of organizations outlawed in Canada as terrorists – and see for yourself which side is dangerous: the ones who want to kill us, or the ones who tremblingly hide under their beds and pretend nothing is going on downtown.

 

[rikkk1958]

I am not muslim, married to a muslim.

I am to be baptised this coming Easter.

In my time I have come to love Islam deeply.

What about islam/muslims do you admire so much?

I love the commitment of muslims to their faith.

It is rare to find this commitment amongst christians and even more rare amongst jews.

My position is completely different than yours when it comes to faith. For the commitment, it may be generally true in your observation that Muslims are seen to be more committed but you have to look closely how and why is it so. What you have chosen is based on reaction and interaction of yourself with people whom you think influences your mind so that you can become what you think is the rightful way of living in this created world of God.

My position is about whom we should trust our souls. The difference between Christians and Muslims is how they were brought up, and of course the true words of God. Faith of course came from knowledge our parents or teachers gave us, for muslims it was rigid, and its adherence are strict because of what is taught by its founder. Muhammed and his followers. For Christians, we are taught with the knowledge about God, with the Bible, its prophesies, and of course the great miracles that showed God’s power and Glory. We are given more of freedom to obey rather than full submission.

Full submission is a the best way to follow God however, although this is God’s original plan, Man disobeyed and knowledge sets in with Adam and Eve and therefore God treated this beginning to be what it is (although He must have known that it is going to happen) and let man have the freedom to think and choose. With the devil on the other side, men are vulnerable to sin but God showed His Power and Glory through His chosen people. The story in the Old Testament just proves that with countless wars, and then forgiveness, but with prophesies that comes true.

The story also suggests progression of man’s knowledge especially about God because our intellect also evolved and advances. God wanted to stop all those tests when He decided to show His true feeling to His creation. This is about how He would send His own self into the world through the Holy Spirit, conceived by the flesh (Virgin Mary) so that the Son, who is called the Son of Man, and with Holy Spirit that is God’s would prove to his creation how He truly loves them. To suffer, so to feel the pain a human would feel, and to die for them to prove how much He love them, to be sacrificed, in order to ransom us, but to prove also that by dying He conquered death by His resurrection, promising those who wants to follow and obey Him will have eternal life

Now, the Islamic phenomena came by way of Muhammed 600 years after Jesus’ death. A religion He wanted to teach to his people. But where did he get his knowledge? Obviously you know the answer. So ask yourself why would he wanted the people of the book slaughtered if he thought that the Book is for guiding you the truth? Why would reveal a message so contradicting to the Book?. Why would a prophet could lead a life full of sin and make laws that are way out of bounds by human standards? Even his encounter with an angel is not credible because we know that the angel he referred to was an angel of restraint not physical restraint like how he described being squeezed tightly. The angel described in the Bible is harmless and communicated with his subject in the tone of an angel.

Now would you live a life believing because your criteria for faith is about the way you live and how you are restrained because Muhammed said so? Or, would you rather live because of how you know the truth about God? For the truth were set before us and the truth can set you free not bondage to the treats of one man’s law. It is you who decides your destiny with God, not your wife or your Muslim friends. It about you and God alone.

 

[algebra]

You come and stand across the street defending Israel with 200 brave souls –

Defending israel?

Dont bring up something you have no knowledge about!

Have you been to Israel? Have you been to the west bank and gaza?

Its people like you, who dont know jack about the situation that just seem stupid.

The same goes for the arabs living in Toronto, they are idiots.

Most of them have never been to gaza.

I have.

I dont support anyone in this, I was born to a jewess, and I am sick of what goes on there.

What are you supporting? Do you even know what you are supporting?
**
Please remember, you have no business supporting something you do not understand.**

Dont go downtown, dont tell people you support israel, you are a joke.

Most jews who perform aliyah want to run away from the nonsense in 15 minutes.

And I assure you; you do not understand the situation.
**
Let me also assure you that zionists (yes the same ones you support) would be happier than the happiest muslim terrorist to bomb every church into rubble, slander Jesus , call Mary a whore and wipe you fakers (christians) of the face of the planet.

You are lucky you are dealing with a billion muslims, and not a billion zionists.

Aside from the fact that jews are generally smarter than goyim definitely way smarter than the arabs, we are way more militant.

It would be bye bye goys.

Way to go buddy…**

 

[LDNCatholic]

You come and stand across the street defending Israel with 200 brave souls – separated by policemen on horseback from 5,000 people screaming for your death and waving flags of organizations outlawed in Canada as terrorists – and see for yourself which side is dangerous: the ones who want to kill us, or the ones who tremblingly hide under their beds and pretend nothing is going on downtown.

If you are attempting to get a knee jerk reaction out of me by insulting me, calling me a coward, and attempting to appeal to my sense of pride, its not going to work.I’m not going to boast, all you need know is that I’ve done more than wave a placard about while being defended by policemen.