What draws you to the Eastern Church?

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The Great Fast - is this not akin to the Black Fast? When one does this do they abstain from all animal products and only eat after 1700 hrs? I know that serveral have tried to explain this, but sometimes there are different remarks.

What is the Great Fast? Is it observed during Advent?
The Great Fast is Lent. Advent, in the East, is often called the “Winter Lent” or the “Lesser Fast.”

Fasting rules in the Byzantine tradition include abstaining from all animal products, abstaining from wine, abstaining from fish, and abstaining from olive oil. I believe it is also expected that you will not eat before noon.

This being said, that is the ideal for fasting. The Byzantine tradition recognizes that not everyone has the spiritual or physical strength to follow such a strict fast. So while we hope to achieve the ideal, we often have to work our way up to that.
 
Funny story about the rules for fasting. As you may have noted above, wine is prohibited. A friend of mine simply switched to drinking a beer or two every now and then during the Great Fast as beer is not strictly prohibited. This year I may be tempted to switch from using olive oil to using coconut oil (in my family we use olive oil like most Americans use butter). 😛
 
Great Lent is the fast before Pascha (Easter)

There is also a 40 day non-obligatory fast before the Nativity (Christmas), referred to as St. Phillip’s Fast (starts with his feast day)

There are also two minor traditional fasting periods before the Feasts of Sts. Peter and Paul (June 29, a holyday of obligation for us vs. a “Solemnity”) and before the Dormition of the Theotokos (August 15)

Yes, we refer to Mary most properly as the Mother of God or Theotokos (Greek for “God-bearer”)
 
Great Lent is the fast before Pascha (Easter)

There is also a 40 day non-obligatory fast before the Nativity (Christmas), referred to as St. Phillip’s Fast (starts with his feast day)

There are also two minor traditional fasting periods before the Feasts of Sts. Peter and Paul (June 29, a holyday of obligation for us vs. a “Solemnity”) and before the Dormition of the Theotokos (August 15)

Yes, we refer to Mary most properly as the Mother of God or Theotokos (Greek for “God-bearer”)
👍 Thank you for making that clearer than I did. 😃
 
Okay thanks so much for the answers.

I can understand why Eastern Cathlics would abstain from animal products, but what is the significance of abstaining from olive oil? I use that all the time. <the only oil I use, I am allergic to coconut oil>

Then I pretty much observe the rules of the Great Fast on Fridays and during Lent already, WOW, How cool is this??? I fudge a bit when I have hardboiled eggs. How else can you get protien if you do not eat animal products? I am sure butter is out too right?

I wonder how much I do that is actually Eastern and I don’t know about? 😃

God Bless,
Anathama Sit
 
As far as what draws me to Eastern Christianity itself, it’s tough to say. It’s not really one thing, but an entire atmosphere. I think I like the emphasis experiential knowledge of the Faith over intellectual knowledge.
Very well put, dear brother! 👍👍👍

And although we’ve posted together occasionally before, gettiing to know you a bit beforehand, I too enjoyed reading the more complete version of your faith journey here - thanks for sharing!
 
Very well put, dear brother! 👍👍👍

And although we’ve posted together occasionally before, gettiing to know you a bit beforehand, I too enjoyed reading the more complete version of your faith journey here - thanks for sharing!
Awww, shucks! 😊
 
I can understand why Eastern Cathlics would abstain from animal products, but what is the significance of abstaining from olive oil? I use that all the time. <the only oil I use, I am allergic to coconut oil>
Fasting rules and custom vary somewhat between particular churches, but in general, the more that is given up, the more Orthodox the custom.

And I do mean that as a compliment to my EC brothers and sisters who follow paths that are more Orthodox than current Ruthenian practice (which excludes meat, cheese and dairy products). There are those like myself who try to stick to a more Orthodox fast voluntarily.
 
Greetings to the Eastern Catholicism Forum,

I just wanted to say that I am starting out to embark upon learning about the Eastern Churches and am excited to do so. I have a wonderful friend who is answering all of my basic questions and any other questions.

I wanted to let you guys know, that I wanted to start reading a bit more in this forum, and I may be asking questions that you guys might seem to know that they are basic and all, but it is going to be done out of sincerity and a desire to learn.

Now the first question I would like to ask is this. If you are a member of the Easter Churches, those in communion with Rome, or even the Orthodox, what draws you to that particular Church? Can you share with me some of the beauty and the things that mean the most to you in your traditions?

NOTE: I wish for this thread to be sharing of experiences and not a debating thread. I am not interested in learning who is right or wrong, or who’s way is better. I want to find out what’s common between the two Traditions and to learn more about my brothers and sisters in the Eastern Church.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
For me I see it as catholic. I find the universal nature and catholic church to be boundless and capable of addressing all people and spiritual needs and growth. Attending the Byzantine, Antochian, alexandrian, armenian, assyrian traditions allows me to see the view of the kingdom from the other side of the river.

First its harder for me to attend. What i mean is I have to pay more attention and I can’t just follow along without thinking. As such I work harder and get more out of church. The differences and similarities let me ask the basic endless question for faith to blossom, why? I learn not just from the differences but also the similarities. When attending an ecc I still attend rcc. So I tend to look more carefully at a rcc, the liturgy, and mass with a more discerning eye and then I realize there are even more similarities I never realized.

Second, because I attend both I get to more fully embrace theology that is expressed differently but has uncontradictory, even complimentary meaning. Ecc seems even more profoundly different impart because of Vatican II. But there in we see the blessings of Vatican II and what we left behind. I can say I more fully appreciate the dogmas of Mary. I even view the hail Mary with a more offline understanding of the churche’s complete view. I get to view my faith more explicity.

Ecc also let’s me see how to improve my own experience in an rcc. For example, my daughter loves ecc because the adults talk to her. So now I find my self in rcc more willing to talk to children (in frontof theirmparents). The key here is to engage them. Another thing, in an ecc, kids do not leave, so I am much more accepting now in rcc when I hear a baby cry. I even welcome it. In an ecc because the parish is small, I realize more than ever how important congregating is to furthering our spiritual and community growth.

Ecc also let’s me feel more open about what I do in church and rather put more emphasis into how I pray and focus and put effort into,those things. In other it’s not the kneeling or the exact prayer words, but the fAith and love and hope and belief behindmthose words.

I suppose I could have grown spiritually without going into a ecc, but, for me I needed that comparison and contrast and change in environment of expression and liturgy to confront and push my own spiritual growth.
 
Okay thanks so much for the answers.

I can understand why Eastern Cathlics would abstain from animal products, but what is the significance of abstaining from olive oil? I use that all the time. <the only oil I use, I am allergic to coconut oil>

Then I pretty much observe the rules of the Great Fast on Fridays and during Lent already, WOW, How cool is this??? I fudge a bit when I have hardboiled eggs. How else can you get protien if you do not eat animal products? I am sure butter is out too right?

I wonder how much I do that is actually Eastern and I don’t know about? 😃

God Bless,
Anathama Sit
My guess is that olive oil was prohibited because of how it was used at the time in the culture within which the Byzantine tradition developed. Olive oil was/is highly used in the areas around Greece, the Middle East, etc. They use olive oil like we use butter.

For many modern Westerners who live the Byzantine tradition, they question the significance of abstaining from olive oil, since it is rarely used anyhow. I’ve heard some say that the fasting rules should be revised. 🤷 I usually try to abstain from it anyhow simply because my family uses it all the time (my wife comes from a VERY Italian family) - we almost never use butter; I think I buy butter once a year.
 
Fasting rules and custom vary somewhat between particular churches, but in general, the more that is given up, the more Orthodox the custom.

And I do mean that as a compliment to my EC brothers and sisters who follow paths that are more Orthodox than currp3w2muthenian practice (which excludes meat, cheese and dairy products). There are those like myself who try to stick to a more Orthodox fast voluntarily.
Orthodox meaning the more corrpct way??? I don’t think you are using it to refer to the Orthodox Church right?
 
Greetings Couponfit,

Thank you for sharing with me what drew you to the Eastern Church? There is something that draws me to as well, but I don’t know what it is.

When I get my other computer out of the shop, I will post more in length about why I drawn to learn more about my Eastern brothers and sisters.

I like how you said that you learn from looking at the similarities and not just the differences. This is how I am best trying to learn about the Eastern Churches myself, I feel if I focus on the differences I will lose so much, but if I can start out with our similarities I will gain much. There is much wisdom in what you said.

Ahhh yes the differences in Western and Eastern theology another question for another time.

God Bless,
Anathama Sit
 
With respect to your LOTH inquiry, I have attached a file currently being distributed on a free trial basis by Eastern Christian Publications.

This is representative of the daily cycle of prayer corresponding to LOTH. We would refer to it as the Daily Office.

WARNING: Do not attempt to pray the Byzantine Daily Office in its entirety unless you can devote most of your day to prayer! 😉

Seriously, I do hope you enjoy this!
 
No, capital “O” meaning more like the Orthodox churches (original customs)
Oh okay. I am just not used to seeing Orthodox capitalized unless it referred to the Orthodox Church. Wow, this can all be very confusing at times. Good thing I have you and some of the others to help me through all of this.

Now I know that Orthodox means correct belief or practice. Might we come up with another word that we can use for this definition, so I won’t get confused. 😃
 
Greetings ByzCathCantor,

Thanks for the attached file. I looked through it and see why you gave the warning. I am accustomed to praying the LOTH offices all of them. Perhaps for today, I can try to pray the Daily Office. It will be interesting to do a side by side comparison.

If I was interested in getting the books, where would I need to go? I am assuming you can find these on Amazon?

Are you guys on a Three year cycle like the Western Church for Sundays? Do we have the same readings in Mass?

God Bless,
Anathama Sit
 
Oh okay. I am just not used to seeing Orthodox capitalized unless it referred to the Orthodox Church. Wow, this can all be very confusing at times. Good thing I have you and some of the others to help me through all of this.

Now I know that Orthodox means correct belief or practice. Might we come up with another word that we can use for this definition, so I won’t get confused. 😃
No worries! We do tend to use some “shorthand” in this sub-forum. Orthodox alone can mean people of the Orthodox faith and churches or their customs and tradition.

EC = Eastern Catholic
EO = Eastern Orthodox

And if we are speaking of something that both Eastern Catholics and Orthodox hold in common, we will typically apply the term “Eastern Christian”
 
With respect to your LOTH inquiry, I have attached a file currently being distributed on a free trial basis by Eastern Christian Publications.

This is representative of the daily cycle of prayer corresponding to LOTH. We would refer to it as the Daily Office.

WARNING: Do not attempt to pray the Byzantine Daily Office in its entirety unless you can devote most of your day to prayer! 😉

Seriously, I do hope you enjoy this!
Incidentally one can also pray the hours provided by ECP by simply purchasing the “Publican’s Prayer Book” for Morning and Evening Prayer, and the “Horologion” for the 1st, 3rd, 6th, and 9th Hours. Both books are published by Sophia Press of the Melkite Eparchy of Newton.

I understand there are plans for charging a fee for the PDF file from ECP. At the price I’ve seen quoted on the byzcath forums, one could purchase the above mentioned books for just a few dollars more and have them permanently without having to renew a subscription and incur ongoing costs.

On the other hand, you would not receive the daily reminder for prayer, and the books can be rather bulky to carry around throughout one’s day.
 
Whoops the Creed is different from the Latin Creed? How come I feel this might open a big can of worms? It’s the Filoque. Okay, I know this might spark debates, I guess what I am needing to answer this question is the perspective of why it is different from Eastern Catholics.

I know we we Western Catholics use “From the Father and the Son.” What I don’t know is why it is deleted in the East. What is the East’s reasoning? I know William H. Carrol wrote about it in his History of Christendom series.
 
Greetings ByzCathCantor,

Ahhh this is so much easier to understand. Okay I can remember this. So if I want to convey something as a correct belief or an established belief, I will use those two words interchangably instead of orthodox belief.

God Bless,
Anathama Sit
 
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