What is a 'devotion to Mary'?

[rcwitness]

How would you define a good devotion to Mary? How would you define a false devotion to Mary?

 

[Mary_Ellen]

How would you define a good devotion to Mary? How would you define a false devotion to Mary?

Very simply put, good devotion to Mary means loving her, addressing her with the honor due the Mother of God, asking for her intercession, and following her example as a model Christian.

False devotion to Mary? False is an odd word choice. I’m not sure how devotion to Mary can be false. One can be bad or wrong-head in their devotion to Mary if they treat her particular devotions and sacramentals with superstition, as if they were magical incantations or talismans, such as a novena or the Brown Scapular). On the other end of the spectrum I imagine one could attribute to Mary things proper only to God and actually worship her as a god.

 

[marylauravicuna]

How would you define a good devotion to Mary? How would you define a false devotion to Mary?

St. Louis de Montfort says that this is false devotion to Mary.

1. We must, then, carefully avoid joining the critical devotees, who believe nothing and find fault with everything; the scrupulous ones who, out of respect for our Lord, are afraid of having too much devotion to his Mother; the exterior devotees whose devotion consists entirely in outward practices; the presumptuous devotees who under cover of a fictitious devotion to our Lady wallow in their sins; the inconstant devotees who, being unstable, change their devotional practices or abandon them altogether at the slightest temptation; the hypocritical ones who join
   confraternities and wear emblems of our Lady only to be thought of as good people; finally, the self-interested devotees who pray to our Lady only to be rid of bodily ills or to obtain material benefits.

Good devotion is interior, trustful, holy, constant, disinterested. It involves saying rosaries, prayer, joining religious orders, confraternities, making her priveleges known and appreciated, doing self-denial in her honor, carrying around signs of devotion to her, singing hyms, carrying her statues, having statues made of her, giving oneself to her by a special consecration, doing all to please her, meditating on her virtues, invoking her with a joyful heart, etc.

It involves beginning, carrying out and completing our actions through her, in her, with her, and for her in order to do them through Jesus, in Jesus, with Jesus, and for Jesus, our last end.

 

[shestelle]

Very good reply, looking to Mary and her life and actions to emulate them!

But one of her words is essential, don’t you think? At the Miracle at Cana, when she was approached by a steward and told they have no more wine, she simply replied: “Do all that He will tell you!” refering to her son, Jesus! This is the essential “KEY” do all that He says! She always point to Jesus, the Christ . . . and not to herself! The Christian Life is the following of Christ, in all ways! And, she being his mother and the one chosen by God to bring Him to us in this world, is difinitely the “First Christian”!

In having a devotion to Her, we need to Look to Christ Jesus and the Word of God alive today to know how to follow Christ!

shestelle

 

[marylauravicuna]

Very good reply, looking to Mary and her life and actions to emulate them!

But one of her words is essential, don’t you think? At the Miracle at Cana, when she was approached by a steward and told they have no more wine, she simply replied: “Do all that He will tell you!” refering to her son, Jesus! This is the essential “KEY” do all that He says! She always point to Jesus, the Christ . . . and not to herself! The Christian Life is the following of Christ, in all ways! And, she being his mother and the one chosen by God to bring Him to us in this world, is difinitely the “First Christian”!

In having a devotion to Her, we need to Look to Christ Jesus and the Word of God alive today to know how to follow Christ!

shestelle

Amen

 

[Eruvande]

I would say anything which leads us to Jesus through Mary is a true devotion. I like what was quoted from True Devotion, which I’m re reading atm. It’s a bit frustrating, but still interesting.

 

[GLam8833]

I think there is a danger in going on about Mary
simply because it’s the CATHOLIC thing to do,
and not recognizing that all she does is POINT
US TO Jesus! Her reason for existing IS Jesus!

 

[JRKH]

How would you define a good devotion to Mary?

A good devotion to our Lady is one that is comfortable for the devotee and does not violate any tenets of the Church.
It is a gentle devotion…One that Loves her for who she is…The mother of our Lord and our heavenly mother.
It is one that give peace and is gentle in action - not pushy.
It is one that looks to Mary as a guide to being a good disciple of her son.

Just some quick thoughts…other answers have cover this better than I could

How would you define a false devotion to Mary?

Well a false devotion ISTM would be one done for show.

A misguided devotion would be one that distorts or ignores Church teaching, one that is pushy, or intolerant of others; one that tends to put barriers between the devotee and God rather than to facilitate access to God.
Such things are signs of a person not truly understanding our Lady and what she would wish of her children.

Again just some thoughts…

Peace
James

 

[rcwitness]

Thanks all for your insights!

I believe a good devotion to Mary (or a healthy devotion with Mary) would be honoring her personal motherhood, in Christ, to us from the of love of the Holy Spirit. Its acknowledging the Holy Spirit’s consented lordship in His Handmaid. Its loving the relationship of the bride and bridegroom. Its meditating on the fruit of Jesus. Its desiring to be the workmanship of Jesus. Its recognizing the recourse we have in our family of Christ because sin affect the whole body. Its seeing the singular, individual likeness of the purity which the Church has in Jesus, and from Jesus. Its praying with Mary because we see her next to Him when we pray to Him, and she is worshipping with a perfected heart. In a way, a devotion to Mary is like a devotion to devotion. Its a little redundant, but like seeking a clear conscience.

I believe a false devotion to Mary (or an unhealthy devotion to her) is looking at her as a high priestess. Its creating an image from our desire to have an easier way to God, without struggling against sin and suffering when suffering is demanded. Its avoiding the hard commandments we must accept to uphold godliness. Its believing Mary is more compassionate than Jesus. Its believing she will hear our prayers when Jesus doesn’t. Its a ‘religious’ scapegoat to seeking the Holy Spirit in our lives. Its a scapegoat to seeking His commandments and what is pleasing to Him, with a sense of her superstitiously making us presentable to the Jesus.

I will give the example I’ve been troubled with lately.

My MIL received a surgical sterilization many years ago. My wife and I are currently living with her as we just moved down to Brasil to be with them. She has a deep devotion to Mary. The other day, my wife and I had a dissagrement about me receiving a vasectomy. I went to my MIL for support, because she has studied theology and seems to be a devoted woman. I kept the question short and to the point. “Is it wrong to get a vasectomy?” She answered, “I dont know, but I think it is OK.” I said I dont think so, and left it at that. The very next day, a statue of Mary came into the house for devotion. The community we live in shares the statue with those who participate. It stays a couple days and is used for devotion to Mary. This was several days ago and she has not pursued the issue at all. Today, I even showed a section of an encyclical dealing with contraceptives being intrinsically evil, and she basically shrugged it off, saying,“uhuh”

So, l cannot deny that there can, and is, a false and unhealthy devotion to Mary. When someone practices a deep spiritual devotion to Christ’s mother and neglects the Teaching of the Church, there is something profoundly wrong. I dont know the level of rejection in her heart. I cannot judge her heart. But I can judge what is evident, and that’s acting as though seeking purity on the one hand, while accepting sin on the other.

 

[marylauravicuna]

I will give the example I’ve been troubled with lately.

My MIL received a surgical sterilization many years ago. My wife and I are currently living with her as we just moved down to Brasil to be with them. She has a deep devotion to Mary. The other day, my wife and I had a dissagrement about me receiving a vasectomy. I went to my MIL for support, because she has studied theology and seems to be a devoted woman. I kept the question short and to the point. “Is it wrong to get a vasectomy?” She answered, “I dont know, but I think it is OK.” I said I dont think so, and left it at that. The very next day, a statue of Mary came into the house for devotion. The community we live in shares the statue with those who participate. It stays a couple days and is used for devotion to Mary. This was several days ago and she has not pursued the issue at all. Today, I even showed a section of an encyclical dealing with contraceptives being intrinsically evil, and she basically shrugged it off, saying,“uhuh”

So, l cannot deny that there can, and is, a false and unhealthy devotion to Mary. When someone practices a deep spiritual devotion to Christ’s mother and neglects the Teaching of the Church, there is something profoundly wrong. I dont know the level of rejection in her heart. I cannot judge her heart. But I can judge what is evident, and that’s acting as though seeking purity on the one hand, while accepting sin on the other.

Why did you go to her for advice when you already knew the answer?

 

[nuntym]

+JMJ+

Why did you go to her for advice when you already knew the answer?

LOL, I know, right marylauravicuna?

rcwitness, I would venture to say that it was your mother-in-law’s devotion to the Blessed Virgin that led you to talk to her. Who knows how your words have reached her.

 

[marylauravicuna]

+JMJ+

LOL, I know, right marylauravicuna?

rcwitness, I would venture to say that it was your mother-in-law’s devotion to the Blessed Virgin that led you to talk to her. Who knows how your words have reached her.

This is funny from St. Louis de Montfort’s True Devotion to Mary:

CHAPTER SIX - WONDERFUL EFFECTS OF THIS DEVOTION

1. My dear friend, be sure that if you remain faithful to the interior and exterior practices of this devotion which I will point out, the following effects will be produced in your soul:

1. Knowledge of our unworthiness

By the light which the Holy Spirit will give you through Mary, his faithful spouse, you will perceive the evil inclinations of your fallen nature and how incapable you are of any good apart from that which God produces in you as Author of nature and of grace. As a consequence of this knowledge you will despise yourself and think of yourself only as an object of repugnance. You will consider yourself as a snail that soils everything with its slime, as a toad that poisons everything with its venom, as a malevolent serpent seeking only to deceive. Finally, the humble Virgin Mary will share her humility with you so that, although you regard yourself with distaste and desire to be disregarded by others, you will not look down slightingly upon anyone.

 

[rcwitness]

Why did you go to her for advice when you already knew the answer?

For one, I was seeking another person to confirm the Church’s stance on it for my wife.

And another, I did not know if she acknowledged she made a mistake a long time ago, and now would support the Church Teaching for her daughter.

+JMJ+

LOL, I know, right marylauravicuna?

rcwitness, I would venture to say that it was your mother-in-law’s devotion to the Blessed Virgin that led you to talk to her. Who knows how your words have reached her.

I imagine you do

This morning, she was holding her grand daughter (my neice, who Sunday became my God daughter) and she said, “These two kids are enough for her parents! They are very difficult!” I said, “Well, maybe God has other plans.” She replied, “No, cut” and meant vesectomy. I said, “No, that should not be done.”

So, still she is determined it is ok, and hasn’t looked into it. I told her I will ask the Priest for her. Hopefully he has a healthy devotion

 

[nuntym]

+JMJ+

I imagine you do

This morning, she was holding her grand daughter (my neice, who Sunday became my God daughter) and she said, “These two kids are enough for her parents! They are very difficult!” I said, “Well, maybe God has other plans.” She replied, “No, cut” and meant vesectomy. I said, “No, that should not be done.”

So, still she is determined it is ok, and hasn’t looked into it. I told her I will ask the Priest for her. Hopefully he has a healthy devotion

I rest my case

 

[fred_conty]

How would you define a good devotion to Mary? How would you define a false devotion to Mary?

I think true devotion is best expressed on the backside of the miraculous medal. There it shows two hearts together, that of the Sacred Heart of Jesus and that of the Immaculate Heart of Mary. Their hearts are one, and their will is one. What is done for one is done for the other. There is no separation in the minds or the hearts of Jesus and Mary.

That is true devotion to her because it is true devotion to the Sacred Heart.

And the prayer on the front expresses it perfectly, “Mary conceived without sin, pray for us now and at the hour of our death.” Notice it says “us” and not “me”. She is the mother of us all. We are one family, all are her children. And so we devote ourselves to her by loving all thru prayer.

May God bless and keep you. May God’s face shine on you. May God be kind to you and give you peace.

 

[rcwitness]

+JMJ+

I rest my case

update on that. I opened another discussion with showing the section of Humae Vitae II #14, I believe, which condemns sterilization.

She defended her position by explaining this is a tradition of man and not strickly intended for all situations. That someone can be more charitable towards the poor if they do not have 15 plus children. And women will remain more attractive to their husbands without having so many pregnancies on their bodies, therefore keeping their husbands from looking at other women.

I also asked her if she knows a priest who would defend her position. She named an EX priest who left his vocation to run for a political position! Go figure…

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Thanks all for your insights!

I believe a good devotion to Mary (or a healthy devotion with Mary) would be honoring her personal motherhood, in Christ, to us from the of love of the Holy Spirit. Its acknowledging the Holy Spirit’s consented lordship in His Handmaid. Its loving the relationship of the bride and bridegroom. Its meditating on the fruit of Jesus. Its desiring to be the workmanship of Jesus. Its recognizing the recourse we have in our family of Christ because sin affect the whole body. Its seeing the singular, individual likeness of the purity which the Church has in Jesus, and from Jesus. Its praying with Mary because we see her next to Him when we pray to Him, and she is worshipping with a perfected heart. In a way, a devotion to Mary is like a devotion to devotion. Its a little redundant, but like seeking a clear conscience.

I believe a false devotion to Mary (or an unhealthy devotion to her) is looking at her as a high priestess. Its creating an image from our desire to have an easier way to God, without struggling against sin and suffering when suffering is demanded. Its avoiding the hard commandments we must accept to uphold godliness. Its believing Mary is more compassionate than Jesus. Its believing she will hear our prayers when Jesus doesn’t. Its a ‘religious’ scapegoat to seeking the Holy Spirit in our lives. Its a scapegoat to seeking His commandments and what is pleasing to Him, with a sense of her superstitiously making us presentable to the Jesus.

I will give the example I’ve been troubled with lately.

My MIL received a surgical sterilization many years ago. My wife and I are currently living with her as we just moved down to Brasil to be with them. She has a deep devotion to Mary. The other day, my wife and I had a dissagrement about me receiving a vasectomy. I went to my MIL for support, because she has studied theology and seems to be a devoted woman. I kept the question short and to the point. “Is it wrong to get a vasectomy?” She answered, “I dont know, but I think it is OK.” I said I dont think so, and left it at that. The very next day, a statue of Mary came into the house for devotion. The community we live in shares the statue with those who participate. It stays a couple days and is used for devotion to Mary. This was several days ago and she has not pursued the issue at all. Today, I even showed a section of an encyclical dealing with contraceptives being intrinsically evil, and she basically shrugged it off, saying,“uhuh”

So, l cannot deny that there can, and is, a false and unhealthy devotion to Mary. When someone practices a deep spiritual devotion to Christ’s mother and neglects the Teaching of the Church, there is something profoundly wrong. I dont know the level of rejection in her heart. I cannot judge her heart. But I can judge what is evident, and that’s acting as though seeking purity on the one hand, while accepting sin on the other.

I must be missing something, but where in the above do you get that your MIL has ‘false devotion to Mary?’ I think there is something else here.

If your mother had pictures up of the Sacred Heart, or practiced Devotion to the Holy Spirit, and then told you the same, would you say that she had a FALSE DEVOTION to the Sacred Heart or the Holy Spirit? I think you would not.

Your MIL is wrong in her opinion on the above, but NOT because she has a ‘false devotion’ to Mary. Rather, she has an incorrect understanding of CATHOLIC TEACHING, which she would have whether she had ‘deep devotions’ to Mary, the Saints, or God himself.

 

[rcwitness]

I must be missing something, but where in the above do you get that your MIL has ‘false devotion to Mary?’ I think there is something else here.

If your mother had pictures up of the Sacred Heart, or practiced Devotion to the Holy Spirit, and then told you the same, would you say that she had a FALSE DEVOTION to the Sacred Heart or the Holy Spirit? I think you would not.

Actually, Yes I would say that! And that is my whole point, that “there are those who say yes to God, but do not do His will.” There yes means nothing. There faith is dead, or probably in her case, dysfunctional. She is practicing her faith more as a protestant, and using the devotion to Mary as a superficial/superstitious medium!
Now, I am not saying she is completely rejecting God’s Will, but in this instance, she is, and then goes to her devotion and does what? Asks for help? She, as the devotion in Mary seems to be about, looks to Jesus through Mary, and honors Jesus through Mary. Then how is it she can honor Him through Mary while being indifferent to the Holy Spirit?

I do not know the extent of her culpability, and that is not what my concern is. I want her to reject the sin of Sterilization and recognize this is not condemned just by the traditions of men. That is not what Mary leads us to believe. She points us to Jesus, and Jesus speaks to us through His Church. There may be some practices which can be described as traditions of our own. If anything, Devotion to Mary through Jesus is more of a tradition of men than the Church’s Teaching about the intrinsic evil in Sterilization

Your MIL is wrong in her opinion on the above, but NOT because she has a ‘false devotion’ to Mary. Rather, she has an incorrect understanding of CATHOLIC TEACHING, which she would have whether she had ‘deep devotions’ to Mary, the Saints, or God himself.

If her devotion to Mary were pure, she would not allow herself to follow her own opinion which contradicts Church Teaching. We must Confirm our devotions to Mary with what we know about Christ, thus What we know about Christ, we receive through the Holy Spirit and HIs Church.

 

[JRKH]

Actually, Yes I would say that! And that is my whole point, that “there are those who say yes to God, but do not do His will.” There yes means nothing. There faith is dead, or probably in her case, dysfunctional. She is practicing her faith more as a protestant, and using the devotion to Mary as a superficial/superstitious medium!
Now, I am not saying she is completely rejecting God’s Will, but in this instance, she is, and then goes to her devotion and does what? Asks for help? She, as the devotion in Mary seems to be about, looks to Jesus through Mary, and honors Jesus through Mary. Then how is it she can honor Him through Mary while being indifferent to the Holy Spirit?

I do not know the extent of her culpability, and that is not what my concern is. I want her to reject the sin of Sterilization and recognize this is not condemned just by the traditions of men. That is not what Mary leads us to believe. She points us to Jesus, and Jesus speaks to us through His Church. There may be some practices which can be described as traditions of our own. If anything, Devotion to Mary through Jesus is more of a tradition of men than the Church’s Teaching about the intrinsic evil in Sterilization

If her devotion to Mary were pure, she would not allow herself to follow her own opinion which contradicts Church Teaching. We must Confirm our devotions to Mary with what we know about Christ, thus What we know about Christ, we receive through the Holy Spirit and HIs Church.

Excellent points in the above…

 

[rcwitness]

If anything, Devotion to Mary through Jesus is more of a tradition of men than the Church’s Teaching about the intrinsic evil in Sterilization

Re-reading this, I meant to say, “…devotions to Jesus through Mary…”