What now for Ireland?

[Tantum_ergo]

Could it be that Catholics in Ireland, both Religeous and lay, were voting their well-formed consciences?

Well, no, not if they were voting ‘for’ ‘gay marriage’.

A well-formed conscience by definition does not contradict truth. (otherwise it might be 'diligently formed, but erroneous in judgment.)"

Catholic teachings on faith and morals are infallible.

The intrinsic evil of homosexual actions is a truth, not just for Catholics, not just for Christians, but for all humanity.

To do the kind of mental and moral gymnastics to find it acceptable, if not downright laudable and ‘righteous’, does not involve a well formed conscience but rather a tragically misguided failure to listen to God’s own words (Scripture) and God’s own Church, but rather appeals to emotion, appeals to nebulous ‘value’ words, and ultimately a capitulation to the machinations of Satan, whom we all know can appear as an "Angel of Light’. However, we also know that even when those who appear**** to be angels and teaching ‘good’ contradict what we know to be absolute truth (and we do know the absolute truth about homosexual actions and have taught so in the Christian world for nearly 2000 years, and certainly our Jewish forebears received God’s teaching and proclaimed it for as many and more years before that). . . then those who ‘preach a different doctrine’ are to be gently corrected; if they refuse to hear firmly admonished; and finally, if they still refuse to submit to lawful authority on earth and to God above, left to God’s judgment.

Pray for these misguided souls who have drunk from the well of falsehood and are perpetuating falsehood as truth. Pray hard. Pray that they will repent. Pray for God’s mercy for them and us.

 

[Cider]

I’m curious to know:

1. how you know that same-sex marriage “is offending God.”

.

CCC

2202 A man and a woman united in marriage, together with their children, form a family. This institution is prior to any recognition by public authority, which has an obligation to recognize it. It should be considered the normal reference point by which the different forms of family relationship are to be evaluated.

2360 Sexuality is ordered to the conjugal love of man and woman. In marriage the physical intimacy of the spouses becomes a sign and pledge of spiritual communion. Marriage bonds between baptized persons are sanctified by the sacrament.

2361 "Sexuality, by means of which man and woman give themselves to one another through the acts which are proper and exclusive to spouses, is not something simply biological, but concerns the innermost being of the human person as such. It is realized in a truly human way only if it is an integral part of the love by which a man and woman commit themselves totally to one another until death."142

2335 Each of the two sexes is an image of the power and tenderness of God, with equal dignity though in a different way. the union of man and woman in marriage is a way of imitating in the flesh the Creator’s generosity and fecundity: "Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh."120 All human generations proceed from this union.121

2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,140 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."141 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.

 

[anon98328916]

ireland is not a catholic nation any more

ever since the fraud “celtic tiger” was exposed and they ran out of energy fighting the orange the irish republic has blamed the catholic church for their downfall

ireland is bankrupt financially and morally beyond all repair

may the irish reap what they have sown

and i have sympathy and compassion but i fear the irish republic has forsaken their true catholic faith

Our Lady of Knock, pray for the Irish Republic

The reality is plenty still go to mass young and old alike but how any actually want to be there? And are going for the right reasons? Ends kenny and his government were elected in 2011 which was a sad day for Ireland. From the off under the instructions of the EU Kenny was instructed to turn the people against the church especially the young and it worked! Then bring in abortion, and same- sex marriage and next will be killing of the sick and elderly. I can’t get into the whole thing here as it would take to long but that’s the just of it.
Fore personally as a young catholic I think young people should be taught what mass means and why we go etc… When you understand something it makes a difference. The young in Ireland are easily lead by the media and entertainment industry sadly and fail to see the bigger picture.

 

[friardchips]

CCC

2202 A man and a woman united in marriage, together with their children, form a family. This institution is prior to any recognition by public authority, which has an obligation to recognize it. It should be considered the normal reference point by which the different forms of family relationship are to be evaluated.

2360 Sexuality is ordered to the conjugal love of man and woman. In marriage the physical intimacy of the spouses becomes a sign and pledge of spiritual communion. Marriage bonds between baptized persons are sanctified by the sacrament.

2361 "Sexuality, by means of which man and woman give themselves to one another through the acts which are proper and exclusive to spouses, is not something simply biological, but concerns the innermost being of the human person as such. It is realized in a truly human way only if it is an integral part of the love by which a man and woman commit themselves totally to one another until death."142

2335 Each of the two sexes is an image of the power and tenderness of God, with equal dignity though in a different way. the union of man and woman in marriage is a way of imitating in the flesh the Creator’s generosity and fecundity: "Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh."120 All human generations proceed from this union.121

2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,140 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."141 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.

 

[Sparkythedog]

Don’t be ridiculous.

Homosexuals can’t marry each other.

They can now in Ireland.

And the Netherlands.

and Belgium…

and Finland…
Luxembourg
the United Kingdom
New Zealand
Uruguay
France
Brazil
Denmark
Argentina
Iceland
Portugal
Norway
Sweden
South Africa
Spain
Canada

Along with a growing number of states in the US including:

Alaska
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Connecticut
Delaware
Hawaii
Idaho
Iowa
Illinois
Indiana
Kansas
Maine
Maryland
Massachusetts
Minnesota
Montana
North Carolina
New Hampshire
New Jersey
New Mexico
Nevada
New York
Oklahoma
Oregon
Rhode Island
Pennsylvania
South Carolina
Utah
Virginia
Vermont
Washington
Washington DC
West Virginia
Wisconsin
and Wyoming

 

[StGerardMajella]

Wait, God doesn’t like gay people marrying each other in Ireland, so he’s going to kill a bunch of random people in a disaster?

It’s not random. The Irish people have spoken, and quite clearly.

If this is so true, why hasn’t God wiped the Netherlamds off the map? Same sex marriage has been legal there since 2001.

Yes, the Creator is very patient. He gives plenty of time and opportunity for errant people to change their ways. Until, finally, one day, He says “Enough is enough”. Then the real fun starts. The correction is then unmistakably divine.

 

[bigblu]

It’s not random. The Irish people have spoken, and quite clearly.

Yes, the Creator is very patient. He gives plenty of time and opportunity for errant people to change their ways. Until, finally, one day, He says “Enough is enough”. Then the real fun starts. The correction is then unmistakably divine.

You and your posts show how hateful and ignorant some Catholics (christians in general) are. You are a disgrace to Christianity. I can’t believe that a loving God would kill over some sex acts. Doesn’t sound too loving to me.
I feel he would be more likely to come wipe out the judgemental self righteous ones like you.

As a father, my kids may do things that upset me. But nothing they could do would cause me to harm them. If that is the kind of God you worship, then you obviously don’t worship the same God as I.

It is stuff like this that makes Catholics so hated by others.

Gays “marrying” or whatever they want to pretend to do won’t hurt anyone. Once they get their way they will prob just shut up again amd we can just go on our life and ignore them. It is only like 2 or 3 percent of the population anyway. I say live and let live. Just because people are allowed to do something doesn’t mean you have to agree with their lifestyle. You just have to be willing to live and let live. Obviously you can’t do thst as you feel the need to control others, kind of like the catholic church does to all of you.

I supposed everytime there is a natural disaster you can say “them gays caused this” soumds pretty dumb.

 

[brian_custer]

the Irish republic has the fastest growing atheist population in europe

irishcentral.com/news/-irish-atheists-increase-by-400-percent-in-ten-years-survey-shows-237949531-239669351.html

 

[7_Sorrows]

You and your posts show how hateful and ignorant some Catholics (christians in general) are. You are a disgrace to Christianity. I can’t believe that a loving God would kill over some sex acts. Doesn’t sound too loving to me.
I feel he would be more likely to come wipe out the judgemental self righteous ones like you.

As a father, my kids may do things that upset me. But nothing they could do would cause me to harm them. If that is the kind of God you worship, then you obviously don’t worship the same God as I.

It is stuff like this that makes Catholics so hated by others.

Gays “marrying” or whatever they want to pretend to do won’t hurt anyone. Once they get their way they will prob just shut up again amd we can just go on our life and ignore them. It is only like 2 or 3 percent of the population anyway. I say live and let live. Just because people are allowed to do something doesn’t mean you have to agree with their lifestyle. You just have to be willing to live and let live. Obviously you can’t do thst as you feel the need to control others, kind of like the catholic church does to all of you.

I supposed everytime there is a natural disaster you can say “them gays caused this” soumds pretty dumb.

What I don’t understand is if they are only 2-3% of the population, why do they demand the rest of us change so they can live the life they want to live. How do you know it does not hurt anyone? And it is not only Catholic teaching that homosexuality is wrong, but also other Christian denomination and I would think orthodox judaism and, of course, Islam. I am not sure about Buddhism. I would think Mormonism would also be against homosexuality. God loves everyone, but he does not like some of our behaviors.

 

[anon98328916]

the Irish republic has the fastest growing atheist population in europe

irishcentral.com/news/-irish-atheists-increase-by-400-percent-in-ten-years-survey-shows-237949531-239669351.html

Why does this not surprise me!

 

[paulrxp]

Gays “marrying” or whatever they want to pretend to do won’t hurt anyone. Once they get their way they will prob just shut up again amd we can just go on our life and ignore them. It is only like 2 or 3 percent of the population anyway. I say live and let live. Just because people are allowed to do something doesn’t mean you have to agree with their lifestyle. You just have to be willing to live and let live. Obviously you can’t do thst as you feel the need to control others, kind of like the catholic church does to all of you.

.

Here’s a perfect example of why Christianity has lost it’s moral authority. You have a Christian who’d rather be politically correct than defend Christian morality. This was the indifference I was referring to. As long as it doesn’t affect me, then they have the freedom to do whatever they want.

Why is polygamy illegal? Why wouldn’t a marriage that involved incest be ok? What’s your so called christian standard of morality? Do you really think Catholics care if we’re hated for speaking out about abortion or any other issue? Accepting the Word of God is not about submitting to “control” We can argue it’s you that’s submitting. And it’s submission for fear others won’t like you. Total submission to popular culture and the way s of the world. The only concern I’d have are for Catholics who practice your moral indifference.

 

[bigblu]

Here’s a perfect example of why Christianity has lost it’s moral authority. You have a Christian who’d rather be politically correct than defend Christian morality. This was the indifference I was referring to. As long as it doesn’t affect me, then they have the freedom to do whatever they want.

Why is polygamy illegal? Why wouldn’t a marriage that involved incest be ok? What’s your so called christian standard of morality? Do you really think Catholics care if we’re hated for speaking out about abortion or any other issue? Accepting the Word of God is not about submitting to “control” We can argue it’s you that’s submitting. And it’s submission for fear others won’t like you. Total submission to popular culture and the way s of the world. The only concern I’d have are for Catholics who practice your moral indifference.

I’m not being politically correct. I am a libertarian. There are many things I like to do that others may not approve of. I just believe consenting adults should be able to do whatever they want as long as they don’t hurt another. That has nothing to do with my religious beliefs. There is too many restrictions placed on what people can do as it is.

 

[bigblu]

What I don’t understand is if they are only 2-3% of the population, why do they demand the rest of us change so they can live the life they want to live. How do you know it does not hurt anyone? And it is not only Catholic teaching that homosexuality is wrong, but also other Christian denomination and I would think orthodox judaism and, of course, Islam. I am not sure about Buddhism. I would think Mormonism would also be against homosexuality. God loves everyone, but he does not like some of our behaviors.

No one else has to change. You can still get married like before.

 

[Nic1099]

Could it be that Catholics in Ireland, both Religeous and lay, were voting their well-formed consciences?

Herein lies the problem!

As Catholics we are required to live by and uphold the teachings of Our Lord Jesus Christ. How can a ‘well informed conscience’ be in contradiction to Jesus and His Church? Do we believe in what Our Lord says or do we not??? If we do not, we are not Christians.

I in no way mean to infer that we judge and condemn others. We are all sinners and we frequently fall short. This is why Our Lord instituted the Sacrament of Reconciliation, so that we may repent and turn from our sinful ways but there appears to be a new trend emerging within the Church that sin is okay and once our conscience is clear, then everything is fine. This is a major error that Church leaders need to address urgently.

Yes, Our Lord is merciful and loves us all but we are also required to repent. We cannot persist in sin which is what ‘gay marriage’, co-habitation and other immoral acts are.

 

[SuperLuigi]

As I’m sure you have all heard Ireland has passed the same-sex referendum yesterday. I’m a young Catholic and my faith is important to me I can’t help but wonder what of Ireland now? I have nothing against gay people each to their own but in my heart of hearts I cannot be supportive of same-sex marriage. It is offending God and I can’t be part of it. I know we are in the end times and I feel more suffering will be on the way down the line I can see it now! Even throughout the referendum if anyone apposed to it they were bullied and criticised specially on social media. I can’t help but feel in the future practising Catholics will be persecuted it already feels like so many want the church out of Ireland I fear for the future.

So-called gay “marriage” is very offensive to God.

So what will happen next, of course, is gay divorce, and lots of them. Also, probably more stories about the break down of gay families, and the usual progressive crowd trying to hide and shout down the truth since their stances cannot stand on merit.

I’m also sure that florists and bakeries (well, the non-minority, non-Muslim ones anyways) will be the next target.

 

[Simca]

What now for Ireland?

Oh The tourism industry is so excited!
Talking about the 100’s of 1000’s of euros they will pour into attracting gay people to come to Ireland.

We are such a mecca of enlightenment now.

Oh, the money it will bring to our country!

:banghead:

 

[anon98328916]

What now for Ireland?

Oh The tourism industry is so excited!
Talking about the 100’s of 1000’s of euros they will pour into attracting gay people to come to Ireland.

We are such a mecca of enlightenment now.

Oh, the money it will bring to our country!

:banghead:

I heard this nothing surprises me now

 

[Simca]

I’m also sure that florists and bakeries (well, the non-minority, non-Muslim ones anyways) will be the next target.

Yes, already in Northern Ireland a baker lost his court case because he refused to make a cake for a gay couple. And gay marriage isn’t even legal there.
theguardian.com/society/2015/may/19/northern-ireland-ashers-baking-company-guilty-discrimination-gay-marriage-cake

More to come here, I’m sure.

 

[anon98328916]

Could it be that Catholics in Ireland, both Religeous and lay, were voting their well-formed consciences?

I was sadly informed by many in recent days that a lot of people didn’t bother to vote mainly because
A) They thought it didn’t effect them and would only effect homosexuals so didn’t bother to vote.
B) Some said they were sick and tired of hearing about the referendum that they had enough of it.
C) Some thought “why would they take part in something for gay people”?

Sadly the reality is it DID effect us all and it would have been very important for those people to have voted if possibly it could have stopped this from being passed. Also because of the many that didn’t vote their vote was classed as a yes vote because of this sos so many didn’t realise this!

 

[Personanongrata]

They can now in Ireland.

And the Netherlands.

and Belgium…

and Finland…
Luxembourg
the United Kingdom
New Zealand
Uruguay
France
Brazil
Denmark
Argentina
Iceland
Portugal
Norway
Sweden
South Africa
Spain
Canada

Along with a growing number of states in the US including:

Alaska
Arkansas
California
Colorado
Connecticut
Delaware
Hawaii
Idaho
Iowa
Illinois
Indiana
Kansas
Maine
Maryland
Massachusetts
Minnesota
Montana
North Carolina
New Hampshire
New Jersey
New Mexico
Nevada
New York
Oklahoma
Oregon
Rhode Island
Pennsylvania
South Carolina
Utah
Virginia
Vermont
Washington
Washington DC
West Virginia
Wisconsin
and Wyoming