What REALLY happened in the Garden! Women the weaker of the two sexes? (All in fun)

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no…it’s the teaching of the church. You’re using your own interpretation and even coming up with false stories of scripture “and God should have did this and that, and eve was supposed to do this and Then Adam would have done his job@!”

I sense you’re probably using a false-femenist newage viewpoint that Man and Woman are equal…but they’re not. They are equal in dignity but soooo different they are boardering on being different species.

at least now you’re saying that adam had the primary responsibility. thats good enough i think.
 
MichaelHowling said:
The only other command was given to Adam…to guard the garden. This was a command to Adam and not to Eve.
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Exactly! Eve IS the garden. Haven’t you read those scriptures that refer to the beloved as a garden. It just doesn’t make sense that God would tell Adam to guard the tomatoes or the cherry bushes. If Adam was commanded to guard the garden it was because Eve was in it.

Thank you for bringing that up.
 
My final comment is

The true responsibility of Adam is the fact that the whole human race is in Adam “as one body of one man.” This is also known as monogenism in that all humankind is descended from two, sole, real human parents.

Perhaps it would be best if one would check out the* Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition*, paragraphs 355-421 and then read the first three chapters of Genesis.

Now it is my turn to enjoy this thread.
🍿
 
NO granny…it was Adam’s role.

Done.

Lady Love…beautiful post!
 
MichaelHowling said:
no…it’s the teaching of the church. You’re using your own interpretation and even coming up with false stories of scripture “and God should have did this and that, and eve was supposed to do this and Then Adam would have done his job@!”

I sense you’re probably using a false-femenist newage viewpoint that Man and Woman are equal…but they’re not. They are equal in dignity but soooo different they are boardering on being different species.

at least now you’re saying that adam had the primary responsibility. thats good enough i think.
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Calling me a feminist??? LOL!!! I guess you missed the threads where Nimzovik and I were fighting for men’s rights lol!!!

I was not saying God should have done anything. All I was saying was that the male waits patiently to see if the female will receive his authority. If she will take matters into her own hands (as humanity did which Eve represents) then she rebels in pride. It was Adam’s responsibility to protect her but it was her responsibility to go to him for that protection. That does not excuse Adam’s sin but blaming him for the whole thing is not Church teaching either!!! In fact if I understand correctly some theologians that espouse your point are in fact the feminists blaming men for yet another problem.
 
No, I did not say that eve is not culpible at all. I said it was Adams fault…as does the church. That is what the church teaches. The finger is pointed to Adam because , being the male…he is the initiator of the gift! This flys directly at your thinking that Adam is supposed to wait to see what eve does.

That goes against everything we know about the relationship of Man and wife. In Ephesians, Man is to “love your wives as Christ loves the church” …not lie in wait of the woman…we are to follow this command. It does not matter about if the woman is faithful to her call or not…we are to love our wives.
 
Lady_Love said:
Exactly! Eve IS the garden. Haven’t you read those scriptures that refer to the beloved as a garden. It just doesn’t make sense that God would tell Adam to guard the tomatoes or the cherry bushes. If Adam was commanded to guard the garden it was because Eve was in it.

Thank you for bringing that up.
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Eve was supposed to reflect the nature of man. That nature is to go to God in faith for protection. Eve did not do that to Adam. From a practical standpoint if I was Adam and saw my wife (whom I am charged to die for) talking to a weird creature without consulting me first if she should I would be pretty annoyed. They were both guilty of pride end of story.
 
Hmmmmmmm… Methinks Adam did not Sin until Eve came into the picture…😃

Now… About* lilith*…😉
 
silentfactor80 said:
Eh, not really the whole story.

"He created them male and female and blessed them. And when they were created, he called them “man.” Genesis 5:2

God is both masculine and feminine and the Church teaches both existed in Christ simultaneously as they do in each of us. Our human thinking often skews our thinking of anything not physical. In terms of the human person we are equal in value.

I would caution you though. Even though God created bugs before humans, human beings could not live without them. If you removed bugs from the food chain (or even those lowly plants) we would all die. For such a great creation human being are quite dependent on those “lesser beings.” If you removed human beings from the planet life would go on just as well if not better (probably better) without us. I tend to think of things as a whole because it is the only way to accept your piece of humble pie!
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I have thought many times about our dependency on creation. We cannot breath without oxygen that trees produce, we cannot eat without the bees that pollinate the plants, if it weren’t for the moon producing tides the air on earth would go stagnant and we would all die. Yes. We are very dependent on creation for life BUT this was the question that I thought, “If we are so dependent on nature, what depends on us?” We cannot live without the earth, the earth could exist without humans, or could it? The conclusion I came to was that earth needs us for one thing…purpose. We give a purpose to all that exists in nature.

I firmly believe that all that was created was created for the love of a woman, the most beautiful, radiant, lovable and perfect of all that God would ever create, is Mary. All of us exist for her joy, for a woman’s joy is her children.
 
this is to bring about the womans response: to submit to our loving.

If Christ…or any other Husband for that matter does not show His love…His beloved will not respond back.
 
**LadyLove wrote:**I have thought many times about our dependency on creation. We cannot breath without oxygen that trees produce, we cannot eat without the bees that pollinate the plants, if it weren’t for the moon producing tides the air on earth would go stagnant and we would all die. Yes. We are very dependent on creation for life BUT this was the question that I thought, “If we are so dependent on nature, what depends on us?” We cannot live without the earth, the earth could exist without humans, or could it? The conclusion I came to was that earth needs us for one thing…purpose. We give a purpose to all that exists in nature.

I firmly believe that all that was created was created for the love of a woman, the most beautiful, radiant, lovable and perfect of all that God would ever create, is Mary. All of us exist for her joy, for a woman’s joy is her children.

Nimzovik Responds.

Yes. And Her joy is for Our Lord.
 
MichaelHowling said:
No, I did not say that eve is not culpible at all. I said it was Adams fault…as does the church. That is what the church teaches. The finger is pointed to Adam because , being the male…he is the initiator of the gift! This flys directly at your thinking that Adam is supposed to wait to see what eve does.

That goes against everything we know about the relationship of Man and wife. In Ephesians, Man is to “love your wives as Christ loves the church” …not lie in wait of the woman…we are to follow this command. It does not matter about if the woman is faithful to her call or not…we are to love our wives.
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If it was Adam’s fault that Eve sinned you are running a foul of I don’t know how many Catholic teachings about free will. The Church says its Adam’s fault for his eating, not Eve’s eating. If you are claiming differently then provide a reference.

Yes, it does matter if a woman is faithful to her call. Good luck trying to tell a woman full of pride you know what’s best for her. Did you not see the recent debate about contraception in the HHS mandate? Men told women it wasn’t good for them but look how that turned out my friend. Female pride / ego can and frequently does act against the male.
 
A theological question: *Would *Adam have sinned if Eve was never there? We will never know…:cool:
 
Lady_Love said:
I have thought many times about our dependency on creation. We cannot breath without oxygen that trees produce, we cannot eat without the bees that pollinate the plants, if it weren’t for the moon producing tides the air on earth would go stagnant and we would all die. Yes. We are very dependent on creation for life BUT this was the question that I thought, “If we are so dependent on nature, what depends on us?” We cannot live without the earth, the earth could exist without humans, or could it? The conclusion I came to was that earth needs us for one thing…purpose. We give a purpose to all that exists in nature.

I firmly believe that all that was created was created for the love of a woman, the most beautiful, radiant, lovable and perfect of all that God would ever create, is Mary. All of us exist for her joy, for a woman’s joy is her children.
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The first part is rather narcissistic. We exist to reflect God’s nature, not give purpose to an otherwise inanimate object.

The last part is what I call deeply disturbing and vain. I’ve read several Catholic theologians propose that Eve’s sin was actually vanity for herself. In any case, the most perfect God ever created is Jesus. I think it would help you to dial down the feminine vanity and give a little heart to God’s first creation, men.
 
Nimzovik said:
A theological question: *Would *Adam have sinned if Eve was never there? We will never know…:cool:
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Adam had both rational intellect and free will which are functions or capabilities of his spiritual soul. Thus, he would be able, without Eve, to shatter humanity’s relationship with divinity which is the Catholic position.
 
Maybe, just maybe, if Adam had** all** his parts (his Rib too,) he might have had enough intestinal fortitude to withstand the evil one. 😛
 
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