What truths must you hold to be considered a Protestant?

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BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGG

The Panda Express has excellent Egg Trolls.
 
BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGG

Peking Duck is indeed a lord of Kobol…er, Kolob.
 
Broccoli Beef is a demigod of the third galaxy, sealed in the temple in Utah for eternity to have spirit babies with Sweet and Sour Pork.
TriuneUnity said:
If Peking Duck achieved the proper moral state, could it eventually become a god with its own planet?
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And for any true inquirers out there, the views expressed in the last few posts are not canon law for the majority of Protestants, although it would not surprise me in the least if you found a few who bought into them hook, line, and sinker. 😃
 
blazerdave said:
And for any true inquirers out there, the views expressed in the last few posts are not canon law for the majority of Protestants, although it would not surprise me in the least if you found a few who bought into them hook, line, and sinker. 😃
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You mean Anglicans don’t worship Beijing Beef? Man, talk about heterodoxy.
 
AmateurPianist said:
Two issues;
(1) The word Protestant is simply a classification term to identify organizations that are not classified as Catholic, Orthodox (or restorationalist).
(2) As such there is no statement of faith that you must adhere to in order to be Protestant.
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As for (1), if you are Non-Catholic or Non-Orthodox (not sure what a restorationalist is), it doesn’t follow that you are a Protestant: Atheists, jews, Muslims, Mormons, etc. are neither Catholic or Orthodox but I doubt that these faiths (or lack thereof) are considered Protestant. If we bring the category over to Christianity, then it begs the question what distinguishes Protestants from Orthodox and Catholic faiths.

As for (2), I have a question: Can anything to be believed under the Protestant umbrella (i.e. homosexuality is okay)? Under the Catholic faith, those beliefs wouldn’t be in line with the faith and wouldn’t be in good standing with the Church. Is there some equivalent for this in the Protestant faith?
I can’t think of one tenet of faith that you must hold to be considered Protestant that is unique from Catholic or Orthodox.
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This begs the question of why Catholic, Orthodox and Protestants are seen as different. Personally, I believe we all have many things in common but our beliefs aren’t exactly the same. I imagine that if the papacy were brought up that each of these faiths would have differing views about the pope’s role.
For all of the items put forth in this thread, either
(1) Not unique to Protestant:
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I agree. Other faiths can believe that the CC can be wrong.
…and I don’t think even these two items necessarily would disqualify you from being a Protestant (at least some branches). Just that it makes no sense.
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You lost me here.
(2) There are organizations that are considered Protestant that disagree
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Do you mind expounding on this?

More responses in the next post…
 
TriuneUnity said:
While I share your concerns here, gurney and understand where you are coming from, it’s only an assumption that the different Protestant groups do not believe there is one truth that is revealed by Scripture. Many Protestants, myself included, do not believe there are several thousands truths that are revealed in Scripture and see those other sects being just as wrong as the Catholic Church sees them. Since I believe that the Lutheran confessions are the true interpretation of Scripture, it would necessitate that I don’t believe the Reformed, Anglican, Methodist, Baptist et al. interpretations of Scripture are correct.
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Is there a concept of heresy within Protestantism? Does each denomination view itself as having the fullness of truth like Catholicism does? I’m trying to understand how each denomination deals with the differences between them.
 
DorianGregorian said:
I know very few Protestants who hold to their denomination in the same way that some Catholics and Orthodox hold to their Churches (EENS). I think this is because the understanding of Grace alone, Faith alone, and Christ alone necessarily exclude a Church being the “gate” to salvation. I think many Protestants would say Outside of Christ, there is no Salvation, (a statement I agree with).

I don’t think Luther had all the answers, and he was flat-out wrong on several occasions. However I think the Augsburg Confession is a proper summation of Christian Doctrine because it is from Scripture (alone). However I would regard anyone who believes the truths of the Nicene Creed as Christian.
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Catholics would agree with you somewhat: Without Christ, you cannot go to Heaven but from our point of view, you cannot separate the Bride from Her Groom. It’s a both/and, not either/or.
 
Dancelittleewok said:
Is there a concept of heresy within Protestantism? Does each denomination view itself as having the fullness of truth like Catholicism does? I’m trying to understand how each denomination deals with the differences between them.
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We would consider beliefs which are opposed to the Ecumenical Creeds to be heresy. Beliefs which are opposed to the Lutheran Confessions we would consider to be heterodoxy. As far the fullness of the truth goes…Yes, I suppose as a confessional Lutheran I would say that we do, inasmuch as our beliefs are what Scripture and the catholic faith teaches. Along the lines of the visible/invisible church dynamic, we would say that confessional Lutheran churches are the visible church, having the right preaching of God’s word and the administration of the sacraments as Christ instituted them. There are members of the invisible church within all Christian communions, though.
 
Dancelittleewok said:
Is there a concept of heresy within Protestantism? Does each denomination view itself as having the fullness of truth like Catholicism does? I’m trying to understand how each denomination deals with the differences between them.
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Some do. Generally speaking, the more conservative & traditional ones see themselves as having the fullness of truth, or something darn close to it. 😃 The idea that there is a one “truth” that is shattered into pieces and spread across all denominations is primarily a mainline idea, although it is also frequently found in Evangelical church-hoppers.

So in my experience, Confessional Lutherans, actually Reformed Presbyterians, and a lot of older Baptists believe their churches to be “right on all counts.” Their clergy are supposed to believe that too. On the other hand, Joe Protestant who is looking for a new church home sees little difference in Baptist, Methodist, Non-Denominational, and Presbyterian churches.

And yes, there definitely is a concept of heresy in Protestantism. Again, not so much in mainline circles, but in bodies who believe themselves to be inheritors of absolute truth.
 
What I’ve learned so far (and please correct me if I misunderstood):
  1. Chinese is something all denominations can agree upon! 🙂
  2. Some denominations believe themselves to have the fullness faith and possibly view other denominations as heresy.
  3. The correct interpretations of Scripture are expressed in the reformer’s confessions or books but not all denominations have this.
  4. Protestants are united in alien righteousness, Christ’s atonement, imputed justification, faith alone, etc, but not all Protestants agree on the details.
If what I’ve correctly understood you then I could conclude:
  1. There is such a varied spectrum within Protestantism–you cannot give a broad brush to the movement, although there’s some unity in their focus.
    2)Due to this variation, I wonder if Protestantism is an obsolete term. While Protestants are united in focus, I wonder if each Protestant denomination is a faith tradition in itself.
What are your thoughts?
 
Dancelittleewok said:
What I’ve learned so far (and please correct me if I misunderstood):
  1. Chinese is something all denominations can agree upon! 🙂
  2. Some denominations believe themselves to have the fullness faith and possibly view other denominations as heresy.
  3. The correct interpretations of Scripture are expressed in the reformer’s confessions or books but not all denominations have this.
  4. Protestants are united in alien righteousness, Christ’s atonement, imputed justification, faith alone, etc, but not all Protestants agree on the details.
If what I’ve correctly understood you then I could conclude:
  1. There is such a varied spectrum within Protestantism–you cannot give a broad brush to the movement, although there’s some unity in their focus.
    2)Due to this variation, I wonder if Protestantism is an obsolete term. While Protestants are united in focus, I wonder if each Protestant denomination is a faith tradition in itself.
What are your thoughts?
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“Protestant” is not a very useful term anymore, no. It is more functional as a historical term.

All one has to believe to be Christian is to believe the Apostle’s Creed. Some follow the Pope and his church (Catholics), some do not (“Protestant” is the general term for all the groups that do not follow the Pope, but this is a widely divergent collection of denominations).
 
Dancelittleewok said:
What I’ve learned so far (and please correct me if I misunderstood):
  1. Chinese is something all denominations can agree upon! 🙂
  2. Some denominations believe themselves to have the fullness faith and possibly view other denominations as heresy.
  3. The correct interpretations of Scripture are expressed in the reformer’s confessions or books but not all denominations have this.
  4. Protestants are united in alien righteousness, Christ’s atonement, imputed justification, faith alone, etc, but not all Protestants agree on the details.
If what I’ve correctly understood you then I could conclude:
  1. There is such a varied spectrum within Protestantism–you cannot give a broad brush to the movement, although there’s some unity in their focus.
    2)Due to this variation, I wonder if Protestantism is an obsolete term. While Protestants are united in focus, I wonder if each Protestant denomination is a faith tradition in itself.
What are your thoughts?
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That’s probably true, Dance. If you look at the development of each tradition within Protestantism, in many cases, it came about separate from other churches. The Reformed churches did not spring from Lutheranism. While the Calvinist reformers were inspired by Luther and men like Calvin drew from Luther’s writings on Scripture and justification, their teachings were far apart on most other things. Anglicanism sprang about from the dispute over the divorce issue and wasn’t even concerned with topics like justification until much later, when the Anglicans were influenced by the Reformed churches. The Anabaptists are a complete wild card, in that none of the magisterial reformers agreed with them. Since the time of the Reformation, most of the churches have come about from the Reformed, but today bear little in common with them, being more influenced by Arminianism.

The term Protestant itself is obsolete, in that, it was used originally only to describe a party of Lutheran princes who “protested” against a decision by the Holy Roman Emperor at the Diet of Speyer in 1529. It doesn’t mean to protest the Catholic Church. If you asked Luther in 1540 if he was a Protestant, he would look at you as if you were from a different planet.
 
Dancelittleewok said:
What I’ve learned so far (and please correct me if I misunderstood):
  1. Chinese is something all denominations can agree upon! 🙂
  2. Some denominations believe themselves to have the fullness faith and possibly view other denominations as heresy.
  3. The correct interpretations of Scripture are expressed in the reformer’s confessions or books but not all denominations have this.
  4. Protestants are united in alien righteousness, Christ’s atonement, imputed justification, faith alone, etc, but not all Protestants agree on the details.
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1-3, definitely! 4 can sorta vary; denominations that rely too heavily on perceived personal revelations or personal interpretations can drift far afield on those issues. But basically, 1-4 are right! 👍
Dancelittleewok said:
If what I’ve correctly understood you then I could conclude:
  1. There is such a varied spectrum within Protestantism–you cannot give a broad brush to the movement, although there’s some unity in their focus.
    2)Due to this variation, I wonder if Protestantism is an obsolete term. While Protestants are united in focus, I wonder if each Protestant denomination is a faith tradition in itself.
What are your thoughts?
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1, absolutely. 2: it is certainly an obsolete term. To vastly oversimplify it, Protestant recently diverged into Mainline/Liberal, Confessional, and Fundamentalist (which morphed into Evangelical, which is merging with Charismatic/Pentecostal in certain circles). And this happened in many denominational camps. So it has really become a bunch of micro-traditions, many of whom recognize others as representing the same faith. And TriuneUnity is right; the origins of the Reformation groups are so distinct that they had huge differences from their very beginnings. So yeah…you’ve summarized it quite well! 👍
 
Apologies in advance for not having read the entire thread so far, but want to point out that the question assumes a premise which turns out to be false. The premise is that there is some monolith that is Protestantism.

I say this as someone who is currently “protestant” and has spent the last year seriously studying different protestant churches in their current form and in their history. I held essentially the same premise before beginning this project that all protestants were essentially the same. Good grief was I ignorant!

There is some similarity between denominations, but past the surface level there are vast differences both in what they believed/taught historically and today.

I wish I could say they there was at least some agreement on something like the principles put forth in something like Lewis’ Mere Christianity, but given all of the theological liberalism in mainline protestantism today I’m not sure how true that would be in actuality.

Before you guys jump all over the differences in belief and mainline liberalism though, how do you understand the differences in thought, especially liberalism, within the Catholic church itself? In listening to Catholic radio quite a bit lately I get the impression this is a major concern to the theologically conservative among you. Are these people still Catholic, even if they deny certain official Catholic beliefs? Does that then make them Protestants in actuality?

No… those are honest questions on my part. I really am curious as to how this is understood.

Kindest regards.
 
Dancelittleewok said:
What I’ve learned so far (and please correct me if I misunderstood):
  1. Chinese is something all denominations can agree upon! 🙂
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Some prefer Italian or even McDonalds/Burger King
Dancelittleewok said:
  1. Some denominations believe themselves to have the fullness faith and possibly view other denominations as heresy.
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The only ones I can think of that believe this way would be your independent, fundamentalist, separatist, KJV only Baptists. They will not have anything to do with anybody outside of themselves. There are probably others, but the point is they are a distinct minority.

Of course, everybody believes they are correct, but that is not the same as constructing a fullness of truth–>heretic relationship between your organization and everybody else.
Dancelittleewok said:
  1. The correct interpretations of Scripture are expressed in the reformer’s confessions or books but not all denominations have this.
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I think this would only true for organizations which proclaim a certain loyalty to one reformer above others. Many organizations do not have any particular loyalty to any particular reformer.
Dancelittleewok said:
  1. Protestants are united in alien righteousness, Christ’s atonement, imputed justification, faith alone, etc, but not all Protestants agree on the details.
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I would guess that given enough time and effort I could come up with organizations that disagree with all of these. For starters liberal Protestants are not concerned at all with these issues.

Actually I bet most Protestants today have no idea what “alien righteousness” and “imputed justification” are.
Dancelittleewok said:
If what I’ve correctly understood you then I could conclude:
  1. There is such a varied spectrum within Protestantism–you cannot give a broad brush to the movement, although there’s some unity in their focus.
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Agree.
Dancelittleewok said:
2)Due to this variation, I wonder if Protestantism is an obsolete term. While Protestants are united in focus, I wonder if each Protestant denomination is a faith tradition in itself.

What are your thoughts?
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Also agree. I for one have no idea what “Protestantism” is.
 
I am curious: how you guys propose unity among Protestants?
 
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