What's the Problem with Profanity?

[Caesar517]

If the kind of language in question is no big deal, why is it considered necessary to limit children’s exposure to and use of it?

You ask a good question. I was expecting it to come up sooner. Here’s my answer: I think profane words have a time and a place. Determining that time and place takes a formed conscience and a degree of social perception. Temperence is also required to prevent profanity from becoming habit forming (once someone gets in that bad habit, it can be hard to use it appropriately). Children don’t fully have those tools necessary to determine when and where it can be used.

I find it difficult to respect and think highly of persons whose every other word is a curse, an obscenity. or some kind of scatological expression. They come across as crude…

Same here. Profanity can be very repulsive.

…most if not all those I hear are mediocre performers when it comes to swearing; absolute lack of creativity…

 

[rwoehmke]

Your talking about your personal moral code, your personal societal preferences…neither of which speaks of sin.

I can respect a person who isn’t afraid to drop a swear word, when used appropriately and with the proper audience.

I’m sorry that you consider me to be a mediocre performer and a person with a complete lack of creativity.

I will tell you lad, there was a time in history when people of good breeding did not drop swear words. It was considered a practice never appropriate. I in my salad days, I would never have been considered a person of good breeding. Now I think of Jesus’ words,“Be perfect as my Father is perfect” and believe that to intentionally use profanity when my body is a temple of the Holy Spirit may not be all that different than lying with a prostitute. You wouldn’t use profane language in front of the Eucharist, I’m sure, so why is being in the presence of the Holy Spirit any different.

And yes, the people I hear using profanity today are pikers compared to my Gramps, as if that should be a point of pride for me.

 

[GraceDK]

The interesting thing here, and the main argument for those who advocate profanity is that its sometimes not sinful… sometimes its appropriate.,
Interesting enough I have never in all my life experienced a time where it was appropriate. And especially when mature grown up people said such words I felt disillusioned about human beings in generel… especially if they claimed to be Christians or they had some kind of authoritative role.

Another point is that in the same breath everyone here will admit that they would not use profanity in front of Jesus.
But that exactly proves my point. For me the greatest part about being in the process of conversion is that you “walk with Christ” that means you pray incessantly/remember His presense always. Besides… We should treat every person like we treat Christ. He is in our neighbour… He is our neighbour…
Some one said, in order to prove his point, that it would be sinful to stand in front of Jesus in a bathing suit. The interesting thing is that I find that this belong in a whole different category of customs and times… there is some relativism in play. And I dont feel like a sinner when I am at the beach in the waves and I just lay there - in my bathing suit - and talk to Jesus. So too when I am in the swimming pool… in fact, I think Jesus is happy that I talk to Him also when I am swimming.
I am not saying that its not a good custom to wear a nice covering dress to Church… but its that: a custom.

As for those who claim that “apologists are on their side so the burden of proof is with me”, I can only say that apologists are not my God. They can easily be mistaken. Jesus Christ is the criteria on which I see what example we are called to follow.
Profanty is a very long way from how He would talk… and I may add I never heard an apologist talk profane… maybe because its never appropriate.

Grace.

 

[St_Aloysius]

GraceDK:

Another point is that in the same breath everyone here will admit that they would not use profanity in front of Jesus.

Most people here. Not everyone, though.

A while ago a read an interesting book at the urging of my friend. In it, it detailed the conversion of a man who came from all the filth of the world to the light of Christ; what’s more, he became a pastor in his own church. Yet what made him unique was his manner of speech, quite “unbecoming” of a preacher. “Rick the cussing pastor,” his friend (who was writing the book) called him. The author said at the end of the day his friend wasn’t doing anything he thought was odd, or for shock appeal, just natural. His congregation loved him for his humanness. Those who were too prudish or high for that sort of thing just left. And yet his reputation as the cussing pastor made for the best congregation one could imagine: real, honest, spiritually needy people who didn’t care about that sort of thing, but were open to a message from someone that didn’t try to hide beneath some holy facade but was genuine–even when it was unpretty or guttural.

Likewise, an old pastor of mine laughed when recalling a similar conversion story. This man came from an edgy past. He was so happy to be a Christian! And everywhere he went, he told his friends, his family, about this new life–using terminology that was so ingrained, he didn’t stop or think twice about it.

We all have different conditioning, and different consciences.

If our consciences feel opposed to the use of “salty” language, we should obey. If we are firmly convinced this is some moral law, then we should set a good example–but condemning others for their practice is hardly in keeping with the example of love Jesus sets for us: “Do any condemn you?” “No, Lord.” “Then neither do I.”

In fact, this was a big subject of today’s Gospel reading. Jesus hung out with the wrong crowd, and the religious prisses got unwound. I’m sure language was the least of their worries!

So obey your conscience, set an example in line with it, and love others genuinely and sincerely without the need for judgment.

 

[Leeta]

Grace DK is certainly right.
“Impurity is not so much to be mentioned among you” says St. Paul whose year begins soon. There is a lot of profanity involving it and it is certainly sinful to use it!

Impurity makes one blind to God and it begins as always with a thought and if using vugarities isn’t presenting an opportunity for the thought to go onto imagination and from there to speaking and acting on it, I don’t know what is. Impurity is one of the deadliest sins. According to Our Lady of Fatima, more people go to Hell because of it than anything else.

Catholics are generally so secular and they tell it in their vulgar speech. All our you who do not try to stop using profanity should be ashamed of yourselves for the scandal you give.

 

[Leeta]

The examples given of preachers and priest cussing do not justify the practice at all. Rather it shows the character flaws of the priest or others using it.

 

[richardwy]

This is just nuts.

 

[GraceDK]

St_A.
Name me one brother here who would utter profanity standing in front of the Throne of the Lamb. My guess is you cant find one.

A while ago a read an interesting book at the urging of my friend. In it, it detailed the conversion of a man who came from all the filth of the world to the light of Christ; what’s more, he became a pastor in his own church. Yet what made him unique was his manner of speech, quite “unbecoming” of a preacher. “Rick the cussing pastor,” (…)his friend wasn’t doing anything he thought was odd, or for shock appeal, just natural. His congregation loved him for his humanness. Those who were too prudish or high for that sort of thing just left.

There is nothing natural about profanity. its an expression of the fall of Adam. Especially when said by priests and teachers its damaging. That’s why its written that more will be demanded of these.
What about children in such a congregation?
Yes. People love what is of the flesh and the world. it tickles people’s ears when they hear something that their flesh relates to.
You call me a prude and a hypocrite for I too would leave such a congregation and find another where people would at least admit what is right and wrong.
I find it untasteful that you call it a succesful congregation where there is division because of the sin of the pastor. what a poor sense of jugdement you display today my friend…
You contradict your self when you advocate this for you have said before that only a few chosen situations exist where a person can speak profanity and will be understood and not lead others to fall.yet when this pastor leads to fall you wont see it. You are getting onto shaky ground. (I know its diffucult to see some flaw in someone we otherswise love and look up to)…

And yet his reputation as the cussing pastor made for the best congregation one could imagine: real, honest, spiritually needy people who didn’t care about that sort of thing, but were open to a message from someone that didn’t try to hide beneath some holy facade but was genuine–even when it was unpretty or guttural.

Maybe they should have cared about “that sort of thing" if they did not care about that then what did they care about?
I think you get further out on an edge here brother. you say that people who don’t like that kind of language because they find it far from the holiness of Christ are prudes and those who practice foul talk are “genuine”. Come on!

Likewise, an old pastor of mine laughed when recalling a similar conversion story. This man came from an edgy past. He was so happy to be a Christian! And everywhere he went, he told his friends, his family, about this new life–using terminology that was so ingrained, he didn’t stop or think twice about it.

How do you know? Maybe he was in the confessional with it? Maybe he did not realise the sin and was working first on other pressing matters…

We all have different conditioning, and different consciences.

Yes indeed. I know Christians who are active homosexuals etc who say that Jesus is merciful. They say they are not sinning -its just a weakness or human nature. At any rate something they cant and wont change.

If our consciences feel opposed to the use of “salty” language, we should obey. If we are firmly convinced this is some moral law, then we should set a good example–but condemning others for their practice is hardly in keeping with the example of love Jesus sets for us: “Do any condemn you?” “No, Lord.” "Then neither do I."

Look sir… you just said that people that cringe at profanity and fear this particular sin (yes, fear. I fear sin) are prudes that should rightly find another place with their “highness”. I suggest you take a thorough look at your self.

**In fact, this was a big subject of today’s Gospel reading. Jesus hung out with the wrong crowd, and the religious prisses got unwound. I’m sure language was the least of their worries! **

Jesus said: what the heart is full of the mouth runs over with.
Me, I believe that my heavenly Father cares about everything pertaining to my life. If I don’t speak like a child of His then He cares. even more that I know whats wrong and right and say I am sorry when I offend Him and others.

So obey your conscience, set an example in line with it, and love others genuinely and sincerely without the need for judgment.

I don’t need to judge, but like you, I long for a Church that is really the city of light. something that people see and hear and think: "there is something DIFFERENT about this person, something pure, full of love. this person is FREE ".
Brother.we are called to walk in the Spirit of God.
and it seems to me you got a bad CAF-day.so I send you a: :hug1:

 

[GraceDK]

This is just nuts.

You bet it’s nuts,
Jesus calls us to be perfect like His Father… Its crazy and unfathomable for the human mind…
He died for our sins… also the “lesser ones”… Its really seems too radical, does it not?.. But this is what He has shown us.

If we dont follow him no one will find us credible… and they will think: why should I be a Christian… I might as well be a marxist, a buddhist or a secularist…

.

 

[LilyM]

If our consciences feel opposed to the use of “salty” language, we should obey. If we are firmly convinced this is some moral law, then we should set a good example–but condemning others for their practice is hardly in keeping with the example of love Jesus sets for us: “Do any condemn you?” “No, Lord.” “Then neither do I.”

You’ve totally misunderstood this story - He ends by telling her to sin no more - in other words that what she had been doing was wrong and sinful and that she must cease!

No-one ‘condemned her’ to the earthly punishment of death by stoning, that’s true, and neither did Jesus. This certainly didn’t mean that she hadn’t sinned, and although she was forgiven she was ‘on probation’, so to speak, charged to amend her sinful ways, which is what we all need to do.

Imagine if she had said to Him, as you are doing, ‘what sin? I wasn’t sinning, Lord, my conscience is clear!’ - I imagine He’d have had very different words for her then.

 

[Julian_Peters]

Thank you to all who have participated. This thread is now closed.