Where are all the large Catholic families?

[BingoBoy]

It had nothing to do with my reasons. It had to do with what happened to my body. You know that the Church does not accept that medical problems are a result of one’s own sins or lack of faith, right? I don’t know why God did not make me more fertile but to attribute it to my “reasons” is crass.

Yes, I understood from your first post to me that you have a small family due to reasons that are outside your bodily control.

My point was, since YOU have a small family by no will of your own, then how can you be so prejudice against other small families when you don’t know if THEIR reasons are outside their control as well??

I don’t care if you say you’re not being “prejudice” against small families. When you say things like “it’s such a shame that people have such small families now, and I wish I could live some place with big families…” it comes off a certain way.

And it may be hurtful for a couple who, by no will of their own, simply *weren’t *blessed with a big family… much as yourself!

 

[Corki]

Yes, I understood from your first post to me that you have a small family due to reasons that are outside your bodily control.

My point was, since YOU have a small family by no will of your own, then how can you be so prejudice against other small families when you don’t know if THEIR reasons are outside their control as well??

I don’t care if you say you’re not being “prejudice” against small families. When you say things like “it’s such a shame that people have such small families now, and I wish I could live some place with big families…” it comes off a certain way.

And it may be hurtful for a couple who, by no will of their own, simply *weren’t *blessed with a big family… much as yourself!

Where did I ever say that “it’s such a shame that people have such small families now.”? But I stand by wishing I lived where there were more large families. I love kids - mine and other people’s and love the energy of a large family. If I can’t have one of my own, I can enjoy those that do. Or are you advocating a small family ghetto? Since I have a small family, I should not be allowed to enjoy living near large families?

And I am not prejudice against small families. I realize there are many reasons that exists to limit family size. I just wish there weren’t so many of those reasons these days. If those reasons didn’t exist, we would naturally have more large families.

 

[adopted_heir]

It can be really helpful to a large family to have other large families around. I find that I rarely take my 5 children to visit in the homes of those who have only 1 or 2 children, because we can be overwhelming. On the other hand, my friends with large families are used to having the chaos that comes with so many kids and are more able to take it in stride. It can also be affirming that we’re not “weird” and our kids come to see it as normal.

This. I only have three (4, 3, 2) and it is a trial to try to take them to friends’ houses, if those friends have a kid or two. They get into stuff, the place is baby-proofed but not preschooler-proofed, and everybody gets frustrated trying to keep them under control. However, our babysitters are two girls in a batch of seven living (two deceased) and if you add our three, the mother hardly bats an eye.

 

[aragonjohn1]

Wow, I want to live where you live. We have so many small families that we can’t get enough altar servers. I was one of 5 and growing up, we were considered on the small end of medium-sized. Now many people are aghast at a family with five kids and I think the biggest family in my parish has four.

I live in southeastern/southwestern michigan : )

 

[Mrs_Sally]

My kids regularly remind me that their kids will only have one uncle on our side of the family and see that as very unfortunate. As of now, they are determined to make up for this in the next generation - God willing.

Mine will either have 5-10 each or enter religious life.

As for awareness of health reasons, I agree that some of the things women are warned about now would have brought on maternal death in the past.

In these discussions we also have to realize that when the Lambeth Conference (Anglican) approve birth control for married couples in 1930, couples had already been regularly using various forms of birth control. They weren’t as effective as modern methods, but the idea of limiting family size was already spreading in the general culture. In fact, the 1920 Conference had a specific resolution against birth control, so it was widespread enough then for the Anglican church to be concerned about it.

 

[Crescentinus]

Bad for business perhaps …

Perhaps.
Either that or they have some ideological bias against it.

 

[call18886333446]

I called 1.888.needhim and they told me how to be sure of going to heaven!!!
Now i am going to tell my kids so they can be with me in heaven!!!
I have 7 kids!!!

 

[Jessup]

They are here in the Philippines!!

LOL thats so true, most all of my brothers and sisters in Christ in my Catholic group are from the phils, and they all have large families. The other people I know with who also have large families are LDS.
As my LDS friends always testify to me, they say; that you should not be afraid to have a large family. If you live righteous according to God’s will it will all work out for you.

Cheers!

 

[St_Donatus]

I go to both a EF (Extraordinary Form) mass and a NO (Novus Ordo) mass and I notice that the families are very small in the NO mass and very large in the EF mass. Since no Catholic women use Birth Control, I would have to assume that God wants the EF mass supporters to take over since their population is growing while the NO population is falling.

Seriously, I am amazed at the size difference in EF mass families from those in NO masses. While I have been coming back to the church, I have asked the Catholics where I work about the Catholic Church. All of them said the same thing. ‘I like being Catholic, I just don’t agree with them about contraception.’ One is even a Eucharistic minister, but not surprisingly, none of their grown kids even go to mass anymore.

As far as the EF mass families, none of the ones I know with grown kids have any that don’t go to mass. I think this is very telling about the general spirituality of both groups. The NO families generally don’t take the faith seriously like the EF mass folks do. (We can argue this point but when 95% of NO mass going women take contraceptives while basically none of the EF mass women do, one group is following the law of the church and the other is involved in mortal sin.) Obviously, this is not always the case, but there is a real difference. Personally, I feel much closer to God when I go to an EF mass than I do at the NO mass but that is a personal preference. I have to drive a hundred miles each weekend to go to an EF mass, but I have noticed that when I go to the EF mass, I am able to keep up my spirituality during the week easier than when I go to the NO mass.

I have only been back in the Catholic Church for six months, and these are my honest observations during that time. I am leaning toward the EF mass since I feel like I get a lot more spiritual support. For example, when asking about my invalid marriage, the priest at the NO church never even asked if I understood that if I became a Catholic again, I would be in mortal sin as long as my ‘wife’ and I were performing the marital act. When I originally asked the EF priests about this, they told me that my ‘wife’ and I would have to live as brother and sister until our marriage could be validated. There was even a question as to whether I would have to move out until it was okay. It seems like NO priests are afraid to make the spiritual demands of modern Catholics that are needed. They make it appear that you can pick and choose which teachings you want to believe in.

The fact is that Jesus never said that being a Christian wouldn’t involve sacrifice. But I have found during what some might think has been a terribly difficult transition back the the Church, God has supplied me with the graces that I needed to keep marching forward. (Being excommunicated by my old church, loosing all my friends, many of my family, and my relationship with my wife to name just a few.) Yes, I have had to make many changes in my life, but God demands it, and he supplies what I need to make it.

Likewise, Catholic women can obey the teachings of the Church and remain happy.

 

[maryjk]

I go to both a EF (Extraordinary Form) mass and a NO (Novus Ordo) mass and I notice that the families are very small in the NO mass and very large in the EF mass. Since no Catholic women use Birth Control, I would have to assume that God wants the EF mass supporters to take over since their population is growing while the NO population is falling.

I attend the Ordinary Form or OF. Just of the families I know, the largest has nine children. Going down from there, I know of at least 2 families with eight children, 3 with seven, numerous with five or six and honestly to many to count that have three or four. In addition, most of the families I know with one or two children fall into three categories. They are either converts, households headed by widows/widowers or like me, using NFP due to serious health reasons.

Maybe it is just where you live? Because there certainly isn’t a problem here.

 

[St_Donatus]

I attend the Ordinary Form or OF. Just of the families I know, the largest has nine children. Going down from there, I know of at least 2 families with eight children, 3 with seven, numerous with five or six and honestly to many to count that have three or four. In addition, most of the families I know with one or two children fall into three categories. They are either converts, households headed by widows/widowers or like me, using NFP due to serious health reasons.

Maybe it is just where you live? Because there certainly isn’t a problem here.

Would you say that your parish is very ‘orthodox’, otherwise sticks with the magesterium, preaches the truth with no holds bared, etc? I know that I have been told that the priests in my diocese are very ‘liberal’ and the previous bishop was a ‘modernist’ bishop and didn’t always encourage following church teachings. I don’t really know how to tell since up until recently I hadn’t been to mass in 30 years. I do no a difference in the sermons at the OF mass here are weak and emphasize ‘love for neighbor’ while the EF mass sermons seem to emphasize ‘love for God’ shown through obedience.

 

[Link0126]

daaaaannnnnnnnggggggggg you are RICH!

also, do you count pets?

 

[maryjk]

Would you say that your parish is very ‘orthodox’, otherwise sticks with the magesterium, preaches the truth with no holds bared, etc? I know that I have been told that the priests in my diocese are very ‘liberal’ and the previous bishop was a ‘modernist’ bishop and didn’t always encourage following church teachings. I don’t really know how to tell since up until recently I hadn’t been to mass in 30 years. I do no a difference in the sermons at the OF mass here are weak and emphasize ‘love for neighbor’ while the EF mass sermons seem to emphasize ‘love for God’ shown through obedience.

I wouldn’t say we are very orthodox, and I have been told here that we aren’t traditional.

Yes, our priests say the black and do the Red. I have never heard anything said during a homily that is against what I know to be true Church teaching.

But we do emphasize love for neighbor through our food pantry, our parish assistance committee and our many parish social groups.

And no, Link0126, I don’t count pets. I do work at the parish so I know many of our parish families. I also home school, but none of the larger families do.

 

[thewanderer]

I attend the Ordinary Form or OF. Just of the families I know, the largest has nine children. Going down from there, I know of at least 2 families with eight children, 3 with seven, numerous with five or six and honestly to many to count that have three or four. In addition, most of the families I know with one or two children fall into three categories. They are either converts, households headed by widows/widowers or like me, using NFP due to serious health reasons.

Maybe it is just where you live? Because there certainly isn’t a problem here.

Sounds like my parish, there are plenty of families at my OF parish that have at least 5-6 kids some with as many as 11-12. As I said earlier this is not just an EF/Traditionalist thing.

And to answer the question as to whether we are very orthodox, well, the priests don’t teach anything contrary to the faith, and have mentioned abortion/contraception in their homilies from time to time, but as with maryjk’s parish, it is not a traditionalist parish. We sing hymns instead of propers, Mass is said towards the people, there is usually no latin, even in the hymns, some people raise their hands at the Our Father, the priest will make comments about his golfing from time to time, there are no altar rails, the tabernacle is not dead centre… I could go on, but I think you get the point. Large families are not reserved to the EF or to traditionalist circles and it gets tiresome to hear people make such false claims repeated so often.

 

[Denise1957]

Large families are definately not reserved only to EF parishes. But I think the general tendency is that EF parishes have more families, many of them large. At the EF parish in my city, the priest will mention in a homily once or twice a year about why artificial contraception cannot be used, and what the guidelines and restrictions are for NFP. Hopefully this important Church teaching is also reiterated at the OF parishes, and maybe those here who attend the OF can say if this teaching is taught from the pulpit in their parish. Something that is taught from the pulpit will reach more people than, say, a class taught at the parish.

The OF parishes can run anything from conservative to liberal; the more liberal, the more likely that there will be fewer families. I have attended, over the last few months, the OF at five different parishes, and this is what seems to be the case, based on my limited experience. Two of the parishes I attended were on the liberal side, and were struggling to meet financial obligations due to lack of contributing parishioners.

At the EF parish, crying babies are usually part of the background noise, but at the OF parishes that I’ve attended…not so much.

 

[St_Donatus]

Large families are definately not reserved only to EF parishes. But I think the general tendency is that EF parishes have more families, many of them large. At the EF parish in my city, the priest will mention in a homily once or twice a year about why artificial contraception cannot be used, and what the guidelines and restrictions are for NFP. Hopefully this important Church teaching is also reiterated at the OF parishes, and maybe those here who attend the OF can say if this teaching is taught from the pulpit in their parish. Something that is taught from the pulpit will reach more people than, say, a class taught at the parish.

The OF parishes can run anything from conservative to liberal; the more liberal, the more likely that there will be fewer families. I have attended, over the last few months, the OF at five different parishes, and this is what seems to be the case, based on my limited experience. Two of the parishes I attended were on the liberal side, and were struggling to meet financial obligations due to lack of contributing parishioners.

At the EF parish, crying babies are usually part of the background noise, but at the OF parishes that I’ve attended…not so much.

I guess that is the point, no matter the mass, the more liberal, the more struggles there seem to be, both spiritually and financially. The EF mass I have attended supports two priests with 400 parishioners. The OF mass I have attended has one priest support by several thousand parishioners. The EF mass is always full with two masses, the OF mass is always sparsely attended in the four masses on weekends day. The OF church I attend is said to be the most conservative in the city. I have yet to see a large family even in that OF church BUT from what I am hearing, our conservative parish would be considered liberal in many other cities. So again I say, I don’t know that the mass is the difference, it is the over all attitude. I know there are many very religious liberal Catholics who do their best, but my experience was that the more liberal the Church, the less spiritual effect there is on the parishioners. As I said before, as a teenager I thought that the liberal Church I attended represented the Catholic Church as a whole and after hearing the priest tell me that prayer does not work, fornication isn’t really that bad, and there are no ‘Mortal’ sins, I drift off to the evangelical Christian movement. At least they believed in sin, prayer, and right and wrong.

Thankfully I learned what the Catholic Church really teaches and that their are Catholic Churches that teach it. I thank God for the priests and laity at the EF parish I attend and how they encouraged me to come back to the Catholic Church. I also thank God for the OF priest in my own city who has helped me officially join the Catholic Church again.

 

[Denise1957]

I guess that is the point, no matter the mass, the more liberal, the more struggles there seem to be, both spiritually and financially. The EF mass I have attended supports two priests with 400 parishioners. The OF mass I have attended has one priest support by several thousand parishioners. The EF mass is always full with two masses, the OF mass is always sparsely attended in the four masses on weekends day. The OF church I attend is said to be the most conservative in the city. I have yet to see a large family even in that OF church BUT from what I am hearing, our conservative parish would be considered liberal in many other cities. So again I say, I don’t know that the mass is the difference, it is the over all attitude. I know there are many very religious liberal Catholics who do their best, but my experience was that the more liberal the Church, the less spiritual effect there is on the parishioners. As I said before, as a teenager I thought that the liberal Church I attended represented the Catholic Church as a whole and after hearing the priest tell me that prayer does not work, fornication isn’t really that bad, and there are no ‘Mortal’ sins, I drift off to the evangelical Christian movement. At least they believed in sin, prayer, and right and wrong.

Thankfully I learned what the Catholic Church really teaches and that their are Catholic Churches that teach it. I thank God for the priests and laity at the EF parish I attend and how they encouraged me to come back to the Catholic Church. I also thank God for the OF priest in my own city who has helped me officially join the Catholic Church again.

Thanks for sharing your background, Donatus. God bless the OF and EF priests who have helped you to come back to the Catholic faith. You mentioned that your OF parish has several thousand parishioners, but the weekend Masses are sparsely attended.
All we can really speak to is our own experiences in our locale, for the most part, but I’ve wondered about this, too, at the OF parishers I’ve attended. Most of these parishes have schools attached to them, so where are all those children on Sunday? I know that some families who attend Catholic schools are not Catholic, but still…

I think its important to preach good, solid Church teaching from the pulpit, but I understand that some priests (OF) may be a little hesitant to do this. For example, last Sunday I attended the OF at the conservative parish which also currently houses the EF (FSSP) Mass. The priest is new at the parish, and though very orthodox, he is also very personable, vibrant, and has a great sense of humor, much of it is of the self-effacing variety. Anyway, he menioned in the homily last Sunday that several parishioners had approached him after Mass on the previous Sunday, and told him that the homily he had given that Sunday was a bit harsh. I hadn’t attended that Mass the previous week, but Father said that the parishioners were upset because had he given a hard-hitting sermon on sin. He then went on to stress the importance of Church teaching on the subject, and that it’s important to go to confession, and that he himself goes to confession once a week. Well, I’ve never seen anyone go to confession at this parish (except me). Quite a contrast with the long lines to go to confession every Sunday at the EF parish.

I’m not trying to diminish the OF at all, though. Even at the liberal OF parishes, I find things that I like about them, and even though they don’t mention the word ‘sin,’ there, I always find something that I like about the homilies.

 

[babochka]

I attend the Ordinary Form or OF. Just of the families I know, the largest has nine children. Going down from there, I know of at least 2 families with eight children, 3 with seven, numerous with five or six and honestly to many to count that have three or four. In addition, most of the families I know with one or two children fall into three categories. They are either converts, households headed by widows/widowers or like me, using NFP due to serious health reasons.

Maybe it is just where you live? Because there certainly isn’t a problem here.

Is there an EF Mass (or parish) where you live? I think that many large families who would otherwise be dispersed throughout parishes tend to gravitate toward EF parishes where they are available. It is nice to get that support from other large families, and from others who take the faith seriously.

We’re pretty mixed around here. We have an FSSP parish that has very large families and an SSPX chapel that also has very large families. We are in a fairly conservative diocese with only a handful of parishes that are really problematic and a large number of parishes that I would classify as “conservative”. At those that I have been regularly involved with, there are several large (more than 4 children) families at each.

 

[thewanderer]

Is there an EF Mass (or parish) where you live? I think that many large families who would otherwise be dispersed throughout parishes tend to gravitate toward EF parishes where they are available. It is nice to get that support from other large families, and from others who take the faith seriously.

We’re pretty mixed around here. We have an FSSP parish that has very large families and an SSPX chapel that also has very large families. We are in a fairly conservative diocese with only a handful of parishes that are really problematic and a large number of parishes that I would classify as “conservative”. At those that I have been regularly involved with, there are several large (more than 4 children) families at each.

I know this wasn’t directed at me, but I’m gonna answer anyway. There is a daily EF Mass available about 20 min drive away from our parish church in a beautiful church with marble pillars, altar rails, the whole shebang. That doesn’t change the fact that there are still plenty of larger families at this non-traditionalist parish, so its not just a matter that they don’t have a more traditional Mass/Church available to them.

 

[maryjk]

Is there an EF Mass (or parish) where you live? I think that many large families who would otherwise be dispersed throughout parishes tend to gravitate toward EF parishes where they are available. It is nice to get that support from other large families, and from others who take the faith seriously.

We’re pretty mixed around here. We have an FSSP parish that has very large families and an SSPX chapel that also has very large families. We are in a fairly conservative diocese with only a handful of parishes that are really problematic and a large number of parishes that I would classify as “conservative”. At those that I have been regularly involved with, there are several large (more than 4 children) families at each.

No, the nearest EF Mass is over two hours away and in another time zone. Which means if you want to attend a 10am Mass, you have to leave our town before 7am. So, no, the families here attend Mass here