Where did the anti-family vibe come from?

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faithsmind said:
Well for one thing, I’m growing to abhor the word “feminist”
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To borrow a quote from another thread:
AdriannaJean said:
I am a feminist. I wholeheartedly believe that I am a man’s moral and intellectual equal, deserving of personhood and identity in my own right. That is not to say that I am the same as a man, just that I am equal to one. That is classical equity feminism. That’s why I care about a social system that assumes that women will make a sacrifice men don’t have to.

Sure, I think that neo-feminists are nuts. I also think that certain branches of Christians are nuts. In the same way that I won’t let the Westboro Baptist church take the word “Christian” away from me, I won’t let the crazy femi-nazis take “feminism” away from me.** I will go to my grave a Christian, no matter how many crazy Christians there are. I will go to my grave a feminist, no matter how many crazy feminists there are. **

It is a huge mistake to judge an entire ideology/philosophy/religion by its craziest members.
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Emphasis mine.
 
OK, I like her interpretation, but I believe that same thread had some different interpretations as well. It just seems like there are so many interpretations and it starts to get frustrating, hence, the ending of that thread.

I believe we are different, but we, in our differences and similiarities, need to be respected equally. Just as the body has different parts with different functions, but is working together for a single purpose. And when I say that, I don’t mean that a woman or a man is always to perform one specific function. i.e. a hand is always to grasp a beer can. ha ha.
 
mschrank said:
I got married 5 years ago to my wonderful wife and now we have 2 beautiful children. We have a nice house with a big backyard in a neighborhood full of other kids and we have a great sense of community here. I’m not rich (enlisted military) but I make a decent amount and it’s stable so I can keep my family well taken care of. I love life. Seriously, this is the happiest I have ever been.

I wrote that not to brag, but to lay out the next part of my post. Why on earth would anyone be against this kind of life, or not want it, or make disparaging remarks and prefer to be single or at least married-with-no-kids? I just don’t get it, it totally boggles my mind. There is such a strong anti-family sentiment especially amongst younger people and intellectual types.

I don’t understand this general idea prevalent in society, in some parts more than others (IMO, the attitude is more widespread in non-Latin Europe), that glorifies being single and living for yourself. How does such an unnatural and abhorrent ideal come to be so widely accepted?

It’s just not normal- pretty much all other cultures in the world glorify family and hold it to be life’s greatest good. I studied Chinese for 3 years in college and the character for “good” consists of a woman, a child, and a roof. I’m not making this up.

It doesn’t make sense historically, nor does it make sense experientially… I love my kids. Sure they irritate me sometimes, but I love them beyond words and they bring so much joy to my life. How could anyone not want joy, love and happiness and prefer self absorption and a very shallow kind of autonomy? So many people seem to want to hang on to a teenage lifestyle well into their 30s now, what a depressing existence!

Please… someone help me understand where this idea came from, why so many people believe in it, and what the heck is wrong with the world!
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,
II don’t have the time to read all the post so sorry if I’m repeating anyone. Contraception is the answer. It destroyed western society.
 
I’ve said my views before. Contraception did not destroy Western society. Wars and problems existed long before contraception. Contraception also allowed women to do more than just be a mother if they wished. From my view, contraception strengthened Western society.
 
You feel Western society has been strengthened since the beginning of the increase of the use of contraception? In what way, specifically? Meaning, what positive social trends have increased? Do you feel this overrides the negative social trends that have spiked since the onset of common use of the pill and condoms?

Why do you think there is such a spike in pornography, violence against women, divorce, and unplanned pregnancy, which has directly coincided with the increased use of BC? Do you think it’s simply a matter of coincidence, a matter of increase studies in this area? You don’t think this has anything to do with the facade that BC has created, encouraging the lack of understanding that sex is powerful and creates human life?

Do you, personally, see children as a burden?
 
I reviewed your recent arguments for living an entirely sterile life. Your very last link to support your entire argument was a cute lil article in a Philly newspaper. It was very anecdotal. Did you read the last sentence of this article by chance? The article had absolutely no links to any kind of reputable sources of empirical data to back up any kind of point. It had no links at all.

It did have some cute lil pictures.

The article does not give your argument very much credibility. I’m sorry.

I look to Jesus’s way of life for credibility:
THIS is love. THIS is the reason for LIFE.
THIS is the meaning of marriage.
http://www.unreel.co.uk/reviews/t/The_Passion_of_the_Christ/co4.jpg
 
faithsmind said:
I reviewed your recent arguments for living an entirely sterile life. Your very last link to support your entire argument was a cute lil article in a Philly newspaper. It was very anecdotal. Did you read the last sentence of this article by chance? The article had absolutely no links to any kind of reputable sources of empirical data to back up any kind of point. It had no links at all.

It did have some cute lil pictures.

The article does not give your argument very much credibility. I’m sorry.

I look to Jesus’s way of life for credibility:
THIS is love. THIS is the reason for LIFE.
THIS is the meaning of marriage.
http://www.unreel.co.uk/reviews/t/The_Passion_of_the_Christ/co4.jpg
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Has anyone mentioned Pope Paul VI’s Humanae Vitae. Back in 1968 when Pope Paul wrote this encyclical he more or less described todays society and the problems we have. All those years ago he prophesied what would happen as a result of the use of the Pill. He told us we would have this abortion ravaged anti family society.

here is a discussion about it
youtube.com/watch?v=cLZyN8x8gNE

the pill caused these problems no doubt about it.
 
faithsmind said:
You’ve got yourself in quite the situation there, Miss.
I want to remind you that our Daddy goes beyond time and space, and we’ve got to realize we are very leetle. But he’s allowed us this incredible priveledge to cocreate within His larger plan. What was He thinking?? It’s really a scandal if you ask me. But He didn’t ask me.(Yessss.)

But I don’t think that means to abandon all common sense and just run freeee, He gave us a set of rules to follow, of course. He sent His beloved son to teach us, and part of that lesson was to know His undying love for us, and His invitation for us to give everything up for Him, too. His vulnerability is the most beautiful miracle of all. Imagine, a frail newborn as the son of God? An itty bitty bit of bread turns into his actual body, not just once, but every day, all over the place. You talk about fear? This is TERRIFYING. But He loves us so much, that He sacrificed His perfect adult body so that everyone would be able to have the chance to hold his little frail body in our soft hands and hearts. He loved us enough that He sacrificed Himself for the greater good. He was the first into battle. If that’s not a man, I don’t know what is. I hope you’ve found yourself a man, there, Miss kitty.

He gave us our wits, but He also wants us to trust. I really feel like the 2 of these have to dance together. Does this make sense?
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Exactly: God giveth life, God taketh it away! Therefore I do not have the right to intentionally bring a child into this situation knowing that he will die. God has the right to do this to his own son if he wants to, and nobody else!
 
I don’t know your whole situation but from just what you’ve told us, I personally think it would be wise to sacrifice relations for a more stable situation. This is a very personal decision and I can’t make any judgements, here. Good luck with everything. Trust in God’s goodness. 🙂

Were you making a larger statement, though? I don’t want to sidetrack the thread.
 
faithsmind said:
You feel Western society has been strengthened since the beginning of the increase of the use of contraception? In what way, specifically? Meaning, what positive social trends have increased? Do you feel this overrides the negative social trends that have spiked since the onset of common use of the pill and condoms?

Why do you think there is such a spike in pornography, violence against women, divorce, and unplanned pregnancy, which has directly coincided with the increased use of BC? Do you think it’s simply a matter of coincidence, a matter of increase studies in this area? You don’t think this has anything to do with the facade that BC has created, encouraging the lack of understanding that sex is powerful and creates human life?

Do you, personally, see children as a burden?
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In order:

Yes, I do feel Western society has been strengthened with the increase of the use of contraception. Women are now free from the shackles of being forced into motherhood and can now delay it until they’re ready or forgo it completely. Children don’t have to be brought into a world that isn’t ready for them and can’t take care of them. These are certainly good things, and in my view, the positives outweigh the negatives.

I believe that three of those have no correlation with the increase of birth control, which means it is purely a coincidence. The last one, the increase of unplanned pregnancies, has a negative correlation with birth control, meaning that if you eliminate birth control, unplanned pregnancies would increase.

The increase in porn is because of the rise of the internet. That has nothing to do with birth control. The increase in violence against women is because of the fact that the world has become much smaller in the last few decades. It used to take months for word to get about what happened in regimes like North Korea and Cambodia. Now we find out in minutes. That has nothing to do with birth control. The increase in divorce is because it has become more and more socially acceptable to split up when things aren’t going well. Sad, but that also has nothing to do with birth control.

The unplanned pregnancies have increased because as divorce has risen, unplanned pregnancy is no longer a source of shame for the woman. Unplanned pregnancies have always happened, but it used to be hidden under the cover of marriage. They haven’t actually risen, more of them just happen to get reported now. I believe that birth control has caused unplanned pregnancies to drop, and this is also a good thing.

Yes, I personally do see children as a burden. And yes, I stand by the Philadelphia article. All of the sources in that piece are reputable.
 
NightHawk2005 said:
I believe that three of those have no correlation with the increase of birth control, which means it is purely a coincidence. The last one, the increase of unplanned pregnancies, has a negative correlation with birth control, meaning that if you eliminate birth control, unplanned pregnancies would increase.

The increase in porn is because of the rise of the internet. That has nothing to do with birth control. The increase in violence against women is because of the fact that the world has become much smaller in the last few decades. It used to take months for word to get about what happened in regimes like North Korea and Cambodia. Now we find out in minutes. That has nothing to do with birth control. The increase in divorce is because it has become more and more socially acceptable to split up when things aren’t going well. Sad, but that also has nothing to do with birth control.

The unplanned pregnancies have increased because as divorce has risen, unplanned pregnancy is no longer a source of shame for the woman. Unplanned pregnancies have always happened, but it used to be hidden under the cover of marriage. They haven’t actually risen, more of them just happen to get reported now. I believe that birth control has caused unplanned pregnancies to drop, and this is also a good thing.
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I agree with these observations. Birth control has had some negative effects, but it is not responsible for the problems stated above, and I wouldn’t say it is the root cause of the collapse of western society.
 
NightHawk2005 said:
In order:

Yes, I do feel Western society has been strengthened with the increase of the use of contraception. Women are now free from the shackles of being forced into motherhood and can now delay it until they’re ready or forgo it completely. Children don’t have to be brought into a world that isn’t ready for them and can’t take care of them. These are certainly good things, and in my view, the positives outweigh the negatives.

I believe that three of those have no correlation with the increase of birth control, which means it is purely a coincidence. The last one, the increase of unplanned pregnancies, has a negative correlation with birth control, meaning that if you eliminate birth control, unplanned pregnancies would increase.

The increase in porn is because of the rise of the internet. That has nothing to do with birth control. The increase in violence against women is because of the fact that the world has become much smaller in the last few decades. It used to take months for word to get about what happened in regimes like North Korea and Cambodia. Now we find out in minutes. That has nothing to do with birth control. The increase in divorce is because it has become more and more socially acceptable to split up when things aren’t going well. Sad, but that also has nothing to do with birth control.

The unplanned pregnancies have increased because as divorce has risen, unplanned pregnancy is no longer a source of shame for the woman. Unplanned pregnancies have always happened, but it used to be hidden under the cover of marriage. They haven’t actually risen, more of them just happen to get reported now. I believe that birth control has caused unplanned pregnancies to drop, and this is also a good thing.

Yes, I personally do see children as a burden. And yes, I stand by the Philadelphia article. All of the sources in that piece are reputable.
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I can’t really argue with anything you’ve said here, since all of it is based on your personal opinions and assumptions and you seem to be an expert on that.

All the Best
 
I do have to argue with your last opinion though.

This little guy is sooooo not a “burden”, and I’m willing to bet my life in a heartbeat on that.
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

Something to think about; you may want to keep your statement that children are burdens to yourself while in the same room with moms or dads. Just a leeetle friendly advice.
 
I believe that three of those have no correlation with the increase of birth control, which means it is purely a coincidence. The last one, the increase of unplanned pregnancies, has a negative correlation with birth control, meaning that if you eliminate birth control, unplanned pregnancies would increase.
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That is not necessarily true; it is possible that behavior would adjust to the circumstances.
The increase in porn is because of the rise of the internet.
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Agreed.
 
faithsmind said:
Something to think about; you may want to keep your statement that children are burdens to yourself while in the same room with moms or dads. Just a leeetle friendly advice.
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I’ll say what I wish to say, and if someone doesn’t like it, tough. You asked me if I thought children are a burden, I answered in the affirmative because I believe children are a burden. Don’t ask the question if you’re going to complain if the answer is not to your liking.
 
NightHawk2005 said:
I’ll say what I wish to say, and if someone doesn’t like it, tough. You asked me if I thought children are a burden, I answered in the affirmative because I believe children are a burden. Don’t ask the question if you’re going to complain if the answer is not to your liking.
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I didn’t complain, I just disagreed with your opinion. For you, children are a burden. That makes logical sense on paper. I just find it hard to argue with you with all of your assesments, since all of them are subjective interpretations. My opinion on my child is subjective, as well.

“Do this in memory of me”
 
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