where is the historical church founded by Jesus Christ?

[Dokimas]

Like I said before - we should think and believe - as long as it’s not contrary to the Word of God. The Church was left in charge - the Supreme Authority on earth (Matt. 16:15-19, 18:15-58, John 16:12-15, 20:21-23). I may agree with this statement with two qualifiers: a. it’s not the CC (members of the CC are part of the church) and b. not to lord it over but as servants of.

This authority was not left to the individual or the slinter of a splinter of a splinter some 1500-2000 years later. It was given to the church in general.

There is only ONE truth and ONE authority, which is the pillar and foundation of truth (1 Tim. 3:15).

True: I don’t think you or I understand exactly what that means. God knows.

 

[MyRdmrLvs]

This is a good example of how individualism has affected Christendom. Instead of the disciples worshipping 'God as He has ordained, we see them taking it upon themselves to do it their own way. I think Americans are more prone to this because our nation is founded upon the princples of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. There is a cultural “I, me, me, MINE” in America that seems unique in the world.

In the church I belong to it is very service oriented, its about ministering to others.

 

[MyRdmrLvs]

Again the answer is no. When the Early Fathers of the CHurch down to the current Fathers of the Church can not make a mistake when teaching us the word of God.

I told you once and I will repeat it. It is impossible for the CHURCH to teach us wrong. The CHurch is led by the Power of the Holy Spirit today just as it was yesterday. So nothing is lost.

You continue to turn around the mistakes made by humans in the CC and turn around and blame it on the CHurch which is the living Christ. Now you are turning around not only what others have said here, not you are turning around you own words. Like you do with scripture. I have heard you quite clear, you said the Early Fathers led men astray, and because they could not read, misled them. I remember quite well what you said.

I have told you once and I will repeat it the RCC is led by the Holy Spirit not men. When the Pope teaches us the word of God and speaks ex-cathedra its from the Holy Sprit. Do you know what that means rev?

Is it true that popes promised salvation to anyone who died in the crusades?

 

[MyRdmrLvs]

And therein lies the danger.
You accept him on your terms - not his.

He accepted me on His terms not mine.

 

[MyRdmrLvs]

Putting everything aside, may I ask that you pray for my former wife who has liver cancer.
I was informed a little while ago that she went to the hospital in severe pain. She is a God loving woman and a good harted lady. Please pray for her. Her name is Silvia. Thank you.

I will pray.

 

[Carlan]

He accepted me on His terms not mine.

The drastic conversions I have heard about, have been shared with great humility,the sinner being completely at the end of their own rope, they cry out to the Father in complete surrender to his terms. They go on to lead grace filled lives of spiritual growth in holiness on God’s terms. Thank you Father! God bless, peace, Carlan

 

[Dokimas]

No I don’t just “want” to believe we all have the truth. Jesus told us He was the truth so I believe if we have Him, we have the truth. But yes I do have to turn my cheek a lot.

Very well put. Thank you.

 

[Dokimas]

That’s impossible. How can you compare the Church with a Protestant church of any stripe and say they both have the full truth, even when they deny each other’s teachings?

That’s illogical, and against the teaching of our Holy Mother, the Catholic Church.

I don’t think he said both have the full truth. He said if a person has Jesus that person has the Truth. It’s one thing to have the Truth and it’s quite another think to understand all the truth incorporated in the Truth.

 

[Dokimas]

Am I the only one who find conversations like these to be terribly distressing? They make me almost physically ill to read, and hurt so much.

Jesus loves all of us; I’m a Catholic, and he loves me and the way I choose to worship him and read His word. And he loves Protestants and they way they worship him. As a Catholic I believe I am doing what God wants me to do and has wanted from the beggining, but I also believe he sees the beautiful love in the hearts of all those who follow him, be they Catholic, Protestant, Anglican, whathaveyou.

I’m not trying to go against Church teachings regarding the True church, but I just feel…I don’t know. I know the best of intentions is coming from both sides, but just seeing the frustartion in this thread makes me so sad

Seems to me you’re being very balanced in your understanding of God and His love; seems you’re being very loving too. Thank you for your imput. Let’s cast all our cares upon Him because He cares for us. ( I think it was Peter that said this.)

 

[Dokimas]

That’s not what we’re talking about. You stated the Protestant denominations have “all the truth” equally with the one Church. This is false and the Church is clear about this.

Are you saying if a person truly has Jesus it’s possible for them not to have all the truth?​

The CC, as I read you and others with your bent, is clear that it is the only proclaimer of all the truth. Again, a self serving statement.

 

[Dokimas]

He accepted me on His terms not mine.

Great and freeing point. Thank you.

 

[rinnie]

Rinnie, why did it not translate to Catholic in English? If you cut and style men’s hair I could drive the 1200 miles to PA to give you more time. But I’m certain I’d get a nice haircut.

IT does. But you have to follow the trail. and it will probally be quicker for you go come here and get a haircut before you figure it out And yep I do mens hair too, that how I can be so quick sometimes. Men are easy and quick

The reason the english word church which is used in our english dictionary is taken from the late greek word kyridakon not ekklesia is because kyrdakon only came into being in the 16th centuary long after the N.T times. So the english word church cannot be translated back into Greek because there is no word in the N.T. Greek that is equivalent of the understanding of the english word.

Got THat

 

[rinnie]

Christians have the Holy Bible, from the Apostles. What informatin do you have that has been passed down that we don’t have.

Tell me what truth are Christians missing?

What Sacred tradition has been added to by the Catholic Church about Jesus that Christians don’t have?

The only traditions I see being added are about Mary, the Pope, indulgences.

I am sorry but Tradition is oral teaching’s and only the CC has them. So the truth that other Church’s are missing is Oral Teaching’s that are passed down Oral to other members of the Church.

The Priests learn these from the Popes and Bishops of the CC. If your Church has them how did they get them?

 

[rinnie]

Is it true that popes promised salvation to anyone who died in the crusades?

Listen, do me a big fat favor okay Read what I am going to write, 4 maybe 400 times, whatever it takes to sink in:

Salvation comes from the CC which is the Living Christ. Not the POPE!!! The Pope is put here to teach the word of Christ with his Bishops and Priests. He cannot save you only God can. The only way the Pope can save you is one way. If you listen to the word that is given to him by God. If you obey the word of God and keep his commandments you can be saved. If not there is nothing the Pope, a Bishop, or a Priest can do for you.

You have free will. You either use it and hear what the Pope is commanded by God to say, or you choose to ignore it and go your own way.

If you confess your sin to the Priest, Bishops, or the Pope for that matter they have the right to forgive you with he power that God gave them. Thats the only way. IT is not them personally giving forgiveness it is them exercising the power given to them from Jesus Christ.

Read this scripture:

Luke 10:16 WHOEVER HEARS YOU HEARS ME.

JOHN 14:16, 16, 26 THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL BE WITH YOU ALWAYS TO TEACH AND REMIND YOU OF EVERYTHING.

Tell me MYRD was Jesus talking to you or the Apostles?

Matt 18:18 Jesus gives the APOSTLES THE POWER TO LEGISLATE.
Matt 18:17 He gives them the power to discipline.

Who are YOU to remove this power, and take it upon yourself to take over.

I obey the word of God buddy, I don’t write it, and I don’t twist it to make it what I want. IF you do not hear the words of the Pope and Bishops and Priests that has been given to them at the laying of hands in Holy Orders how in the world would I think you will listen to me. I am only repeating what God said, and so are they:shrug:

 

[rinnie]

If you think he’s getting through I think you are wrong. He is hurting your cause, IMO.

Dokimas I believe you, no one is going to get through to you, because you have free will to accept the teachings of the CC or reject them. And you choose to reject them. But why blame your brothers and sisters here in Christ who are giving you Scripture GODS WORD to try to show you the light.

Its not thier words Dokimas, its Gods. They are only quoting scripture. You ask for scripture, then they give it to you, then you get upset.

They are doing what you ask. And if it disagree with what you think you get angry. Don;t be mad get GLAD!!

 

[Dokimas]

Dokimas I believe you, no one is going to get through to you, because you have free will to accept the teachings of the CC or reject them. And you choose to reject them. But why blame your brothers and sisters here in Christ who are giving you Scripture GODS WORD to try to show you the light.

Its not thier words Dokimas, its Gods. They are only quoting scripture. You ask for scripture, then they give it to you, then you get upset.

They are doing what you ask. And if it disagree with what you think you get angry. Don;t be mad get GLAD!!

Which teachings do I reject that is vital for my eternal salvation?​

Which teachings do I reject that is vital for a wonderful daily relationship Jesus, having His joy, peace and love?​

What do you mean by ‘blame’? Who am I blaming and for what am I blaming them? I’m confused.​

At what point have I gotten angry? Again I’m confused. Where have I got upset at a verse of the Bible given to me to answer a question? Confusion continues.​

I sure hope you can provide evidence so I can self examine. Please help.

 

[Dokimas]

Listen, do me a big fat favor okay Read what I am going to write, 4 maybe 400 times, whatever it takes to sink in:

Salvation comes from the CC which is the Living Christ. Not the POPE!!! The Pope is put here to teach the word of Christ with his Bishops and Priests. He cannot save you only God can. The only way the Pope can save you is one way. If you listen to the word that is given to him by God. If you obey the word of God and keep his commandments you can be saved. If not there is nothing the Pope, a Bishop, or a Priest can do for you.

You have free will. You either use it and hear what the Pope is commanded by God to say, or you choose to ignore it and go your own way.

If you confess your sin to the Priest, Bishops, or the Pope for that matter they have the right to forgive you with he power that God gave them. Thats the only way. IT is not them personally giving forgiveness it is them exercising the power given to them from Jesus Christ.

Read this scripture:

Luke 10:16 WHOEVER HEARS YOU HEARS ME.

JOHN 14:16, 16, 26 THE HOLY SPIRIT WILL BE WITH YOU ALWAYS TO TEACH AND REMIND YOU OF EVERYTHING.

Tell me MYRD was Jesus talking to you or the Apostles?

Matt 18:18 Jesus gives the APOSTLES THE POWER TO LEGISLATE.
Matt 18:17 He gives them the power to discipline.

Who are YOU to remove this power, and take it upon yourself to take over.

I obey the word of God buddy, I don’t write it, and I don’t twist it to make it what I want. IF you do not hear the words of the Pope and Bishops and Priests that has been given to them at the laying of hands in Holy Orders how in the world would I think you will listen to me. I am only repeating what God said, and so are they:shrug:

You are saying the CC = Jesus.?.?​

Then you said only God can save us. The CC = Jesus; Jesus is God; only God saves; the CC, which is Jesus, Who is God, saves us. The short: only the CC can save us. Quite an admission.

 

[rinnie]

You are saying the CC = Jesus.?.?​

Then you said only God can save us. The CC = Jesus; Jesus is God; only God saves; the CC, which is Jesus, Who is God, saves us. The short: only the CC can save us. Quite an admission.

Yes I am. Jesus Christ is the Church, the Church is the Living Christ. You can only be saved through the CC which is the living Christ.

Yep Thats it:thumbsup:

 

[rinnie]

Are you saying if a person truly has Jesus it’s possible for them not to have all the truth?​

The CC, as I read you and others with your bent, is clear that it is the only proclaimer of all the truth. Again, a self serving statement.

If I misread forgive me. But saying that Jesus Christ being the CC is a self-serving statement, maybe I took it wrong. So lets start over you explain to me what you mean by that

Jesus Christ said he was the CHurch not us

 

[Carlan]

If you think he’s getting through I think you are wrong. He is hurting your cause, IMO.

Dok, Elvis is here to defend the faith, with the exception of a couple of dissenters, as are the rest of us, I think Elvis does very well, along with Rinnie and others.

If after being made aware of the doctrines of the Church , you do not accept them you say so, no reasons why necessary it is your call.Off you go happy in your decision.
you are most welcome to stay and try to be convinced if you like, we love you.
Just try not to continue to argue the points with a person who is here to defend the Truth of what our Apostolic Church teaches, Thank you kindly! Peace and God’s blessings, Carlan,