L
lil_flower_luv
Guest
You have a great point as always, elvisman. So does that mean people who only know of the Protestant faith are less part of the body than, say… cafeteria Catholics?
- Status
A
adrift
Guest
Excellent! One point Mary and Joseph were married. The engagement did not mean the same as today. Marriage was in two parts. The marriage would take place but the woman would live with her family preparing to take over her husband’s household. This part where they are married but not yet living together is what is referred to as the engagement. That is why Joseph sought to divorce her privately. The second part was the husband taking his wife into his home. This is what the angel told Joseph to do.
E
elvisman
Guest
**It’s not “Elvis or Guan”. **
Guanophore is a very knowledgeable Catholic.
As I said in my post - it may be a case of Elvis and Guan, depending on his context.
L
larkin31
Guest
They hadn’t had sex yet.
But again, i actually think that the whole thing is made up by neurotic patriarchal religious zealots who want to deify their prophet and try to match OT prophecy.
E
elvisman
Guest
That may be so!
As for “Cafeteria Catholics” - Rev. 3:15-67 speaks of them very directly:
**"I know your works; I know that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either cold or hot. So, because you are lukewarm, neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth. **
L
lil_flower_luv
Guest
Correct! Thank you.
L
lil_flower_luv
Guest
:sad_yes:
C
CMatt25
Guest
Therese, this thread is indeed moving so quickly, I added to my post and you had already responded before I did. I became Catholic at age 31 days and confirmed in elementary school. But for instance if I missed Mass on a Thursday Nov 1 some yr that would mortally doom me without repenting for that even if I loved and showed my faith by doing some of those other things actually found in Scripture?
L
larkin31
Guest
Well, someone wrote it down. Either closer to the time of Jesus’ life, or further from it.
And I have no idea how much he would learn about Mary’s life. You claim that they are not having sex, so, I don’t know how much “talk” he is sharing with the mother of god. Maybe none at all. That is all speculative, anyway. No one wrote those talks down, right?
L
larkin31
Guest
even her “thoughtless utterances” shall stand?
wow
she would ask the question because they had not had sex yet. but this does not mean that she was an avowed virgin for life
L
lil_flower_luv
Guest
One word: Confession.
L
lil_flower_luv
Guest
Don’t you see? Adrift and I have tried to explain to you, marriage was not the same then as it is today. Please read post 1424 .
C
CMatt25
Guest
So you would judge me to eternal damnation for having missed Mass on that Thursday and not repenting?
E
elvisman
Guest
This is PRECISELY what her question implies.
Mary’s question to the Angel Gabriel is very telling about her intention to remain a virgin:
Luke 1:34:*** Then Mary said to the angel, *“How can this be, since I do not know a man?”
**Mary was a betrothed girl who knew about marital relations. **
**She didn’t say ****“How can this be, since I have not known a man?” **
*She said “How can this be, since I do not know a man?” *
She was stating her intention to remain a virgin and was puzzled by Gabriel’s announcement that she was to have a child. She knew that God was aware of her intentions. Her bewilderment and the words “I do not know”, as opposed to I have not known”, is clear evidence that she had no intention of having marital relations.
E
elvisman
Guest
I don’t think Lil_flower implied that she was judging you.
Missing mass is a mortal sin - DEPENDING on your intent. If you were sick or couldn’t get there for some reason or were looking after a sick loved one are all valid reasons for missing mass.
REFUSAL to go because of prior plans, football or laziness aren’t.
You know this - nobody has to tell you your intent.
L
lil_flower_luv
Guest
(Stop mingling with your Protestant friends!
) You are Catholic and therefore must obey your Catholic Faith. There is Confession for a reason. And if you have not repented of a mortal sin, then yes, I’m afraid you would face eternal death.
L
Loboto-Me
Guest
What are you talking about? Jesus didn’t ask his most beloved apostle to live with her as a husband! He asked him to go live with her as a son! Also, why would you even suggest that Mary would be having sex and doing some “pillow talk” with anyone?Now as someone who’s been asked by Jesus to care for his mother, I’m sure they must have had quite a few meals together and many discourses as well. Can we speculate that since Jesus’ most beloved apostle would try to find out as much about Jesus’ childhood (the hidden parts) and about Jesus’ mother (the hidden parts) as he possibly could? I know most normal people would want to learn alot about someone who he knows is God made flesh.
C
CMatt25
Guest
:nope: Again depends on what Christ meant by lukewarm.
Is lukewarm confessing in word but with your heart all worldly?
Having dead faith by not expressing it in things like helping the poor, the sick, the naked, the homeless, you know things He actually taught us to do in righteousness?
Or is lukewarm when a professed believer makes no effort to seek God?
I don’t think you can judge.
S
schaick
Guest
Well dudette-semanticsWhat is you problem with what the Pope said here dude?? He said that Mary was the best role model that we could have for a Mother. That no matter what she always stayed true to God and no matter what never had any doubt in her son Jesus Christ. By her example she has proven to us what Hope, and Gods Grace, is how we obtain Salvation. She is the most perfect example of that. God made her pure and free from sin and a perfect example for us to follow. And by her faith in God and grace he has given us she showed us through her son ALL IS POSSIBLE. Again what it your problem man??
There is no problem in the way you worded that Mary is the best role model as an obedient servant of GOD. She is the mother of our saviour Jesus Chist, but nothing more.
By her example she has proven to us what Hope, and Gods Grace, is how we obtain Salvation. That is beautiful.
This is not what these Popes are saying:
The foundation of all our confidence is found in the Virgin Mary. God has committed to her the treasury of all good things, in order that everyone may know that through her are obtained every hope, every grace, and all salvation. For this is His will: that we obtain everything through Mary. Sweet heart of Mary, be my salvation! Pope Pius IX
For, since it is the will of Divine Providence that we should have the God-Man through Mary, there is no other way for us to receive Christ except from her hands. Pope Pius X
He will not taste death forever who, in his dying moments, has recourse to the Blessed Virgin Mary. What will it cost you to save us? Has not Jesus placed in your hands all the treasures of His grace and mercy? You sit crowned as Queen at the right hand of your Son: your dominion reaches as far as the heavens, and to you are subject the earth and all creatures dwelling thereon. Your dominion reaches even down into the abyss of Hell, and you alone O Mary, save us from the hands of Satan. Pope Pius XI
Nothing comes to us except through the mediation of Mary, for such is the will of God. O Virgin Most Holy, no one abounds in the knowledge of God except through thee;** no one O Mother of God, attains salvation except through thee!** Every one of the multitudes, therefore, whom the evil of calamitous circumstances has stolen away from Catholic unity, must be born again to Christ by that same Mother whom God has endowed with a never-failing fertility to bring forth a holy people. Pope Leo XIII
Mary, not one of thy devout servants has ever perished; may I, too, be saved! Pope Benedict XV
Outside this Church there is no salvation and no remission of sins. Pope Boniface VIII
We believe with our hearts and confess with our lips but one Church, not that of heretics, but the Holy Roman, Catholic, and Apostolic Church, outside of which we believe that no one is saved. Pope Innocent III
He who is separated from the Catholic Church will not have life. He who is separated from the body of the Catholic Church, however praiseworthy his conduct may seem otherwise, will never enjoy eternal life, and the wrath of God remains on him by reason of the crime of which he is guilty in living separated from Christ. All those who are separated from the holy universal Church will not be saved. Pope Gregory XVI
It must be held as a matter of faith that outside the Apostolic Roman Church no one can be saved, that the Church is the only Ark of Salvation, and that whoever does not enter it will perish in the Flood. It is a sin to believe that there is salvation outside the Catholic Church! You must indeed see to it that the faithful have fixed firmly in their minds the absolute necessity of the Catholic faith for attaining salvation. Protestantism is the Great Revolt against God. Pope Pius IX
The following is simply a false gospel.
Those outside the Church do not possess the Holy Ghost. The Catholic Church alone is the Body of Christ… and if separated from the Body of Christ he is not one of His members, nor is he fed by His Spirit. Pope Paul VI
No one, even if he pours out his blood for the name of Christ, can be saved unless he remains within the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church. Pope Eugene IV
**We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff. **Pope Boniface VIII
**Into this fold of Jesus Christ no man may enter unless he be led by the Sovereign Pontiff, and only if they be united to him can men be saved. **Pope John XXIII
**Those who are obstinate toward the authority of the Church and the Roman Pontiff… cannot obtain eternal salvation. **Pope Pius IX
C
CMatt25
Guest
Posted by CMatt25
Uh oh. This should be interesting. Elvis or Guan wrong? I wonder which is not Catholic?
Uh oh. This should be interesting. Elvis or Guan wrong? I wonder which is not Catholic?
Dokimas, you are correct. Even though I had hoped my smiley would let it be known I was joking, I am sorry. I should not have allowed myself to post the above. Thank you for reminding me.
- Status