Which dogmas do we have that with certainty excludes universalism?

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Yet there is no dogma that Judas is in hell, nor any other person for that matter. We have all these canonized Saints but not a one canonized person in hell. Do you know why? Because the Church looks to God’s mercy, always.
 
There have been teachings that have been upturned by dogma, though. Teachings have various degrees of authority because they are not all equally protected by infallibility. It’s normal for the church to let competing teachings subsist for centuries before clarification is definitively given in a dogma. The church today teaches we can legitimately hold to evolution as well as creationism. Yet, for the longest time, most people taught creationism (though, not all). Similarly, it appears we can hold to both the possibility of universal salvation as well as the opposite, that many do go to hell, as the church has not condemned either.
 
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Sorry, you haven’t quoted one document that says Judas is in hell. If the Church was so adamant that Judas is in hell they wouldn’t mince words or use euphemisms that are open to interpretation.
 
However, neither you nor I nor the Church can say with certainty whether he repented and begged God for mercy as he was dying. Therefore, none of us can validly assert that he died in mortal sin. (Grave sin? Certainly. But maybe not mortal.)

Your quote from Trent affirmed that he repented of that sin. 😉
 
Now you are getting closer. They imply!!!
Implication is not definitive and is not a Church teaching.
 
It doesn’t say that, either. It says “Judas, repenting, hung himself.” Hanging is not repentance. Ergo, two separate acts. He repented of his sin, but his suicide was out of despair.

Wow. The story keeps changing, post by post. First, they “imply” it. Then, when it becomes obvious that this doesn’t cut the mustard, they “definitively state” it.

Which is it, friend? Your original claim, or your “oops, I shouldn’t have written that” attempt at correction?
 
It does. You’re making the claim that they’re attempting to imply something (that they’re not willing to state), and therefore, that implication is what they say. Got it. Pure implication. Not explicit teaching.

Thanks for clearing that up!
 
I clearly say “SAY”.

Does that help?
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“Say and imply” is neither definitive nor a Church teaching!
 
MarkRome said:
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Vico:
It will be efficacious, in the sense of salvation, only for those that choose to cooperate with grace. God gives sufficient graces to all.
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God never contravenes free will. But the prayers of a righteous man avails much.
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The free will act occurs in the order of time, before the particular judgment. God could make any future or past prayers offered, known to the person before the particular judgment.
 
This is boring. The Church does not teach that Judas or any specific individual is in Hell.
Nobody in this thread agrees with your private interpretations.
 
Vico said:
The free will act occurs in the order of time, before the particular judgment. God could make any future or past prayers offered, known to the person before the particular judgment.
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Yes, but he does not need to know, does he? It’s God who applies the grace wrought by the prayers to the sinner.
 
How many bishops now do you suppose teach what JP II taught? Do they count?
 
Rubee said:
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Vico:
The free will act occurs in the order of time, before the particular judgment. God could make any future or past prayers offered, known to the person before the particular judgment.
Click to expand...
Yes, but he does not need to know, does he? It’s God who applies the grace wrought by the prayers to the sinner.
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The comment is based upon the idea that knowledge may have an effect to sway the free will of the person. Those without a state of sanctifying grace do not have merit nor can gain it, although there may be actual graces given. Do we know that actual grace is wrought by prayers?
 
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This is getting nowhere.

THE CHURCH DOES NOT TEACH THAT JUDAS IS IN HELL. THE CHURCH HAS NEVER TAUGHT THAT ANY INDIVIDUAL IS IN HELL.

I am exiting now because you obviously don’t know what the Church teaches and its fruitless carrying on with this nonsense.
 
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