Who are the protesters behind Occupy Wall Street–and what do they want?

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stinkcat_14 said:
From Greg Mankiw’s blog:

Even leftists believe in property rights
…at least when it comes to their property.

gregmankiw.blogspot.com/2011/10/even-leftists-believe-in-property.html
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Those dirty leftist capitalists.

Anyway, I didn’t know anyone else beside myself ever read Mankiw’s blog.
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SVP:
Read the links posted! In their own words the CPUSA and American Nazi Party support the OWS protests. No tricks. It is the ugly truth that will come to haunt the OWS movement before the end of the year.
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The ugly truth being…? Politics makes strange bedfellows?
 
manualman said:
news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/protestors-behind-occupy-wall-street-want-133222625.html

** I’d like LESS government bureacracy, agencies, red tape and obstructionism, less government funding of dubious programs, grants, handouts** and giveaways to the well connected, less military spending.

I’d also be quite happy to see tax structures changed to place higher burdens on larger companies than exist on smaller ones. I’d favor a constitutional amendment to eliminate the ‘personhood’ status currently enjoyed by corporations in order to limit their political activities. I don’t see why we need a huge agency to review and deny merger requests when they clearly would create corporations “too large to fail.” And so on.

It’s not at all clear to me that this movement is a groundswell demanding that the wealth of the rich be seized and given away to the poor. What I see in everday Americans is disgust with the insider’s club on Wall Street that takes care of each other first and let’s the actual stockholders have the leftovers, when there are any.
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The first paragraph looks pretty much right-wing, while the second seems very much left-wing. What is “personhood” you are writing about and why it should be regulated by the Constitution? You want to eliminate the notion of “legal entity” or what?
 
Here is a scientific poll of the OWS group:

The vast majority of demonstrators are actually employed, and the proportion of protesters unemployed (15%) is within single digits of the national unemployment rate (9.1%).

An overwhelming majority of demonstrators supported Barack Obama in 2008. Now 51% disapprove of the president while 44% approve, and only 48% say they will vote to re-elect him in 2012, while at least a quarter won’t vote.

Fewer than one in three (32%) call themselves Democrats, while roughly the same proportion (33%) say they aren’t represented by any political party.

…

Sixty-five percent say that government has a moral responsibility to guarantee all citizens access to affordable health care, a college education, and a secure retirement—no matter the cost. By a large margin (77%-22%), they support raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans, but 58% oppose raising taxes for everybody, with only 36% in favor. And by a close margin, protesters are divided on whether the bank bailouts were necessary (49%) or unnecessary (51%).

online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576637082965745362.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
 
gilliam said:
Here is a scientific poll of the OWS group:

The vast majority of demonstrators are actually employed, and the proportion of protesters unemployed (15%) is within single digits of the national unemployment rate (9.1%).

An overwhelming majority of demonstrators supported Barack Obama in 2008. Now 51% disapprove of the president while 44% approve, and only 48% say they will vote to re-elect him in 2012, while at least a quarter won’t vote.

Fewer than one in three (32%) call themselves Democrats, while roughly the same proportion (33%) say they aren’t represented by any political party.

…

Sixty-five percent say that government has a moral responsibility to guarantee all citizens access to affordable health care, a college education, and a secure retirement—no matter the cost. By a large margin (77%-22%), they support raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans, but 58% oppose raising taxes for everybody, with only 36% in favor. And by a close margin, protesters are divided on whether the bank bailouts were necessary (49%) or unnecessary (51%).

online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576637082965745362.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
Click to expand...
I would doubt to figure on the number who claim they are employed-employed people can’t spend over three weeks away from the job camping in a park.
 
gilliam said:
Sixty-five percent say that government has a moral responsibility to guarantee all citizens access to affordable health care, a college education, and a secure retirement—no matter the cost. By a large margin (77%-22%), they support raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans, but 58% oppose raising taxes for everybody, with only 36% in favor. And by a close margin, protesters are divided on whether the bank bailouts were necessary (49%) or unnecessary (51%).

online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576637082965745362.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
Click to expand...
So, most of them say its okay to rob from the rich to give to themselves.
 
gilliam said:
Here is a scientific poll of the OWS group:

The vast majority of demonstrators are actually employed, and the proportion of protesters unemployed (15%) is within single digits of the national unemployment rate (9.1%).

An overwhelming majority of demonstrators supported Barack Obama in 2008. Now 51% disapprove of the president while 44% approve, and only 48% say they will vote to re-elect him in 2012, while at least a quarter won’t vote.

Fewer than one in three (32%) call themselves Democrats, while roughly the same proportion (33%) say they aren’t represented by any political party.

…

Sixty-five percent say that government has a moral responsibility to guarantee all citizens access to affordable health care, a college education, and a secure retirement—no matter the cost. By a large margin (77%-22%), they support raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans, but 58% oppose raising taxes for everybody, with only 36% in favor. And by a close margin, protesters are divided on whether the bank bailouts were necessary (49%) or unnecessary (51%).

online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576637082965745362.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
Click to expand...
Their positions are based overwhelmingly in feeling, and have nothing to do with practical realities of a government that is already carrying unsustainable levels of debt.

There is no level of taxing the millionaires and billionaires making over 200k a year that is going to sustain the current level of entitlements, let alone adding trillions of dollars of new ones.

But wouldn’t it be lovely, a perfectly wonderful thing if we could all have our cake and eat it too?
 
Darryl1958 said:
Their positions are based overwhelmingly in feeling, and have nothing to do with practical realities of a government that is already carrying unsustainable levels of debt.

There is no level of taxing the millionaires and billionaires making over 200k a year that is going to sustain the current level of entitlements, let alone adding trillions of dollars of new ones.

But wouldn’t it be lovely, a perfectly wonderful thing if we could all have our cake and eat it too?
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Ya…Marie Antoinette had the same sentiments…didn’t turn out so well for her.
 
Birdpreacher said:
https://imgur.com/yA8fc
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Can you provide a link to the site where you found this? My understanding is that OWS is a grassroots movement without leadership, so I’m curious to know who came up with this.

Regarding Tax Reform #1, the best way is to to drastically reduce or completely remove corporate taxes. Is OWS for that? If not, how do they plan on removing the incentive for companies to move off-shore?
 
gilliam said:
Here is a scientific poll of the OWS group:

The vast majority of demonstrators are actually employed, and the proportion of protesters unemployed (15%) is within single digits of the national unemployment rate (9.1%).

An overwhelming majority of demonstrators supported Barack Obama in 2008. Now 51% disapprove of the president while 44% approve, and only 48% say they will vote to re-elect him in 2012, while at least a quarter won’t vote.

Fewer than one in three (32%) call themselves Democrats, while roughly the same proportion (33%) say they aren’t represented by any political party.

…

Sixty-five percent say that government has a moral responsibility to guarantee all citizens access to affordable health care, a college education, and a secure retirement—no matter the cost. By a large margin (77%-22%), they support raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans, but 58% oppose raising taxes for everybody, with only 36% in favor. And by a close margin, protesters are divided on whether the bank bailouts were necessary (49%) or unnecessary (51%).

online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576637082965745362.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
Click to expand...
I would hesitate to cast these findings as “scientific” without more information.

First, the findings appear in the opinion section (significantly, not the front page news section) of a publication well known for its hostility to the OWS movement, but further…

The act of going to an activist site in itself raises the possibility of bias; it’s like going to the Republican or Democratic Convention and drawing conclusions about the general public’s views based on what you find there.

Second, which 200 did they interview? How did they select the 200? Scientific face to face interviewing requires the interviewers to go to randomly selcted areas where the respondent has little or no foreknowledge that the interviewer is coming. There are strict quadrant quotas to be met. That does not appear to be the case here.
 
gilliam said:
Here is a scientific poll of the OWS group:

The vast majority of demonstrators are actually employed, and the proportion of protesters unemployed (15%) is within single digits of the national unemployment rate (9.1%).
Click to expand...
Hmmmm, how many of those listed as employed are employed to protest here?
Sixty-five percent say that government has a moral responsibility to guarantee all citizens access to affordable health care, a college education, and a secure retirement—no matter the cost. By a large margin (77%-22%), they support raising taxes on the wealthiest Americans, but 58% oppose raising taxes for everybody, with only 36% in favor. And by a close margin, protesters are divided on whether the bank bailouts were necessary (49%) or unnecessary (51%).
Click to expand...
online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576637082965745362.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
Click to expand...
Sigh…
 
rlg94086 said:
Can you provide a link to the site where you found this? My understanding is that OWS is a grassroots movement without leadership, so I’m curious to know who came up with this.

Regarding Tax Reform #1, the best way is to to drastically reduce or completely remove corporate taxes. Is OWS for that? If not, how do they plan on removing the incentive for companies to move off-shore?
Click to expand...
How was our original govt funded by our founding fathers Rig?

Newsflash, it was not on the backs of individual citizens or their incomes.

It was on the backs of commerce being taxed by tariffs on their products, tobacco, tea, alcohol, etc.

The stronger and more voluminous the amount of commerce being bought, sold or shipped, the healthier our govt’s coffers contents for useful purposes like say the Louisiana Purchase and other little things like the purchase of Alaska.

This subtle shifting of tax revenue off the backs of commerce/corporations, onto the backs of individual citizens/consumers, has been the wet dream of every wealthy industrialist for 150 years plus a few centuries!

Study your American history and so no to the neo-conservative NWO movement!

jomoco
 
jomoco said:
How was our original govt funded by our founding fathers Rig?

Newsflash, it was not on the backs of individual citizens or their incomes.

It was on the backs of commerce being taxed by tariffs on their products, tobacco, tea, alcohol, etc.

The stronger and more voluminous the amount of commerce being bought, sold or shipped, the healthier our govt’s coffers contents for useful purposes like say the Louisiana Purchase and other little things like the purchase of Alaska.

This subtle shifting of tax revenue off the backs of commerce/corporations, onto the backs of individual citizens/consumers, has been the wet dream of every wealthy industrialist for 150 years plus a few centuries!

Study your American history and so no to the neo-conservative NWO movement!

jomoco
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Who pays when a tax is imposed on goods? If an import duty has to be paid on tea, where does the money come from?

Also, you may have missed where I asked you how much taxation on the rich would you think fair, and what effect would that have on revenue?
 
Thieves preying on fellow protesters
It’s a den of thieves!

Occupy Wall Street protesters said yesterday that packs of brazen crooks within their ranks have been robbing their fellow demonstrators blind, making off with pricey cameras, phones and laptops – and even a hefty bundle of donated cash and food.
“Stealing is our biggest problem at the moment,” said Nan Terrie, 18, a kitchen and legal-team volunteer from Fort Lauderdale

Read more: nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/criminal_occupation_oh3CnKANUqYHrGPCaZaLRK#ixzz1b9coO1ED
 
jomoco said:
How was our original govt funded by our founding fathers Rig?

Newsflash, it was not on the backs of individual citizens or their incomes.

It was on the backs of commerce being taxed by tariffs on their products, tobacco, tea, alcohol, etc.

The stronger and more voluminous the amount of commerce being bought, sold or shipped, the healthier our govt’s coffers contents for useful purposes like say the Louisiana Purchase and other little things like the purchase of Alaska.

This subtle shifting of tax revenue off the backs of commerce/corporations, onto the backs of individual citizens/consumers, has been the wet dream of every wealthy industrialist for 150 years plus a few centuries!

Study your American history and so no to the neo-conservative NWO movement!

jomoco
Click to expand...
First of all, you make an uncharitable assumption that I don’t know the history of tariffs and taxation in the United States (par for the course). Second, you make the false assumption that tariffs shift tax revenue from “the backs of individual citizens/consumers.” Regardless of where you place the tax revenue, the consumer ends up paying it. What tariffs do is hurt our ability to trade internationally because our tariffs will be answered by targeted tariffs against American goods in other countries. Your solution will only work, if you believe in economic isolationism. It might work, if we go back to the 1700s.

On the other hand, reduced corporate taxes and keeping regulation sensible encourages companies to produce goods here. That said, companies will still move some production overseas in both scenarios - it often makes sense to serve those markets more efficiently. Tariffs certainly won’t stop it…if you produce products for Asia (or Europe, Africa, Australia, South America, Canada, and Mexico) in Asia, you won’t be effected much by paying a tariff to ship it into the US. US consumers will pay more, though…
 
estesbob said:
Thieves preying on fellow protesters
It’s a den of thieves!

Occupy Wall Street protesters said yesterday that packs of brazen crooks within their ranks have been robbing their fellow demonstrators blind, making off with pricey cameras, phones and laptops – and even a hefty bundle of donated cash and food.
“Stealing is our biggest problem at the moment,” said Nan Terrie, 18, a kitchen and legal-team volunteer from Fort Lauderdale

Read more: nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/criminal_occupation_oh3CnKANUqYHrGPCaZaLRK#ixzz1b9coO1ED
Click to expand...
One would have to be awfully naive to not know that thieves work such gatherings - any gathering, even church rallies.
 
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