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catharina
Guest
I find the above reference to be incomprehensible.
Please clarify as best you can. Thank you.
Why Can't Anyone Have A Different Opinion About The Holocaust?
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Please clarify as best you can. Thank you.
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Peter_J
Guest
Personally, I don’t insist on the term “Holocaust”. In fact …
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust#Etymology_and_use_of_the_term
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yellowbird
Guest
Hi Peter J,
I’m not quoting you because I have a question about your comment, but rather, your sig line. I’m curious about it’s meaning?
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Soutane
Guest
Your desperation is very evident when you trot out nonsense like this.So two people lied.For you that is convincing evidence that 6,000,000 Jews did not die?As a Catholic you are duty bound to reflect the position of the Church which is that the holocaust happened and the numbers are undeniable and that all Jews do not share blood guilt over the death of Christ.You have been repeatedly corrected with charity and patience.It is now time for you to reflect on your position as YOU are now causing scandal to your fellow Catholics through your slander of the Jews and intransigence in the face of the truth.
Read your catechism.
Please.
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yellowbird
Guest
Who cares about some couple on a talk show?? So they lied? So what. Oprah once had on a guy who wrote a book about his experiences as a drug addict. Later, it was discovered that a lot of what he said was a lie - it didn’t happen. My belief that there are LOTS of drug addicts hasn’t changed. The fact that the OP keeps pointing to some couple on Oprah is almost comical. The ONLY thing that tells me is Oprah’s staff should do a better job screening her guests.
I’m curious OTCA if you believed in the holocaust prior to discovering the couple lied? I’m going with a shekel that says NO. Who’s in?
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Peter_J
Guest
It comes from this letter. Mostly I like the letter for its entertainment value; but I like that particular line (“if someone can see no problem with The Sound of Music (1965), how can he see a problem with Vatican II (1962-1965)?”) because I think there’s a lot of truth to it.
Or to ignore them. Different circumstances call for different reactions. (
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GKC
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Peter_J
Guest
Wait … you thought it was funny?
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johnbertram
Guest
What difference would the number of peoples change. Is it any different that that of the story of Sodam and Gamorah. Is not the persecusion or death of even one life that belongs to God a holocaust. We may discuss the numbers of those lives taken, but it does in no way justify the crime. Thanks to the Catholic faith for being a tool of God, so that many Jewish peoples were provided with the documentation that enabled them to escape the death chambers. Without the help of many Catholics taking the roll of being thy brother’s keeper many others may have died. The world often asks for an apology from the faith without recognizing efforts it ensused to save live when other countries would not put forth a hand to help deliever these peoples.
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
Gabriel of 12:
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad? Is a known Political radical and cannot be trusted as a human being and Richard Williamson, I really cannot comment because I dont know much about this person.
Sorry I cannot give much of what I do not have on these two particular individuals.
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
You see those who made it legal to kill Jews and Christians do not consider this killing a Sacred Sacrifice to God in the form of going up to God by a male victim only. The Term “Holocaust” does not fit the action. For one, these mass murders included both Christians (Catholics) and Jews of both Male, female genders, including children.
I find the above reference to be incomprehensible.
Please clarify as best you can. Thank you.
Gabriel of 12:
I was referencing the original biblical term “Holocaust” which means a sacrificed burned up to God, in the victim of male animal. The “holocaust” becomes this when God recieves the victim being sacrificed when the smoke of the burning victim rising to the sky, as if it is a sweet oblation unto God’s nostrils. This terminology does not fit the crime from those who differ in opinion of what truly occurred.
Do you know who first applied this biblical sacrifical term “Holocaust” to the mass victims who were murdered?
When a Jew applies this term, Is he/she interpreting that only the Jews were killed, and offered as a sacrifice offfering to God by Jewish males victims only? Or does the term “Holocaust” when used by Jews includes Jews, Christians, woman and children? to which the term “Holocaust” does not apply by definition.
Scholars have referred and used this term “Holocaust” to define which victims of the actual mass murders? And which scholars applied this terminology and why did they select a biblical sacrifical term to define the killing of Woman, children, Christians and Jews? Or were the Scholars only referencing the Male Jews and forgetting the Truth of what really happened? Thus difference of opinions.
I have seen enough film, and still photos to convince me this mass murder of humanity took place, their is no denying it. The Term “Holocaust” if used correctly does not fit the crime. If the term “Holocaust” is only referencing the male Jews, then I would disagree with the term being used here to define the human trajedy of what really took place in history, because it makes a prejudice against those other victims of woman children and Christians who suffered also from these mass murders.
In my opinion as the OP asked for; If your going to use the term “Holocaust” please clarify your position of what you are defining, it is my hope that when the public uses this term “Holocaust” they have the mind set of recalling to memory ALL VICTIMS be it Jews, Christians, Woman and children.
I hope to have cleared up any misconceptions of my opinion here? if you need more clarification another question may be in order?
Peace be with you.
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Peter_J
Guest
No problem.
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catharina
Guest
I was almost afraid that you were referring back to the sacrifice of male animals - and oops - you were. In any event, as others have pointed out, the preferred term used by the Jewish community is SHOAH. It’s Gentiles who use the term Holocaust routinely.I was referencing the original biblical term “Holocaust” which means a sacrificed burned up to God, in the victim of male animal. The “holocaust” becomes this when God recieves the victim being sacrificed when the smoke of the burning victim rising to the sky, as if it is a sweet oblation unto God’s nostrils. This terminology does not fit the crime from those who differ in opinion of what truly occurred.
Do you know who first applied this biblical sacrifical term “Holocaust” to the mass victims who were murdered?
When a Jew applies this term, Is he/she interpreting that only the Jews were killed, and offered as a sacrifice offfering to God by Jewish males victims only? Or does the term “Holocaust” when used by Jews includes Jews, Christians, woman and children? to which the term “Holocaust” does not apply by definition.
Scholars have referred and used this term “Holocaust” to define which victims of the actual mass murders? And which scholars applied this terminology and why did they select a biblical sacrifical term to define the killing of Woman, children, Christians and Jews? Or were the Scholars only referencing the Male Jews and forgetting the Truth of what really happened? Thus difference of opinions.
I have seen enough film, and still photos to convince me this mass murder of humanity took place, their is no denying it. The Term “Holocaust” if used correctly does not fit the crime. If the term “Holocaust” is only referencing the male Jews, then I would disagree with the term being used here to define the human trajedy of what really took place in history, because it makes a prejudice against those other victims of woman children and Christians who suffered also from these mass murders.
In my opinion as the OP asked for; If your going to use the term “Holocaust” please clarify your position of what you are defining, it is my hope that when the public uses this term “Holocaust” they have the mind set of recalling to memory ALL VICTIMS be it Jews, Christians, Woman and children.
I hope to have cleared up any misconceptions of my opinion here? if you need more clarification another question may be in order?
Peace be with you.
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
Gabriel of 12:
The question I would pose to both communities when using these terms: Are they referencing all the victims or only the Jews? That is why I am of my opinion. Because the wording does not clarify the mind set or what is truly being defined?
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catharina
Guest
I can NOT speak for both communities regarding the usage. I do know that the word SHOAH is Hebrew and references the slaughter of the great number of Jews who died at the hands (and will) of the Nazi government in Europe during WWII (and just prior).
Since the Jewish people were marked for total destruction under the heading “Final Solution” and since the commonality of this people was one of religious heritage, there is little doubt in examining genocides that this religious genocide was both unique and utterly, unspeakably horrible. Other religious genocides have followed, (China, Vietnam, Uganda, Rwanda, too many to name) but the planned, total destruction of a religious people (as a people) was and remains unprecedented. Such an offense is an offense against GOD and man.
As Scripture tells us who are Christian, “salvation comes from the Jews.”
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Gabriel_of_12
Guest
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catharina
Guest
!!!
Do the Jewish people recognize the other deaths and suffering of people in WWII? Like, do they know World History? Well, yes.
Does the word SHOAH encompass all who died in that war? I’ve no idea. In general, the word is used to reference the the tragedy of catastrophic proportions that earmarked all Jews for death, for annihilation, for termination.based on their religious heritage. That fact defines a unique crime. It seems no other group was so marked in that war.
I’d like to ask why/how this is an issue in your life? I’ll mention too that I first learned of these facts in a sixth-grade classroom in a Catholic school. At the very same time my classmates and I were learning of Salvation History in our study of the Bible, we were learning of the carnage, suffering and losses of the Jewish people in our World History lessons - with photos included. That was in 1956-57. This is not new news.
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Valke2
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I believe that when referring to the Shoah or the Holocaust, it should only be applied toward the genocide of the European Jews. The murdering of the 5 to 6 million other people in the camps is, IMO, seperate and apart from the Holocaust.
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