Why can't Priests Preach ... like the Protestant Pastors can ?

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One thought is that protestant ministers have more time during the week to prepare sermons because they are not doing the other things that the priest does - one of the main ones would be offering the sacraments on a regular basis or heading out for Last Rights at night or other hours and more.

Sure they may be somewhat busy but probably not as busy as the average priest. Either way, our lives are different.
good day to you father. you are so right, and i thank God for all the Priest do. i do think however that over the past few years, that protestant pastors have been doing more. at least when i look at my parents pastors. they are fortuanate to have 2. and one of them is always going to visit the sick. the shutins etc. i hope this trend continues. also how are you able to keep up with the work load? it must be very difficult to prepare each and every day for the next days mass. to actually find time to put a homily together, as well as working on sundays homily. Peace and may God bless you in all you do:)
 
Not true. Scripture trumps the Catechism.

Their primary commission was given them by the Head of the Church, in the GREAT COMMISSION. [Matt. 28:18-20 "And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. GO therefore AND MAKE disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, TEACHING THEM TO OBSERVE ALL THAT I HAVE COMMANDED YOU; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age.”]

True, ----- much room for improvement … so says Father Corapi.
Which came first? The Church or the Bible? 🙂
 
The Church, unless one is just counting the Old Testament as the Bible.
Like most Catholics, you are assuming that the question concerns the complete Bible.

Certainly Jesus and the Apostles spoke and acted as if they had a Bible (what we call the Old Testament). And not only did they of course lack the NT, but the limits of the OT canon don’t seem to have been entirely clear.

It may be interesting that the NT term is the plural “Scriptures” (literally “writings”–which of course is also the term in the Jewish tradition for the third and least authoritative section of the canon), rather than the singular “Bible” that most Christians use today.

Perhaps the best answer would be that there were Scriptures before there was the Church, but there was no Bible (no completed canonical collection) before there was a Church.

Edwin
 
As someone who more or less grew up going back and forth between Baptist and Catholic religious expressions, and as the grandson of a Baptist reverend doctor, and the nephew of a former Baptist reverend, I’ve had a lot of opportunity to taste both protestant and catholic preaching. I prefer the Catholic model.

In many preaching-central protestant churches there exists a very real danger of a cult of personality developing around a given preacher. I myself have frequently visited churches expressly to hear some particular brilliant firebrand of a preacher. I think at those times my focus was less on Christ and more on the preacher before me. It’s human nature for this to happen. But in the Catholic, or Anglican, or Epicopal, or I assume Lutheran, homily, the focus remains not on the priest, but on Christ. The homily assumes it’s true place in the context of liturgy. I think this is actually good because it discourages the cult of personality.

That said, there is a time for preaching, and there are many great firebrand preachers in the Catholic Church, and there are also poorly equipped, lame, and ineffectual protestant preachers.

I think that the difference is that in the Catholic Church (at our best) we glory in Christ, and often in protestant Churches there is a greater temptation to glory in Pastor Bob…or what have you.
👍

I will add, our priests don’t need to preach as much as speak the truth. Meaning they need to get deeper in their homilies. My pastor is not the best preacher but he tells it like it is. I love it when he talks about abortion or the governments roll in our lives, during his homilies.
 
To address the OP’s question, a few things pop out:
  1. The ‘message’ of Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestantism (where one often sees the fiery preachers)
I think there’s an unfortunate conflation here between “fiery” preaching and good preaching. I’m not concerned with the fact that Catholic priests don’t shout and foam at the mouth–I’m concerned with the fact that their sermons typically lack substance and do not function well as a means of grace for the congregation.

Protestant preaching spans the gamut from highly intellectual, reflective sermons, to the kind of “fiery” preaching you have in mind, to the sort of trite moralizing or “hang-in-there sermons” that are most typical in Catholic preaching.
  1. Since Catholic Priests are highly-educated (remember, at least two years of undergraduate philosophy plus four years of theology to get an MDiv), it just lends itself to a more academic form of preaching.
But most priests don’t sound very academic or even moderately intellectual. Again, you’re going after a straw man. I grew up in largely fundamentalist surroundings and have been Episcopalian for the past eleven years, so I’ve experienced both the “fiery” and the “academic” preaching styles. Catholic preaching (at least, Latin-Rite preaching in North America–I’ve had much better luck in Byzantine Catholicism and in Europe) mostly falls hopelessly short by *either *standard. The very liberal pastor of the Catholic parish I attempted to join in North Carolina was somewhat academic, and I’d say he was one of the best Catholic preachers I’ve heard (leaving aside the question of his orthodoxy–his most interesting sermon was a Jungian interpretation of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin). But he was very far from typical. The typical Catholic sermon is almost unbelievably trite–not academic at all.
  1. Priests are limited by the Lectionary as to what they can preach on. Certainly, there is a lot a Priest could pick from (i.e. OT, Epistle or Gospel reading), but it is not like an E/P preacher who can just randomly decide that preaching on such-and-such topic which just happens to be their pet thing. Also, Priests are limited by the teachings of the Church whereas an E/P preacher can just spout off on whatever they want. Priests are also limited by the liturgy (he cannot just decide to go on a tirade at the beginning of Mass or hit a whammy right at the end).
Again, you’re making a lot of assumptions about Protestants. Many Protestant churches also use the lectionary. Others practice “lectio continua” preaching in which they preach through entire books or passages of the Bible. Again, there are a wide variety of preaching styles in Protestantism, but what is remarkable is that each of them has virtues which are almost entirely lacking in North American Latin-Rite Catholic preaching, while I can’t think of any virtue (except brevity) that is particularly characteristic of Latin-Rite American Catholic preaching.
 
  1. It sometimes seems like E/P preachers-to-be are recruited based on their oratory skills. Since there is much less formal requirements, it can often seem like a person starts off maybe street preaching or being vociferous in a small group and its like they get groomed if they are able to preach on. In the Catholic Church, it seems like public speaking skills are not really used to ‘vet’ future Priests.
Again, you are making assumptions. What you describe is often true in fundamentalist and Pentecostal/Holiness Protestantism.

Please understand that I’m quite aware that there is plenty of bad preaching in Protestantism. I’ve heard my share of bad Protestant sermons. But what I’d think of as a really bad sermon in the Episcopal Church (since that’s the denomination to which I belong and also the denomination whose approach to preaching and worship is closest to that of Catholicism) would be no worse than average in the Catholic Church. And that’s before we get into the various virtues (and accompanying defects) of Reformed or Methodist or Baptist preaching.

I think the key difference is that in Protestantism, preaching is seen as being in some way sacramental. Yes, this goes along with (except perhaps in Anglicanism and Lutheranism) a certain devaluation of the sacraments compared to their place in Catholicism. In classical Protestantism Word and Table are seen as mirrors of each other, and unfortunately in much modern Protestantism the sacraments are ranked much lower than preaching, at least in practice.

But whatever the flaws of this Protestant attitude, I think it’s fair to say that by and large in Protestantism preaching is expected to be a means of grace, to bring people into contact with the living Christ, in a way that it isn’t expected to do in Catholicism. This is driven home for me by the responses of many Catholics on this thread. It’s clear to me that what most of you think of as a good sermon is a sermon that indoctrinates people in what you think are important teachings or practices. While Protestant sermons may do this, the traditional goal of a Protestant sermon is to “preach the Word” and/or (it’s another way of saying the same thing) to “preach the Gospel.” That is to say, the goal is to break open the written Word of God in such a way as to bring people into contact with the living Christ.

I think one obstacle in the way of Catholic priests doing this is the Catholic separation between faith and love/good works, which makes it harder for Catholic priests to “preach the Gospel” in an evangelical sense (because faith is traditionally defined as accepting true doctrine, with love/good works requiring a separate infusion of grace and a separate act of the cooperating human will). But that’s a different discussion.

Another objection a Catholic might have to the statement I just made is that it doesn’t take the Tradition into account. But it would seem to me that Tradition ought to help Catholic preachers in this regard. This brings me to what I see as the other major problem with Catholic preaching, a point where I suspect folks on this forum are more likely to agree with me.

Catholic priests are (rightly, in my opinion) expected to preach from the lectionary. But at the same time, their Scripture classes in seminary have been dominated by historical criticism. I’m not opposed to historical criticism, but when it is taken as *the *way for Christians to interpret Scripture, and the only legitimate basis for exegetical preaching, it makes vibrant preaching difficult if not impossible. This is less of a problem for evangelical Protestants, both because they are taught a more conservative form of Biblical scholarship (the “grammatical-historical method,” which I see as a conservative variant of historical criticism but which many Protestants insist is something quite different) and because of the doctrine of sola scriptura. Protestantism rests (if it rests at all, which is dubious) on the premise that if you can’t support your theology or preaching by your exegesis, then the theology/preaching needs to change. (That is perhaps the most practical way of defining sola scriptura.)

In post-Vatican-II American Roman Catholicism (using “Roman” here in distinction from the Eastern Catholic churches), the combination of historical criticism, lectionary preaching, and the Catholic doctrine of tradition seems to result in the following conclusions:
  1. Good Biblical scholarship often does not support Catholic teaching.
  2. That doesn’t matter, because Catholics believe in Sacred Tradition.
  3. However, preaching is supposed to be based on Scripture.
That means that in practice there is a lot of Catholic teaching that “doesn’t preach.” Preachers are thus left with relatively little to say, and certainly with large areas of Catholic theology and spiritual life about which they can’t speak from the pulpit without failing to preach from Scripture.

As with so many other aspects of the North American post-VatII status quo, this isn’t quite what Vatican II called for. Dei Verbum speaks of a dynamic, interpenetrating relationship between Scripture and Tradition. But to make that a living reality Catholics need to return to a more traditional, more mystical way of reading Scripture. I don’t think Catholic preaching has a chance of improving until that happens. That’s where the work of folks like Scott Hahn is very important, I think. One of my friends from Duke, Tim Gray, studied with Hahn and now teaches Scripture at the Denver diocesan seminary. Perhaps that’s a sign of hope.

Edwin
 
Even Jesus said the Jews must still follow the teachings of the Pharisees and other teachers of the Law. This proves an authority outside scripture. The Church came before the New Testament. The New Testament is infallible, therefore the authority that determined the Canon must also be infallible. If you want to carry on with this, start a separate thread. Lets not derail the topic of this thread
 
As a former Episcopalian I found that most of the preaching done was by intellecturals and in many ways over the heads of the congregation. Ordinary people are not theologians and many priests did not really relate to our everyday lives.

In my Lain Rite Catholic Church our priests go straight to the subject in terms we understand and bring in personal experiences that we can relate to. I prefer the homilies I have heard in my parish over what I heard as an Episcopalian.

I have also heard fundamentalist sermons and they were mostly yelling and speaking about hell or maybe another subject the preacher felt comfortable with.

I am sure there are all kinds of preaching in each denomination, but I like to hear how the Gospel pertains to my everyday life. We are told the consequences of sin, but none of this “acting” that some preachers have a tendency to do. There are no dramatics etc.

In fact, yesterday our priest spoke to my heart and described exactly what my family was going through. He is not afraid to say that he has had to deal with his own issues in his family. I never heard this in any other church.

I think we all have our own personal tastes on what and how we want to hear a sermon and debating which is better is not the issue. It is all personal in my opinion.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
 
As a former Episcopalian I found that most of the preaching done was by intellecturals and in many ways over the heads of the congregation. Ordinary people are not theologians and many priests did not really relate to our everyday lives.
You ought to try sermons from Cavinistic Reformed preachers. They started putting cushions on the back of pews to avoid concussions. 😃
 
Which came first? The Church or the Bible? 🙂
The WORD, the Alpha & Omega, preceded both.

I think we both are embarrassed/shamed by our Church’s conduct over sins in the Priesthood. On the otherhand, we will never have such sorrow with the eternal New Covenant Bible.
 
Jesus the fullness of revelation was revealed to the Church. Jesus didn’t just leave behind a book. Jesus didn’t command anything to be written. He left behind a Church to real his Word to mankind. The Church is the pinnacle and foundation of truth(1 Timothy 3:15). The Church developed our current New Testament and whole Bible as a portion of the divine revelation that was revealed to the Church by the Holy Spirit. Scripture, Sacred Tradition and The Magisterium(Teaching authority of the Church) are three inseparable instruments of Divine revlation. You can’t just use Sacred Scripture because it alone is not the fullness of Divine Revelation.
 
I think there’s an unfortunate conflation here between “fiery” preaching and good preaching. I’m not concerned with the fact that Catholic priests don’t shout and foam at the mouth–I’m concerned with the fact that their sermons typically lack substance and do not function well as a means of grace for the congregation.

Protestant preaching spans the gamut from highly intellectual, reflective sermons, to the kind of “fiery” preaching you have in mind, to the sort of trite moralizing or “hang-in-there sermons” that are most typical in Catholic preaching.

But most priests don’t sound very academic or even moderately intellectual. Again, you’re going after a straw man. I grew up in largely fundamentalist surroundings and have been Episcopalian for the past eleven years, so I’ve experienced both the “fiery” and the “academic” preaching styles. Catholic preaching (at least, Latin-Rite preaching in North America–I’ve had much better luck in Byzantine Catholicism and in Europe) mostly falls hopelessly short by *either *standard. The very liberal pastor of the Catholic parish I attempted to join in North Carolina was somewhat academic, and I’d say he was one of the best Catholic preachers I’ve heard (leaving aside the question of his orthodoxy–his most interesting sermon was a Jungian interpretation of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin). But he was very far from typical. The typical Catholic sermon is almost unbelievably trite–not academic at all.

Again, you’re making a lot of assumptions about Protestants. Many Protestant churches also use the lectionary. Others practice “lectio continua” preaching in which they preach through entire books or passages of the Bible. Again, there are a wide variety of preaching styles in Protestantism, but what is remarkable is that each of them has virtues which are almost entirely lacking in North American Latin-Rite Catholic preaching, while I can’t think of any virtue (except brevity) that is particularly characteristic of Latin-Rite American Catholic preaching.
 
The very liberal pastor of the Catholic parish I attempted to join in North Carolina was somewhat academic, and I’d say he was one of the best Catholic preachers I’ve heard (leaving aside the question of his orthodoxy–his most interesting sermon was a Jungian interpretation of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin).
Yes, some on the forum make it sound like wooliness is only something Anglicans suffer from.
think one obstacle in the way of Catholic priests doing this is the Catholic separation between faith and love/good works, which makes it harder for Catholic priests to “preach the Gospel” in an evangelical sense
Catholics being evangelical is much harder. It comes down to the issues caused by Martin Luther, at Trent unfortunately Rome defined itself against Luther, even though the evangelical proclamation is something that has been preached throughout the history of the Church.

Catholics think faith is something purely propositional, whereas I think Protestant theology sees faith as trust in the Person of Jesus Christ, being called into a relationship with Him.
Another objection a Catholic might have to the statement I just made is that it doesn’t take the Tradition into account. But it would seem to me that Tradition ought to help Catholic preachers in this regard.
I have heard some Anglican sermons that weren’t directly on the Bible/Scriptures. They were about saints. But this was from a CoE lay preacher (she preached on St. Monica, and how St. Monica’s persistence related to her own life, she also did a few other sermons on saints as well throughout the year).
 
I think we both are embarrassed/shamed by our Church’s conduct over sins in the Priesthood. On the otherhand, we will never have such sorrow with the eternal New Covenant Bible.
What on earth is the eternal New Covenant Bible? And if the Bible is the only source of truth/lack of sorrow, then what did Christians do for the first four centuries of Christendom before the New Testament Canon was determined? And after that, what about the fact that almost no one had access to it until the invention of the printing press in the 15th century? And the issue of literacy…and…and…

I would argue that reliance on the Bible alone as the only source of authority has caused great sorrow in the Body of Christ. I know, I experienced it. How can the fact that we have 39,000 protestant denominations NOT bring sorrow? The priestly scandals are a completely different discussion. Protestant denominations have their scandals. The fact that they rely on the Bible alone hasn’t prevented abuses in their churches. I just googled “sexual abuses in protestant churches” and came up with 252,000 results.

The Christian faith is not a “religion of the book.” Christianity is the religion of the “Word” of God, a word which is “not a written and mute word, but the Word is incarnate and living.” CCC 108

“Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written.” John 21:25

Catholics have the fullness of the Word of God, the written Word of God in Sacred Scripture, **and **the Word of God given to us in Sacred Tradition. “So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter.” 2 Thess. 2:15

And we have the Word made flesh in the Eucharist. Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him. Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me.” John 6:53-57
 
I think there’s an unfortunate conflation here between “fiery” preaching and good preaching. I’m not concerned with the fact that Catholic priests don’t shout and foam at the mouth–I’m concerned with the fact that their sermons typically lack substance and do not function well as a means of grace for the congregation.

Protestant preaching spans the gamut from highly intellectual, reflective sermons, to the kind of “fiery” preaching you have in mind, to the sort of trite moralizing or “hang-in-there sermons” that are most typical in Catholic preaching.

The typical Catholic sermon is almost unbelievably trite–not academic at all.

.
Ooh, pot ‘n’ kettle!

Who’s making assumptions here? You’re not even Catholic. How many homilies from Catholic priests can you have heard?

Do you travel the country in search of tepid Catholic homilies? Do you visit say, ten parishes per week?

Yet you feel qualified to judge US?
 
In many preaching-central protestant churches there exists a very real danger of a cult of personality developing around a given preacher. I myself have frequently visited churches expressly to hear some particular brilliant firebrand of a preacher. I think at those times my focus was less on Christ and more on the preacher before me. It’s human nature for this to happen. But in the Catholic, or Anglican, or Epicopal, or I assume Lutheran, homily, the focus remains not on the priest, but on Christ. The homily assumes it’s true place in the context of liturgy. I think this is actually good because it discourages the cult of personality.

That said, there is a time for preaching, and there are many great firebrand preachers in the Catholic Church, and there are also poorly equipped, lame, and ineffectual protestant preachers.

I think that the difference is that in the Catholic Church (at our best) we glory in Christ, and often in protestant Churches there is a greater temptation to glory in Pastor Bob…or what have you.
I think this is a good and fair post. I have only ever attended, one Baptist service and one Lutheran service in my life time and the most Potestant peaching I have heard is on television and I have always sensed the histrionics in many , I pefer the quiet substance of the Catholic preacher ,myself.🙂 Pax, Carlan
 
Again, you’re making a lot of assumptions about Protestants.

Again, there are a wide variety of preaching styles in Protestantism, but what is remarkable is that each of them has virtues which are almost entirely lacking in North American Latin-Rite Catholic preaching, while I can’t think of any virtue (except brevity) that is particularly characteristic of Latin-Rite American Catholic preaching.
And you turned around and did exactly the same. I should very much like to see your well-researched study of the hundreds of Catholic parishes in which you have attended Mass.

Why don’t you listen to this Catholic homily? He’s one of the priests in our diocese. Under his picture, click on his most recent homily. The one up today is from Palm Sunday. Or have you already visited his parish?

catholichomily.org/
 
And we have the Word made flesh in the Eucharist. Jesus said to them, “I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him. Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me.” John 6:53-57
Yes, we have the true Sacrament. But, Corapi and I ] are concerned why our Priests are not ON FIRE with the Good News message to this lost world. Rather, we find our Church embroilled in a RECURRENT sexual scandal, that now implicates the Holy Father Benedict an issue on MORALS … as we now see it being played out in the news]. Its high time the corruption of the 70’s/80’s/90’s got swept away by a new priesthood that is after God’s on Heart. Perhaps we need a new, young, vibrant leader … like JP2 ?

God give us some shepherds again like the Apostles and ECF’s … who can preach like the Protestants, and be as charismatic as JP2 !
 
Yes, we have the true Sacrament. But, Corapi and I ] are concerned why our Priests are not ON FIRE with the Good News message to this lost world. Rather, we find our Church embroilled in a RECURRENT sexual scandal, that now implicates the Holy Father Benedict an issue on MORALS … as we now see it being played out in the news]. Its high time the corruption of the 70’s/80’s/90’s got swept away by a new priesthood that is after God’s on Heart. Perhaps we need a new, young, vibrant leader … like JP2 ?

God give us some shepherds again like the Apostles and ECF’s … who can preach like the Protestants, and be as charismatic as JP2 !
There is much to say about this, but I have to go to work so will answer you later today. But your statement that these scandals implicate Pope Benedict are unfounded. He has done more than anyone to clean up this mess. Believe me I know, I work for the Church. I can’t even have a teen volunteer serve in children’s ministry without a background check. And this is a direct result of our current Holy Father’s management of the situation. The scandals aren’t recurrent, they’re decades old.

Did you listen to the Catholic homily I provided above? I could link many, many fiery and charismatic Protestant homilies…full of heresy. I’ll take the truth, thanks.
 
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