Why do people leave the Catholic Church?

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rinnie said:
Hisalone, Why do you deny that a Statue of Jesus Christ is not the image of God. Why do you choose to totally ignore the NT.

Did Jesus Christ not reveal himself in the image of man. But you for some reason refuse to except this teachings. You instead insist to go back to the OT readings where indeed God did not reveal himself as man.

Again why do you insist on saying a statue of Jesus Christ is a graven image? CAN you answer this question?🤷
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Exodus 20:4 "You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth;
 
mario_grgic said:
Hisalone;4873512:
Gee, is that all you have? Did you know that Catholics are born again?

Some are.
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Winter solstice was/is a pagan holiday, and church has replaced it successfully with a Christian one, which in my mind is a good thing.

Why would you want to celebrate the birth of Jesus on any other day than he was born.

Easter is the time Jesus was crucified, died on the cross and resurrected 3 days later. So what’s your problem with that? It is on the right date.

It is not on the right date.

You know you have been educated to hate the God’s true church without ever questioning where that hatred comes from. Why was it started and for what motive. Yet again you are doing things in the spirit of Satan.

I have been educated to know Gods truth no matter where the chips may fall.

As for your last sentence HOGWASH
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elvisman said:
What about the pictures in your wallet or the ones hanging on your walls?
One of the saddest things about this flawed interpretation of Scripture is that you have twisted it to your own destruction – as you have many others.

Exodus 20:4 "You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth;
Seems pretty clear to me.Why do you disobey a direct command of God?
**Exodus 20:3-5 **explicitly states that God is speaking of IDOL WORSHIP – not the making of images themselves. This is why he told them to make the golden cherubim atop the Ark. They were allowed to make things – just not WORSHIP them.
You shall not have other gods besides me.
You shall not carve idols for yourselves in the shape of anything in the sky above or on the earth below or in the waters beneath the earth;
you shall not bow down before them or worship them.

**Oh, **really? Where?
**God instructed Moses to make a **bronze serpent and place it on a pole so that those who looked on it were cured.
**Read Scripture in **CONTEXT, my confused friend.

What about when they are depictions of Him and his Truths?

Which question is this an answer to?

**That’s **not what Scripture says. Where did you get this from?

The Church has never compromised herself. There have been weak or corrupt leaders but that doesn’t nullify the truth.
Please show me where the Church compromises with paganism. I must know where you’re getting this tripe. If you refuse to tell me – it only illustrates another empty, false accusation.
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I really cannot address your points if you continue to use all the colors and fonts it makes it impossibe to read in the quote possition.

But a couple of questions why do you presume total liscence to make statues and images because God has directly commanded in a couple of instances to make specific images?
How can a compromised Church be the pillar of truth?
 
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mario_grgic:
Protestantism is total absurdity. So why should I even have a discourse with you?
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I am most disappointed at this comment. I would be equally disappointed if the same was said about any religion. Disagreement is one thing - insults are another.

Two comments:
  • with that view there can’t be discourse because there is no openness to what the other person is saying. It just ends up with a slanging match which only ends up reinforcing both people’s view and will probably be a waste of time for all involved.
  • what would be your reaction if the same thing was said about Catholicism, or is this type of “bashing” only allowed one way. I don’t think because a forum is set up to promote/discuss a particular view means that it is okay to “bash” those who disagree. That said, there is also an obligation on the person disagreeing not to “bash” too.
Just remember disagreeing in itself does not equal “bashing” and stating something you believe is that - your belief, your view - it does not make it intrinsically correct.
 
Salonika said:
I am most disappointed at this comment. I would be equally disappointed if the same was said about any religion. Disagreement is one thing - insults are another.

Two comments:
  • with that view there can’t be discourse because there is no openness to what the other person is saying. It just ends up with a slanging match which only ends up reinforcing both people’s view and will probably be a waste of time for all involved.
  • what would be your reaction if the same thing was said about Catholicism, or is this type of “bashing” only allowed one way. I don’t think because a forum is set up to promote/discuss a particular view means that it is okay to “bash” those who disagree. That said, there is also an obligation on the person disagreeing not to “bash” too.
Just remember disagreeing in itself does not equal “bashing” and stating something you believe is that - your belief, your view - it does not make it intrinsically correct.
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Actually, if you paid attention same has been said repeatedly here about Catholic church by protestant satanists all along. Nothing new here. But I am not surprised. Protestantism defines itself as NOT catholic, where ever that may lead them (apparently directly to hell).
 
Hisalone said:
I really cannot address your points if you continue to use all the colors and fonts it makes it impossibe to read in the quote possition.

But a couple of questions why do you presume total liscence to make statues and images because God has directly commanded in a couple of instances to make specific images?
How can a compromised Church be the pillar of truth?
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First of all - the colors are only an excuse for you not to address my questions. The truth is that you can’t answer them.

Secondly I’m not presuming anything.
Your interpretation of Exodus 20:4-5 makes God a hypocrite and a liar. I’m not willing to make that accusation - apparently, you are.
 
mario_grgic said:
Actually, if you paid attention same has been said repeatedly here about Catholic church by protestant satanists all along. Nothing new here. But I am not surprised. Protestantism defines itself as NOT catholic, where ever that may lead them (apparently directly to hell).
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Your reply is an very good example of the type of post I was criticising as unhelpful and find unacceptable, It’s straight name calling and “bashing”. Just because someone else uses this tactic doesn’t make it acceptable in my view and can be seen as lowering yourself to their level.

In fact if people have to resort to “bashing” I begin to wonder about the strength of their arguments.
 
Salonika said:
Your reply is an very good example of the type of post I was criticising as unhelpful and find unacceptable, It’s straight name calling and “bashing”. Just because someone else uses this tactic doesn’t make it acceptable in my view and can be seen as lowering yourself to their level.

In fact if people have to resort to “bashing” I begin to wonder about the strength of their arguments.
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Well, I presented pretty strong arguments. HisAlone apparently refuses to address them at all, since he really can’t. But he chooses to bash catholicism on catholic forum. What a nice guy he is. This is exactly why he deserves the tag name “satan’s little helper”
 
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Hisalone:
I really cannot address your points if you continue to use all the colors and fonts it makes it impossibe to read in the quote possition.
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I agree with your comment Hisalone. Using different fonts and colours can also result in people accidently ascribing views to the wrong person, which often doesn’t go down well.

So okay using “quote” and “reply” makes posts longer but it does make everything much more straighforward.

Also sometimes I feel I am being shouted out, especially when the red font is used.
 
mario_grgic said:
Well, I presented pretty strong arguments. HisAlone apparently refuses to address them at all, since he really can’t. But he chooses to bash catholicism on catholic forum. What a nice guy he is. This is exactly why he deserves the tag name “satan’s little helper”
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I attack ideas and beliefs you attack the person.
 
elvisman said:
First of all - the colors are only an excuse for you not to address my questions. The truth is that you can’t answer them.

Secondly I’m not presuming anything.
Your interpretation of Exodus 20:4-5 makes God a hypocrite and a liar. I’m not willing to make that accusation - apparently, you are.
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Click on quote on any of your posts you will see that it is impossible to read.

Why havent you answered my questions?

How did you get the leap that accuse God of being a liar?
 
I am new to this conversation and haven’t read all the posts, so please forgive me if this is a bit off topic.

I left Christianity and the Catholic Church because I believe that it is based on an inherent (sorry about spelling) mis-truth or rather non-truth: that human being are flawed and are in need of “salvation.”

People can and do choose to turn away from God…but humans are not intrinsically “sinful.”

Humans are good…and God is good and we are supposed to be in a love relationship with Him/her
 
Salonika said:
I agree with your comment Hisalone. Using different fonts and colours can also result in people accidently ascribing views to the wrong person, which often doesn’t go down well.

So okay using “quote” and “reply” makes posts longer but it does make everything much more straighforward.

Also sometimes I feel I am being shouted out, especially when the red font is used.
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Thanks Salonkia others have told elvis the same thing he ignores all.
 
We’re having quite a debate over statues - eg are they graven images or not - aren’t we?

I wonder if there are couple factors in this debate that we haven’t yet considered that can influence people’s view on the images…

This came to mind when I saw the images that have been posted as part of our debate. I find them beautiful as art but would find them very distracting in a church setting. So I I wonder if the plainness of some churches is a result of this preference rather than theology.

Also do some people see more in these images than others - seeing them as representative rather than images alone. Again this would lead to a different view of them.
 
Hisalone said:
I attack ideas and beliefs you attack the person.
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My ideas and beliefs are who I am. Hence you are attacking me. You are attacking the body of Christ. Hence you are getting the reaction that you are.

You come here with preconceived notions about what Catholics believe and put words and beliefs in our mouths.

Your motives are quite clear, and since we are all spiritual here, it is not hard to discern what spiritual creature they come from.
 
elvisman said:
Secondly I’m not presuming anything.
Your interpretation of Exodus 20:4-5 makes God a hypocrite and a liar. I’m not willing to make that accusation - apparently, you are.
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What interpretation of Ex 20:4-5 makes God a hypocrite and a liar?
 
Hisalone said:
Click on quote on any of your posts you will see that it is impossible to read.

Why havent you answered my questions?

How did you get the leap that accuse God of being a liar?
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Okay - I’ll play your game.

Here are the questions you haven’t been able to answer - in plain black and white so there are no excuses:

My question:
“What is your definition of God’s ONE Church?”
Your comment:
“Gods Assembly or Gods Congregation is made up of all born again believers.”
My follow-up question:
“That’s not what Scripture says. Where did you get this from?”
Unanswered Questions:
*What makes the Catholic Church a Church of compromise? *
What makes it bogus?
**
**Your comment:
It is my assertion that the statues placed in Catholic Churchs qualify as graven images.
My question:
What about the pictures in your wallet or the ones hanging on your walls?
Your comment:
“God commanded the Isrealites to make the cheibum. He specifically cammanded that other images not be made. God did not liscence all images by His command as your line of reasoning would suggest.”
My follow-up question:
"Oh, really? Where?
God instructed Moses to make a bronze serpent and place it on a pole so that those who looked on it were cured."
Your comment:
“There are a number of comprimises with paganism but you will not agree to these so the others I will not present them.”
My request:
“Please show me where the Church compromises with paganism.”
Now - enlighten me, please . . .

PS - You call God a liar when you claim he commanded that we make no graven image for any other purpose than to worship because He commanded the making of graven images for other purposes.
 
People leave the Church,
because they find pleasure in this mortal world, and forget God.
But if they would listen perhaps they would find knowledge in the words of Purpose and Law of God.

This Universe has a purpose, does it not?
Other wise it would be a mistake,
and mistakes cancel themselves out.
We know that by intellect which God so instilled in Man,
Just as fish breath underwater and birds fly, God gave us a soul.
And with that soul we govern nature, even now though our souls are imperfect because of the first test failed by Adam and Eve.

Thank you
 
Howie01 said:
What interpretation of Ex 20:4-5 makes God a hypocrite and a liar?
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**The anti-Catholic interpretation that claims God commanded that we make no graven images for any reason. **
He forbade the making of idols for worship. Conversly - He commanded the making of graven images for other purposes.
 
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