Why do Protestant Apologists feel the need to lie about history and the Catholic Church?

[ScottishColleen]

To start with, I wasn’t speaking of doctrinal differences, I simply asked that you not broadbrush. Those sites don’t represent all of us.

Secondly, I didn’t debate whether you were right or wrong. Simply stated that it would be better that you be able to give an answer in your own head or to another that might bring this up to you than to just scream “liars”. It’s what I do with my own Faith.

 

[lavazza]

i am a catholic, i would never call you a liar, we have diffrences about the bible, mary the pope etc. but you are still a christian and brother in christ. any catholic that calls you folks a liar are very stupid.

 

[Petergee]

To start with, I wasn’t speaking of doctrinal differences,

Really? What else could you possibly be referring to by

There were some reasons given why they believe something is heresy…they state, “it’s not found in scripture”. They need to be given an answer and one that comes directly from the Word of God.

.

I simply asked that you not broadbrush. Those sites don’t represent all of us.

I have said absolutely nothing to suggest that they do.

Secondly, I didn’t debate whether you were right or wrong. Simply stated that it would be better that you be able to give an answer in your own head or to another that might bring this up to you

Fine we’ll all just stop talking to each other on mesage forums, we’ll just make up our own minds about everything without communicationg with anyone else.

than to just scream “liars”. It’s what I do with my own Faith.

Who’s screaming? I merely asked, I repeat again, for any example of a protestant apologetic against Catholicism which does not depend on lies about what Catholics believe and do, and/or lies about objectively indisputable historical facts.

I’m really amazed that some people seem so determined to misunderstand and/or misrepresent this simple request.

 

[jpaul]

so jpaul are you saying that he is the devil? seems like kind of a fundamentalist conclusion you are making here.

Peace and all-good!

The **Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights **and the *Christianity Today *conducted investigations on Alberto Rivera and they have the same findings: Mr. Rivera was not among the Catholic priests in the Diocese of Madrid or had been a Jesuit priest.

What do you think of persons who intentionally and repeatedly used lies against the Church founded by Christ?

Ave Maria!

jpaul

 

[Protestant101]

Peace and all-good!

What do you think of persons who intentionally and repeatedly used lies against the Church founded by Christ?

Ave Maria!

jpaul

First, you can’t prove definitively that the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ.

Second; I applaud anyone with enough faith to express their belief, even if it is different than mine. (or your’s).

 

[mgrfin]

First, you can’t prove definitively that the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ.

QUOTE]

We can’t prove it?
Try these:
Mt 16:13-20
Mt 14:24-33
Mk 16:7
Lk 5
Lk 22:31-32
Lk 24:33-35
Jn 20:6
Jn 21:15-19
Acts 1:15-26
Acts 3:1-9
Acts 10-11
Acts 15:6-11
Gal 1:18

Simon Peter is mentioned by name 195 times in the New Testament. Next comes St. John who is mentioned just 29 times. When all twelve Apostles are named, Peter is always listed first; Judas Iscariot is always listed last.

Often it is “Peter and the rest of the Apostles” or “Peter and his companions”.

The authors, Mathew, Mark, Luke and John knew who was in charge, and the Holy Spirit, the Author, knew.

mgrfin

 

[jpaul]

First, you can’t prove definitively that the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ.

Second; I applaud anyone with enough faith to express their belief, even if it is different than mine. (or your’s).

Peace and all-good!

All standard references (Encyclopedia, Church history, World Almanac, etc. ) boldly state that the Roman Catholic Church is founded by Jesus Christ.

The same references state all the Protestant sects with their founders.

Why do you think John Henry Newman converted to the Catholic Church? Simply because he read history and accepted the truth with humility.

According to his humble man who did not only converted to the Church of Chist, but became a Cardinal and a Saint, "to be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant."

Ave Maria!

jpaul

 

[po18guy]

First, you can’t prove definitively that the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ.

Christ did not say, “75 generations from now, I will found my 33,000 denominations upon Martin Luther”

We’re all praying for you. You have spunk!

 

[jpaul]

Christ did not say, “75 generations from now, I will found my 33,000 denominations upon Martin Luther”

We’re all praying for you. You have spunk!

Peace and all-good!

The truth may hurt, but it heals.

Ave Maria!

jpaul

 

[DB_AND_ALI]

First, you can’t prove definitively that the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ.

Second; I applaud anyone with enough faith to express their belief, even if it is different than mine. (or your’s).

For 1053 years folks were very content to belong to the Catholic [universal] church…the church Jesus instructed Peter to lead with authority. It wasn’t by accident that Peter was martyred in Rome , the base and power of western civilisation at the time. Naturally a successor to Peter would have been required [demanded ?] if the church was to proliferate into the future…hence the continuation of the papal line.
Peace to you and i hope you keep an open heart whilst debating on this forum !!!

 

[Nella]

There are countless anti-Catholic websites on the net, all of which contain nothing but lies against the RCC. They do this by grossly misrepresenting Catholic Doctrine, or by simply making up their own history; a history that conflicts with all modern historical evidence. These lies have obviously disseminated throughout the Protestant laity; however I’m not blaming them, they are the product of a 500 year propaganda campaign. Why is there this culture of misinformation among Protestantism?

This is utter disrespect for others here that happen to be non-Catholic. It is funny how things like this just pass through the cracks when they are authored by Catholics but just let a Protestant make a similar statement about Catholics and the boot to the rear end would already be in motion. Your statement about Protestants being liars and being misled in history is ignorant and unfounded. The primacy of Rome has been under constant protest and debate since its conception.

 

[Mannyfit75]

This is utter disrespect for others here that happen to be non-Catholic. It is funny how things like this just pass through the cracks when they are authored by Catholics but just let a Protestant make a similar statement about Catholics and the boot to the rear end would already be in motion. Your statement about Protestants being liars and being misled in history is ignorant and unfounded. The primacy of Rome has been under constant protest and debate since its conception.

I would not say they are liars because many of the Protestants have posted false information about the Catholic Church. Many of these false information come from Ex-Catholics, who were probably poorly catechize in their former faith as Catholics. I do believe it is a issue in the Catholic Church.

Some Non-Catholic Christians who make it their career to attack the Catholic Church by protesting Her doctrines, and claim the Catholic Church to be “whore of Babylon” is very common.

If you want to rebute this, feel free. I have visited many website that portray the Catholic Church as deceptive. Have you heard of the Jack Chick tracts. His comics post many Anti-Catholic Propaganda.

Or how about the Baptist’s false history about the “Trail of Blood” which has been disproven to be false and had no historical support for its claim. (Summary, Trail of Blood is a story that claim that the Baptists have its origin back to time of the Apostles. They were opposed by the Catholic Church. The Trail of Blood is written by M.J. Carroll.

They do believe these lies are true but they aren’t. They are distorted and false, especially when they make distorted views of the Catholic Church.

 

[Nella]

I would not say they are liars because many of the Protestants have posted false information about the Catholic Church. Many of these false information come from Ex-Catholics, who were probably poorly catechize in their former faith as Catholics. I do believe it is a issue in the Catholic Church.

Some Non-Catholic Christians who make it their career to attack the Catholic Church by protesting Her doctrines, and claim the Catholic Church to be “whore of Babylon” is very common.

If you want to rebute this, feel free. I have visited many website that portray the Catholic Church as deceptive. Have you heard of the Jack Chick tracts. His comics post many Anti-Catholic Propaganda.

Or how about the Baptist’s false history about the “Trail of Blood” which has been disproven to be false and had no historical support for its claim. (Summary, Trail of Blood is a story that claim that the Baptists have its origin back to time of the Apostles. They were opposed by the Catholic Church. The Trail of Blood is written by M.J. Carroll.

They do believe these lies are true but they aren’t. They are distorted and false, especially when they make distorted views of the Catholic Church.

I think what you are referring to are many Evangelicals who not only make incorrect assumptions about Catholics, they make them about all liturgical denominations including Anglicans, Lutherans and Orthodox churches. They claim that crossing yourself is taboo and that you should never do this and that holy water is of the same nature. They make many wild false claims and assumptions about Catholics, Orthodox churches and mainline Protestants as well.

 

[Petergee]

**Quote:
Originally Posted by Proletarian
There are countless anti-Catholic websites on the net, all of which contain nothing but lies against the RCC. They do this by grossly misrepresenting Catholic Doctrine, or by simply making up their own history; a history that conflicts with all modern historical evidence. These lies have obviously disseminated throughout the Protestant laity; however I’m not blaming them, they are the product of a 500 year propaganda campaign. Why is there this culture of misinformation among Protestantism?
**This is utter disrespect for others here that happen to be non-Catholic.

Of course it’s not; AFAIK nobody here is the author of any of those sites. (Obviously Proletarian’s statement that the sites contain “nothing but” lies was hyperbole not to be taken literally. All these sites contain SOME lies, but most contain parts of the truth mixed in with them.)

It is funny how things like this just pass through the cracks when they are authored by Catholics but just let a Protestant make a similar statement about Catholics and the boot to the rear end would already be in motion.

That is because nobody, despite repeated requests, has been able to produce even one example of a protestant apologetic against Catholicism which does not resort to blatant lies about history and about Catholic teachings and practices. Whereas no-one could accuse Catholic Answers or other Catholic apologetic sites of making up lies about protestants. It’s obvious that these Catholic apologist sites bend over backwards to fairly and truthfully represent what protestant groups believe and do, and they criticise THAT (not some made-up strawman).

Your statement about Protestants being liars and being misled in history is ignorant and unfounded. The primacy of Rome has been under constant protest and debate since its conception.

Even if this were true it would be irrelevant to the topic. How can I make this more clear: by protestant apologist “lies”, we do NOT mean “disagreeing with Catholic doctrines such as the Petrine primacy”. We mean, as I and others have stated ad nauseam, blatant lies about uncontroversial facts of history and of what Catholics believe and do.

 

[Mannyfit75]

I think what you are referring to are many Evangelicals who not only make incorrect assumptions about Catholics, they make them about all liturgical denominations including Anglicans, Lutherans and Orthodox churches. They claim that crossing yourself is taboo and that you should never do this and that holy water is of the same nature. They make many wild false claims and assumptions about Catholics, Orthodox churches and mainline Protestants as well.

They do. What they presume to be true is nothing but a lie and they firmly believe they are truth doctrines of the Catholic Church. They claim credibility because many of the website users are claimed to be “EX-CATHOLICS.” I read their website and many of them have a poor understanding of Catholic doctrines.

 

[angelusm]

Good question, brother. In my opinion it’s because of their superiority and inferioriry complexes (sorry if it sounds confusing). Superiority complex: we reformed the church so we are better than Roman “Whore of Babilon”. Inferiority complex: protestants know they have nothing that we don’t have, while we have in fact much more. They have no apostolic succession, no Body and Blood, no apparitions (like Fatima). Protestant communities were (are) not independent, they were tools in kings’ hands and were used to achieve secular aims. Telling lies about CC was just a political game. Old myths are still alive and ignorance is one of the sources of protestant hatred against CC.
One more reason: protestants are connected with feemasonry very much and for masons (satanists in fact) the greatest enemy is the Catholic Church (true Church).
In the UK anglicanism is almost a dead religion, they went very far away from the Gospel. It’s just a part of a national tradition, nothing else. But anticatholicism, spread but Anglicans is still strong.

 

[Nella]

Of course it’s not; AFAIK nobody here is the author of any of those sites. (Obviously Proletarian’s statement that the sites contain “nothing but” lies was hyperbole not to be taken literally. All these sites contain SOME lies, but most contain parts of the truth mixed in with them.)That is because nobody, despite repeated requests, has been able to produce even one example of a protestant apologetic against Catholicism which does not resort to blatant lies about history and about Catholic teachings and practices. Whereas no-one could accuse Catholic Answers or other Catholic apologetic sites of making up lies about protestants. It’s obvious that these Catholic apologist sites bend over backwards to fairly and truthfully represent what protestant groups believe and do, and they criticise THAT (not some made-up strawman).Even if this were true it would be irrelevant to the topic. How can I make this more clear: by protestant apologist “lies”, we do NOT mean “disagreeing with Catholic doctrines such as the Petrine primacy”. We mean, as I and others have stated ad nauseam, blatant lies about uncontroversial facts of history and of what Catholics believe and do.

What lies do they tell about the RCC? If you could at least produce those, we could discuss them

 

[Petergee]

What lies do they tell about the RCC? If you could at least produce those, we could discuss them

I and several others on this thread alone have linked to dozens of protestant apologist sites and quoted scores of the blatant lies they tell. If you want to discuss these lies, please do so on another thread.

The purpose of this thread is to ask WHY all protestant apologists who argue against Catholicism apparently MUST blatantly lie about facts of history (which are undisputed by any reputable secular scholar) and facts of what Catholics believe and do (which are freely available for anyone to see).

And secondly for anyone to answer my challenge to find even one protestant apologetic against Catholicism which does NOT depend on such lies. A challenge which no-one has been able to answer. All we get are diversions like yours here.

Of course if such a site did exist, thoughtful and informed Catholics who read it would have to seriously consider the claims of protestantism to the truth. So the fact that no protestant apologist has apparently produced such a site speaks volumes about the falsity of protestant claims; their silence on this drowns out all their bluster on everything else.

 

[Nella]

I and several others on this thread alone have linked to dozens of protestant apologist sites and quoted scores of the blatant lies they tell. If you want to discuss these lies, please do so on another thread.

The purpose of this thread is to ask WHY all protestant apologists who argue against Catholicism apparently MUST blatantly lie about facts of history (which are undisputed by any reputable secular scholar) and facts of what Catholics believe and do (which are freely available for anyone to see).

And secondly for anyone to answer my challenge to find even one protestant apologetic against Catholicism which does NOT depend on such lies. A challenge which no-one has been able to answer. All we get are diversions like yours here.

Of course if such a site did exist, thoughtful and informed Catholics who read it would have to seriously consider the claims of protestantism to the truth. So the fact that no protestant apologist has apparently produced such a site speaks volumes about the falsity of protestant claims; their silence on this drowns out all their bluster on everything else.

Oh ok, just duck everything here. i asked a simple question that you should have been able to produce answers for instantly, that is if you had those answers which apparently you don’t. And why go to yet another thread. The accusation was made here , why not address it here?

 

[Nella]

My Catholic friends, you do a very good job of telling those who you would wish to join your faith, “Let’s just assume”, instead of “let’s see what Jesus really said on these matters”. Why are so many of your doctrines and teachings either not Biblical or counter Biblical?? How can this be pleasing to God. How can you elevate Mary to a supernatural state when Scripture never goes there not once. Queen of heaven?? There can be no such thing. Jesus Christ is the ruler of the universe. Mary is foremost of all saints, no more no less.