Why I left the Catholic Church

[Saint_Michael]

As for anti-semitism, there are reasons why Christians in the past have had hard feelings towards the Jews. I read in many places in the writings of the Apostolic Fathers where they were persecuted by Jews. The Jews were really bad about helping the Romans find Christians and to have them killed. The same spirit among the Jews that had Jesus crucified was among many Jews who helped the Romans murder Christians. I am not saying that about all Jews, because the first Christians were Jews and Jesus was Jew. But those who were Pharasee, which is where Orthodox Judiasm comes from, that is where the anti-Christian hatred came from. But today the Jews are seeing that we Christians are not the real enemy, since we did help save alot of Jews during the holocost, and one day the Jews will convert to Catholicism at the End of Time. But my point is that there are good reasons why the Church has had problems with Jews, not because they hated Jews for being Jews, but that the Jews have played a big part in Christians being martyred.

The real persecution of Christians started under Nero, he blamed Christians for the fire that burned half of Rome. Nero would throw dinner parties and use Christians wrapped in tar and set ablaze as lanterns. Nero would feed the Christians to the lions. But of course the Christians would be singing praises to God as a lion ate them alive, this converted the masses, and it had nothing to do with the Jews. Before Nero little was known of the Christians throughout the majority of Rome.

There was anti-semitism against the Jews historically, the CC demanded to not even dine with Jews, passion plays would send the villagers on a rampage to hurt the Jews.

There’s no defending the actions of Catholics who were anti-semetic, but again these are the actions of people who did wrong, that’s why the Church apologized.

 

[Sean_Boyle]

Disheartened,

Maybe we could start here…

Do you believe that Christ if fully present, body,blood soul and divinity in the Eucharist? Do you believe that the seven sacraments from Christ allow grace from God to enter your very being?

Yes or no answers, please. This will help everyone understand your position.

 

[runandsew]

“The Church claims to advocate for the poor, but then they forbid birth control and pretend that having more children doesn’t cause problems for poor people, when in fact that’s not true.”

If one of the reasons you are leaving the Church were because you think that birth control is not a sin, then I would have to say that it is not God leading you out, but Satan. Because God says birth control is a sin, and God would not lead anyone to sin.
No matter how many other reasons you might have to against the Church, if birth control is one of them, then it is not of God.
You might not think that it is a sin, but God did not ask you.
God’s very first commandment was “Be fruitful and multiply”
Everyone needs to be open to life.

The Church says birth control is a sin because the Bible tells us it is a sin. Whenever you think of Jesus, you might want to be reminded of birth control.
Why do I say this, well, in Matthew the genealogy of Jesus is listed and in this genealogy there are four women listed, one of the women listed is Tamar, Tamar had relations with her father in-law Judah, to give birth to Perez who in the line of Jesus. Why did Tamar have relations with Judah?

You find the answer in Genesis 38:6-10

Judah got a wife named Tamar for his first-born, Er.
But Er, Judah’s first-born, greatly offended the LORD; so the LORD took his life.
Then Judah said to Onan, “Unite with your brother’s widow, in fulfillment of your duty as brother-in-law, and thus preserve your brother’s line.”
Onan, however, knew that the descendants would not be counted as his; so whenever he had relations with his brother’s widow, he wasted his seed on the ground, to avoid contributing offspring for his brother. What he did greatly offended the LORD, and the LORD took his life too.
That is birth control, and God was offended by it.

Today we are not physically killed by birth control, just spiritually killed
So if you want to leave the Church Jesus established, then do so, but do not do it because birth control is one of the issues.

 

[LSK]

Mom of 3, I notice you’re a relatively new poster yourself. I’m sorry you find my post fishy, but I came here to express my sadness. I was a convert to the church 13 years ago. In the past 2 years I’ve gotten more and more fed up. Yes, I’ve tried to participate and improve my parish, but there were so many petty rivalries and poor leadership that I gave up.

Mikey gave a nice answer, devoid of disdain, but some of these other answers confirm my belief that Catholics are full of cruelty for one another and the Eucharist doesn’t help people in any way to love their fellow humans.

Oh I am so sorry you have lost hope.

To be so concerned with the behavior of others that you have failed to see the wonders the Eucharist has worked in YOU - I understand, I have been there. It sometimes feels as though nothing is ever changing or getting better.
I am going to suggest that instead of leaving the True Church, you step up your own devotion to the Blessed Sacrament. Stop being worried about what others are doing…instead, go and sit before the Blessed Sacrament for one hour once a week and ask Jesus to rekindle the love and tolerance for your fellow human in your heart.
I had to do that - and it worked. I realized that for all the times I saw people not acting ‘right’ they were looking at me ‘not behaving’ as Christ, too.

 

[Mr_Jullien]

TheGarg: more like DEFEND…you did not come here with legitimate questions, or venting, but to be cruel your self, in your false allogations, and personal attacks. re-read your original post…

Exactly my point.

Why is it that when I spoke the Truth, I was “harsh”, but OP’s attacks, accusations and cruelty, towards Catholics and the Catholic Church are excused on the basis that his/her feelings were hurt by some members of the Catholic Church?

What about OP’s initial insults? They’re not to be considered hurtful to devout and practicing Catholics?

We must also consider where OP posted his/her problems w/Catholics and the Church.
This is an “Apologetics” Forum.
Did he/she expect those accusations to be ignored under the guise of “Political Correctness”?
If OP wanted a sincere discussion about his/her problems with Catholics and the Church, why wasn’t it posted under another Forum, like “The Back Fence”, “The Club House” or even "Moral Theology"? (since he/she has an issues w/the priest scandal and the Kennedy’s?) Why post it here in "Apologetics", where he/she knows attacks on the Church won’t be ignored or swept under the rug due to misguided compassion?

Mickey:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Jullien forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif
* it comes across as deep seeded bitterness.*

This was my impression also.

Thank you. I was Anti-Catholic for 15 years. I know the attitude and the drill. I, too, ranted and raved about things I thought were unfair.

TheGarg: Your statements in your original post are inflamitory, cruel, and unfounded…

and you just referred to the Eucharist as a “minor” matter…

Thank you for restating those facts.

PAX,

Jullien

 

[Eden]

I’m not really sure what the purpose of the original post was. To express anger, sadness, remorse, uncertainty? To get sympathy, hostility, attention, support? I understand that if someone truly feels led away, they are going to leave. We can only pray for them. But what is the purpose of coming to a web forum and announcing the decision and denouncing the Church? Is the exit not official until other people know? I’m afraid I don’t understand.

 

[Mommyof02green]

We must also consider where OP posted his/her problems w/Catholics and the Church.
This is an “Apologetics” Forum.
Did he/she expect those accusations to be ignored under the guise of “Political Correctness”?
If OP wanted a sincere discussion about his/her problems with Catholics and the Church, why wasn’t it posted under another Forum, like “The Back Fence”, “The Club House” or even "Moral Theology"? (since he/she has an issues w/the priest scandal and the Kennedy’s?) Why post it here in "Apologetics", where he/she knows attacks on the Church won’t be ignored or swept under the rug due to misguided compassion?

**The OP is new to the forum!! These posting in this thread are the OP only postings!! **When we are “new” to something we may not know exactly were to go. I honestly believe that the OP posted here because they want to be heard and want to be helped.

When you are calling out for help then you go where you are you feel you will be heard!

Also I just noticed that one of my links in an earlier post is bad. sorry.
How does the pill work? goaskalice.columbia.edu/0663.html
or prolife.com/BIRTHCNT.html These links should work.

 

[water]

Hello Disheartened,

I am sorry you’ve had bad experiences. What happiness are you exactly looking for? are these happiness for our own desires or God’s desire? Are you willing to do God’s will or your will?

Keep praying to find the real Truth.

 

[Saint_Michael]

I’m not really sure what the purpose of the original post was. To express anger, sadness, remorse, uncertainty? To get sympathy, hostility, attention, support? I understand that if someone truly feels led away, they are going to leave. We can only pray for them. But what is the purpose of coming to a web forum and announcing the decision and denouncing the Church? Is the exit not official until other people know? I’m afraid I don’t understand.

My honest opinion is this person is hurt by the actions of the Church and or individual Catholics, confused and conflicted about leaving, looking for sympathy.

This person is conflicted and looking for a sympathetic ear, and to be convinced not to leave. Now it’s an apologetics forum, but maybe it should be noted that you can win the argument and lose a soul.

If she offended you, then forgive her and realize that she’s frustrated and looking to be convinced to stay so convince her, instead of knocking her around because she called Catholcis mean.

That’s my take at least.

 

[Wendy-Kay]

I utterly concur with the above posting #64. I grew up in a very anti-Catholic environment and some of the things OP throws out there are some of the same things I hear from them. It is a very familiar tune.
I was willing to be sympathetic until I was informed by the OP that the center of my life, The Eucharist, wasn’t making me a better person. When someone makes such blanket insults so unjustly and about such things, they should be admonished. I teach my son that just because he is frustrated and upset, he isn’t allowed to hit or bite others.

 

[Eden]

My honest opinion is this person is hurt by the actions of the Church and or individual Catholics, confused and conflicted about leaving, looking for sympathy.

This person is conflicted and looking for a sympathetic ear, and to be convinced not to leave. Now it’s an apologetics forum, but maybe it should be noted that you can win the argument and lose a soul.

If she offended you, then forgive her and realize that she’s frustrated and looking to be convinced to stay so convince her, instead of knocking her around because she called Catholcis mean.

That’s my take at least.

Thanks. That makes sense. I honestly didn’t understand the purpose of leaving the Church and then coming here and posting about it. If the poster needs sympathy, I can understand that. I thought maybe they were hoping to take someone with them. That, I can’t accept. If one is going to jeopardize their own soul by rejecting His Church, they are free to make that choice. But trying to influence someone else who may be weak in their faith to jeopardize their soul, that’s just the limit.

 

[Mickey]

This person is conflicted and looking for a sympathetic ear, and to be convinced not to leave.

Hmmm? That was not my impression. In addition to the claim of being hurt by fellow Catholics, (of which there are no details), the original poster attacks the Church in many ways. Such as:

“I saw the hypocrisy of the Church”

“Now the Church embraces usuary”

“The Church claims to advocate for the poor, but then they forbid birth control and pretend that having more children doesn’t cause problems for poor people, when in fact that’s not true. The Church is loud about that, but turns a blind eye at the fact that wealthy contributers use birth control.”

“The Church makes a big deal about it’s own communion being the only real one and the best one. Meanwhile, the Church is not even a functional Christian community.”

“It’s clergy have alot of emotional problems”

“The Catholic Church has a bunch of neurotic priests”

“The church has always pandered to the rich throughout history.”

“Just look at how the Kennedy family is put up with, and Bill Gates who supports Planned Parenthood.”

“Look at the sex scandels and homosexuality in the clergy.”

There are many accusations here worthy of many different thread topics. Some members are here to defend the Church from this type of inflammatory diatribe. God bless the defenders of the faith!

 

[runandsew]

Have you thought of attending a new parish?
Have you thought of joining a ministry which addresses your concerns for the poor, or one that reaches out to other faiths?

 

[Denise_Shae]

It comes across as deep seated sadness and frustration to me.

Hi SM and Peace be to you ,

For all we know, you could be right. I read the original post at least three times and each time I read it, it appeared more and more hostile towards the CC and its members.

Now I don’t claim the ability to read people’s hearts but I can tell you, as a former Moderator of a Catholic debate Bulletin Board for about four - five years, this type of post is generally viewed as venomous toward the CC and basically anti-Catholic.
It’s a pattern that’s all too familiar.
I acknowledge the OPs sadness and frustration, however there seems to be a lot of hostility and bitterness mixed in as well. And I can well understand why some posters on this thread might find OPs comments highly offensive and insulting.

I have a feeling there are going to be a lot of mixed and highly charged emotions on this thread.

Its very sad.

God Bless!

 

[Saint_Michael]

Hmmm? That was not my impression. In addition to the claim of being hurt by fellow Catholics, (of which there are no details), the original poster attacks the Church in many ways. Such as:

“I saw the hypocrisy of the Church”

“Now the Church embraces usuary”

“The Church claims to advocate for the poor, but then they forbid birth control and pretend that having more children doesn’t cause problems for poor people, when in fact that’s not true. The Church is loud about that, but turns a blind eye at the fact that wealthy contributers use birth control.”

“The Church makes a big deal about it’s own communion being the only real one and the best one. Meanwhile, the Church is not even a functional Christian community.”

“It’s clergy have alot of emotional problems”

“The Catholic Church has a bunch of neurotic priests”

“The church has always pandered to the rich throughout history.”

“Just look at how the Kennedy family is put up with, and Bill Gates who supports Planned Parenthood.”

“Look at the sex scandels and homosexuality in the clergy.”

There are many accusations here worthy of many different thread topics. Some members are here to defend the Church from this type of inflammatory diatribe. God bless the defenders of the faith!

Maybe I’m not as cynical as you I don’t really know, but you should take into acount that not everyones faith is as rock solid as your own. And all the OP’s concerns are valid ones to her, maybe not to you, but the idea of ussury, anti-semitism, priesthood scandal, coldness of the parishoners etc… May be very valid to her as reasons to leave, you don’t know.

 

[Mommyof02green]

Maybe I’m not as cynical as you I don’t really know, but you should take into acount that not everyones faith is as rock solid as your own. And all the OP’s concerns are valid ones to her, maybe not to you, but the idea of ussury, anti-semitism, priesthood scandal, coldness of the parishoners etc… May be very valid to her as reasons to leave, you don’t know.

I don’t know where the OP faith is or isn’t, and I will not cast judgment. However, I did note that in one of the postings the OP stated that they were a convert to the faith…

I can only wonder if this is weighing in on their emotions…

There is definitely more to the story!

 

[fix]

Maybe I’m not as cynical as you I don’t really know, but you should take into acount that not everyones faith is as rock solid as your own. And all the OP’s concerns are valid ones to her, maybe not to you, but the idea of ussury, anti-semitism, priesthood scandal, coldness of the parishoners etc… May be very valid to her as reasons to leave, you don’t know.

How can any reason be* valid* to turn away from the Church? One may mistakenly think such reasons are valid, but one would be mistaken

 

[Mickey]

Maybe I’m not as cynical as you I don’t really know

It is not cynicism–it is an observation based on the reading of the OP.

but you should take into acount that not everyones faith is as rock solid as your own.

We are all struggling in this body of flesh–working out our salvation with fear and trembling. I am the most wretched of sinners. And I pray to God to have mercy on my soul.

And all the OP’s concerns are valid ones to her, maybe not to you

I will always attempt to assist a hurting brother or sister in need. But the accusatory nature of the post was inflammatory indeed. When he/she returns, perhaps he/she will clarify further.

Peace,
Mickey

 

[Saint_Michael]

How can any reason be* valid* to turn away from the Church? One may mistakenly think such reasons are valid, but one would be mistaken

I left the Church, I don’t think I’m mistaken, not for the reason the OP did, you can disagree and that’s fine. But what I’m saying is the OP may think her reasons are valid. In that case the best approach probably isn’t saying “this is the true church”, and simply slam her upside the head with a catechism.

 

[fix]

I left the Church, I don’t think I’m mistaken, not for the reason the OP did, you can disagree and that’s fine. But what I’m saying is the OP may think her reasons are valid. In that case the best approach probably isn’t saying “this is the true church”, and simply slam her upside the head with a catechism.

I agree no one should slam anyone. I was asking about a simple point of logic. Either one accepts it is the true Church or does not . If one accepts it is the true Church how can any reason be valid for rejecting Her?