Why Is Catholicism So Unattractive to Evangelicals?

[dmftx]

For me, the structure of mass is like a warm embrace. I love the traditions that we celebrate in the mass which has been shared through generations. While I consider myself friendly to others around me at mass, I go there to praise God and to grow in my relatiobship with Him, not others. When you really understand the mass then you find such personal meaning in it’s celebration. Original poster, I hope you will visir again and truly listen and follow the mass in all its beauty.

 

[dmftx]

For me, the structure of mass is like a warm embrace. I love the traditions that we celebrate in the mass which has been shared through generations. While I consider myself friendly to others around me at mass, I go there to praise God and to grow in my relatiobship with Him, not others. When you really understand the mass then you find such personal meaning in its celebration. Original poster, I hope you will visit again and truly listen and follow the mass in all its beauty.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

That last statement is highly ambiguous: one must question whether Lyford is making a statement specifically about the Archdiocese of San Francisco or a universal claim.

Having said, this situation sounds quite unusual to me. I’ve never heard of a priest coming in and making that change just like that. (Though I’m guessing there have been numerous cases where a new priest came to a parish that didn’t have female altar servers and reversed that policy.)

The spokesperson is correct. It would be the prerogative of the pastor any place where the Ordinary has decreed that female altar servers are permissible.

That said, some of the wisest advice I received when I was first named a pastor was when the bishop said to me, “Make no change for the first six months. You have to understand the place and the people first in order to really know why something is the way that it is.”

One also has to take account of the Ordinary AND of the presbyterate.

 

[Peter_J]

The spokesperson is correct. It would be the prerogative of the pastor any place where the Ordinary has decreed that female altar servers are permissible.

That said, some of the wisest advice I received when I was first named a pastor was when the bishop said to me, “Make no change for the first six months. You have to understand the place and the people first in order to really know why something is the way that it is.”

One also has to take account of the Ordinary AND of the presbyterate.

Alright. However, I still think that what happened in the parish was very rare – I can’t even think of another parish that went from having female altar servers to not having any, much less another case where a new priest unilaterally made that decision.

 

[Tommy999]

I think Hahn’s friend was using the Eucharist is an excuse for not doing … well, he didn’t mention social activities or friendliness specifically, but you get the idea.

Surely, one person (even a Catholic) saying something doesn’t make it right, does it? I’m guessing, that as a Catholic, I have to put up with – roughly – the same number of annoying and frustrating things from fellow Catholics as you do from fellow Evangelicals.

Yes, probably so. I’m sure I inadvertently annoy my share of folks from time to time, also. Such is our fate as imperfect humans, and I’m about as imperfect as they come.

 

[JustaServant]

For me, the structure of mass is like a warm embrace. I love the traditions that we celebrate in the mass which has been shared through generations. While I consider myself friendly to others around me at mass, I go there to praise God and to grow in my relatiobship with Him, not others. When you really understand the mass then you find such personal meaning in its celebration. Original poster, I hope you will visit again and truly listen and follow the mass in all its beauty.

I started the thread a couple months back. It’s actually an article that I hope would have generated a more positive discussion. But it went the route of many threads here so I just gave up.

 

[Adonia]

Even though I’m an Evangelical Christian, I attended Mass on several occasions in Catholic Churches. The atmosphere inside a Catholic Church appeared more solemn and they tend to read from a book. The Eucharist appeared to be the main event, and non Catholics are not permitted to participate. In Protestant Churches, people tend to be more friendly and welcoming of visitors and there is more emphasis on teaching. In the Catholic Churches I attended, nobody cared who I was and nobody attempted to talk to me. Also, at the Catholic Churches, I saw people praying and bowing before statues. This greatly upset me, and I have rarely attended Catholic Churches since.

Just where did all this bowing before statues occur? I have been Catholic all my life and have never seen that once, not once! As for no one attempting to talk to you, I personally go to church to worship God, not to make friends. Having said that, some parishes do have an after Mass coffee hour plus all the different groups within the parish that one can belong to.

As for reading from a book, it is called a Missal where the Scriptures have been broken into parts to coincide with the liturgical year - it is the Scriptures nonetheless. It is true that the Holy Eucharist is the summit of our worship service - and rightly so. This follows the Christian practice from day one and that is the biggest difference between us with the sermon being the height of your worship, which coincidentally is the reason I could never be a member of any other non-orthodox Christian faith tradition.

 

[Tomyris]

I started the thread a couple months back. It’s actually an article that I hope would have generated a more positive discussion. But it went the route of many threads here so I just gave up.

I know the feeling - you start a thread and it isn’t what you were expecting. Sorry it has disappointed you!

What were you looking for in the way of a more positive discussion? If I may say so, I think the title may get in the way, as it may invite rants.

 

[Peter_J]

I know the feeling - you start a thread and it isn’t what you were expecting. Sorry it has disappointed you!

What were you looking for in the way of a more positive discussion? If I may say so, I think the title may get in the way, as it may invite rants.

And sometimes there a “curse of success”, I.e. sometimes your thread gets a ton of posts but they’re not the kind you want.

And, of course, individual style plays a big role. E.g. in some threads the starter basically responds to every person who posts on it – not that’s there anything wrong with that, but I just can’t imagine doing that myself unless it’s a very small/slow thread.

 

[JustaServant]

I know the feeling - you start a thread and it isn’t what you were expecting. Sorry it has disappointed you!

What were you looking for in the way of a more positive discussion? If I may say so, I think the title may get in the way, as it may invite rants.

The thread title was the title of the article. Which, according to copy write law, we are not allowed to change.

 

[JustaServant]

That’s…a little simplistic.
I grew up with and around nominal Catholics who had no interest in spiritual matters, no morality and no interest in following what the Church taught. It did indeed, as a young guy in his twenties appear very much dead and ‘going through the motions’.
On the other hand, walking into an evangelical church was like walking into a different world, and appeared to have everything I believed lacking in the Catholic Church.
Now, years after coming back to the Church I can see much of my reaction was youthful exuberance and ignorance. But that doesn’t mean the negative things I saw should be easily dismissed. Evangelicals don’t see a Catholic spiritual life lived out, celebrated, and wholeheartedly embraced.
But being evangelical all those years, make me a better Catholic today.
And Catholics solve nothing by denying what Evangelicals see.
There’s an old saying that sometimes it’s more fruitful to listen to your enemy rather than your friend. Because your friend will not identify your faults because he does not want to hurt your feelings. But your enemy will point out your faults no problem.

Maybe if I quoted my own post we could properly re-boot the thread.

 

[Peter_J]

Maybe if I quoted my own post we could properly re-boot the thread.

IIWY I would leave this thread to “take its course” and start a thread titled “Article: Why Is Catholicism So Unattractive to Evangelicals?”

 

[Tomyris]

IIWY I would leave this thread to “take its course” and start a thread titled “Article: Why Is Catholicism So Unattractive to Evangelicals?”

Hmmm.

Perhaps a more fruitful exploration would be (again) to learn why all these evangelicals are hanging around a Catholic forum when they apparently aren’t all that interested in converting.

 

[Peter_J]

Hmmm.

Perhaps a more fruitful exploration would be (again) to learn why all these evangelicals are hanging around a Catholic forum when they apparently aren’t all that interested in converting.

Well, I was thinking about screaming “Look out! They’re Evangelicals!” and then running for my torch and pitchfork, but … alright, we can try it your way.

 

[Reuben_J]

Just where did all this bowing before statues occur? I have been Catholic all my life and have never seen that once, not once! As for no one attempting to talk to you, I personally go to church to worship God, not to make friends. Having said that, some parishes do have an after Mass coffee hour plus all the different groups within the parish that one can belong to.

As for reading from a book, it is called a Missal where the Scriptures have been broken into parts to coincide with the liturgical year - it is the Scriptures nonetheless. It is true that the Holy Eucharist is the summit of our worship service - and rightly so. This follows the Christian practice from day one and that is the biggest difference between us with the sermon being the height of your worship, which coincidentally is the reason I could never be a member of any other non-orthodox Christian faith tradition.

Being a non-Catholic and more so, an Evangelical, she/he does not understand what’s happening in the mass. Can’t blame her/him.

Probably she/he noticed the congregation bowing towards the tabernacle or the altar where there were statues in the same direction, she/he mistook them as bowing to them (statues).

With someone who has been probably taught that Catholics worshiped Mary and statues, what she/he noticed in a Catholic church during the mass could easily confirm her/his already erroneous suspicion about Catholics. It was more out of ignorance and misunderstanding of Catholic belief and doctrines rather than the truth.

 

[Graceful_Lamb]

Well, if you were invited, or it was an open house, and you were told NOT to partake of the food that others are eating in front of you, yes, it would appear to be extremely rude.

Many protestant denominations believe that Communion is a symbol, and not the body, blood, soul and divinity of Jesus. Therefore, they are not allowed to receive.

 

[Peter_J]

Originally Posted by leekonghian
Also, at the Catholic Churches, I saw people praying and bowing before statues.

Being a non-Catholic and more so, an Evangelical, she/he does not understand what’s happening in the mass. Can’t blame her/him.

Probably she/he noticed the congregation bowing towards the tabernacle or the altar where there were statues in the same direction, she/he mistook them as bowing to them (statues).

I’m sorry, but I have to back leekonghian up on that one particular point. I’m a lifelong non-Evangelical, and more so a Catholic, and I have many times seen Catholics bow to statues. So I cannot see why leekonghian couldn’t have seen it too.

 

[Reuben_J]

I’m sorry, but I have to back leekonghian up on that one particular point. I’m a lifelong non-Evangelical, and more so a Catholic, and I have many times seen Catholics bow to statues. So I cannot see why leekonghian couldn’t have seen it too.

leekonghian must be pretty observant to see Catholics bowing to statues during mass. On a different note, can’t blame him/her either. If I am non-Catholic and have been fed with certain things that Catholics do, I would be on a watch out for that. And bingo, I saw one!

The fact that leekonghian never came back to find out what and why it happened, perhaps an indication of what she/he been looking for had been found during the foray to a Catholic worship - that Catholics bow to statues.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

I’m sorry, but I have to back leekonghian up on that one particular point. I’m a lifelong non-Evangelical, and more so a Catholic, and I have many times seen Catholics bow to statues. So I cannot see why leekonghian couldn’t have seen it too.

I will agree with you too. Over the years, I have seen bowing, genuflecting, kneeling, kissing, touching, and once or twice prostration in front of statues. I assumed this was pretty standard prayer gestures for Roman Catholics.

 

[Darryl_B]

Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with whole heart, soul, mind.

An evangelical christian tends to believe that impromptu is a genuine expression of love. A prayer for instance cannot be read, because it does not reflect the “emotive” feeling of the “heart”. Therefore you will never hear the Lord’s Prayer recited in an evangelical church. If you recite it, you cannot possibly genuinely mean it, and it is therefore not an expression of love. It is okay if one uses repetition “Lord we just … Lord we just … Lord we just …” It is okay if one uses assent with a resounding “Amen”. It is also okay if one uses the same pre-learned phraseologies so long as it is in an impromptu manner. Heart is interpreted as “emotion” and “emotion” is interpreted as being the “Spirit”. Impromptu is interpreted as being “led by” the “Spirit”.

But when an evangelical gives a speech at a wedding, they will write notes, when an evangelical gets married they will recite prewritten vows, and when an evangelical accepts Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour they will recite the same transcripted prayer.

That is because people are creatures of habit, creatures of repetition, the sun rises the sun sets, again and again. We do the same things in the same order every morning, we do the same things again and again every day in cycle. God cycled the festivals of the OT, because man is prone to forget.

When a marriage develops, the once teenage emotions tend to disappear and it becomes instead a deeper relationship built on commitment. Habitually assenting as a “thou shalt love”, otherwise when those teenage emotions disappear there will just be divorce.

And when an evangelical claims a disrespect for religion, they should technically claim an equal disrespect of marriage.

And that is why Catholicism is so unattractive to evangelicals. Even though the things they don’t like about Catholicism are the very things they do.