Why is the US Catholic church so obsessed with the gay issue?

[GratefulFred]

SSA has been an issue for thousands of years. It is addressed in both the Old and New Testaments. It is up to each generation to figure how to deal with it. Until the last 3 decades or so, it has been hidden and punished and resentment grew. It came out into the open and we rightly did away with criminal punishment. Resentment did not subside.

We must remember that each and every one of us is imperfect. Some of our imperfections are hidden, some not.

We must also remember that Jesus Christ is indeed the Living Son of God and calls us to love God FIRST and all others second for the love of God.

Love of God FIRST requires us to learn better about Jesus Christ, and our purpose here on earth, and what happens to us after we pass on. We are here to do God’s Will, not our will only. Love of others requires us to pray and work for those things that help others come closer to Christ.

Proper love requires us to tolerate each others imperfections. And yet, when appropriate without being a constant nag, we admonish one another as a way to encourage each other to continue to try to come closer to Christ.

However, proper love prohibits us from encouraging others to do those things that take them away from Christ. Christ forgave sin and said “Go and sin no more.” He never said it is OK to continue to sin. When one is sincere, Christ will forgive our sins in the Sacrament of Reconciliation - even if we cannot yet control our sinful behavior, whatever that behavior is for us. Forgive 70 times 7. But our constant admission of sin and constant forgiveness never includes approval of habitual sin.

The meaning of words do matter. A tree is a tree. Should a rose bush grow as tall as a tree, we would not then call a rose bush a tree. Each provides a benefit, but they remain different. Love and tolerance may require us to accept Same Sex Unions, but the term “marriage” should retain its millennial honored definition of a union of one man and one woman. Defending the term marriage is important to those who are trying to live according to God’s Plan.

A new union - Same Sex Union, requires a different term.

 

[unstoppable_II]

…
We must remember that each and every one of us is imperfect. …

I for one am getting tired of reading this because I’m not out demanding society provide me Constitutional validation and acceptance of my imperfections. :nope:

 

[GratefulFred]

There are also many advocates of the right of gay people to marry who are Christians. The Episcopal Church just voted to allow its clergy to perform same-sex marriages and my own denomination, the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, also allows it’s pastors to marry same-sex couples.

The AP news reported that 80% of the House of Bishops approved it. BUT the report not provide the reasoning in the BIBLE to support the change. A well thought out decision requires an analysis of the Bible passages for traditional marriage as being inferior to whatever passages are used to allow SSM. Without such thoughtful public analysis, the decision is suspect as to being God’s Will.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

And this reveals the moral relativism of the Episcopal Church and the ELCA.

Many of us in the Church are very proud of the Episcopal Church’s decisions - when we shut the door on people, turn them away from Christ’s table, it is not the Church.

Look around you. There are loving and Christ-like individuals and families who are gay. Welcome them rather than throw stones. Please.

 

[catholic1seeks]

Many of us in the Church are very proud of the Episcopal Church’s decisions - when we shut the door on people, turn them away from Christ’s table, it is not the Church.

Look around you. There are loving and Christ-like individuals and families who are gay. Welcome them rather than throw stones. Please.

Exactly why many gay persons in these churches, like the Catholic Church, will never find home. People can say all they want that the Episcopal church or other church’s decisions express relativism or a lack of consistency with historical Christian morals. At the end of the day, these churches are providing a home for people on the fringes.

And are therefore being CHURCH.

 

[Lucretius]

Many of us in the Church are very proud of the Episcopal Church’s decisions - when we shut the door on people, turn them away from Christ’s table, it is not the Church.

Look around you. There are loving and Christ-like individuals and families who are gay. Welcome them rather than throw stones. Please.

Except for Jesus condemns homosexual activity and “gay families,” so such people are actually *not *Christ-like.

Remember, He said to the woman caught in adultery “Go and sin no more.”

Christi pax,

Lucretius

 

[catholic1seeks]

Except for Jesus condemns homosexual activity and “gay families.”

Remember, He said to the woman caught in adultery “Go and sin no more.”

Christi pax,

Lucretius

Jesus never did.

 

[ctb95]

Many of us in the Church are very proud of the Episcopal Church’s decisions - when we shut the door on people, turn them away from Christ’s table, it is not the Church.

Look around you. There are loving and Christ-like individuals and families who are gay. Welcome them rather than throw stones. Please.

So is homosexual activity sinful or not? For 2000 years, Christians seemed to think so, including Episcopalians. Did God suddenly change his mind because the Episcopal Church says so?

I certainly won’t throw stones and have nothing against LGBT people. There are many gay people in the Catholic Church who live chastely according to the Church’s precepts. Not everyone is called to the vocation of marriage.

 

[Lucretius]

Jesus never did.

Actually He does (that’s the present tense. Although He did in the past, and will in the future, forever).

Christi pax,

Lucretius

 

[ctb95]

Jesus never did.

As far as I’m aware, Jesus didn’t say anything about wife beating, but its safe to assume he wouldn’t have been okay with it.

EDIT: Also, St. Paul condemns homosexual acts several times.

 

[pete_29]

Youve made a point here. Some Catholics find that things like this feed a paranoia or deeply rooted insecurity. Nobody is going to force the Catholic Church or any straight person to marry anybody. Relax.

They will constantly sue anyone that disagrees with them and that includes Churches. They will have people that disagree with them arrested for hate speech. Reciting a Bible verse can get you fined. I believe that there are several cases of this in the world today.

 

[Lucretius]

As far as I’m aware, Jesus didn’t say anything about wife beating, but its safe to assume he wouldn’t have been okay with it.

I want to write a short story one day about some Greek Christians in the second century who believe that sacrificing to idols is OK because 1) everyone is doing it, and 2) Jesus never said anything against it

Christi pax,

Lucretius

 

[catholic1seeks]

As far as I’m aware, Jesus didn’t say anything about wife beating, but its safe to assume he wouldn’t have been okay with it.

EDIT: Also, St. Paul condemns homosexual acts several times.

Did you see what I was replying to??? The post said “Jesus condemned homosexual activity.” Also, I have spoken many times on these forums about homosexuality in the Bible. Suffice it to say, Paul certainly was referring to homosexual behavior. That is one thing. It is another thing to conclude from that that every single gay sexual act is in and of itself immoral. And it is a bigger assumption to say Paul’s words apply to committed, loving relationships. We know two things: Paul and other biblical writers did not conceive of homosexuality as we do today, as an innate orientation. They saw it manifested in specific behaviors, such as pederasty or prostitution. In addition, Paul and others were not familiar with equal-status, committed homosexual relationships – the kinds we speak of today.

There are adequate statements from Jesus that we can use to determine that wife-beating is wrong. Love thy neighbor as yourself, etc.

 

[Lucretius]

Did you see what I was replying to??? The post said “Jesus condemned homosexual activity.”

Actually, I wrote:

Except for Jesus **condemns **homosexual activity and “gay families,” so such people are actually *not *Christ-like.

So, I actually wrote “Jesus condemns” rather than “Jesus condemned.” I chose those words very carefully because I knew that an objection like yours would come otherwise.

Jesus really didn’t need to condemn homosexuality because He preached to the Jews, and this was not a disagreement between them. Homosexuality is a sin was something the Jews had down. And even if Jesus condemned homosexuality, the Apostles didn’t need to record that on paper, because, again, the Jews had that under control.

Same thing with idol worship. By Jesus’s time, Jews had “idols are bad” down to a T Didn’t need to mention it much.

The fact that St. Paul was preaching to the Gentiles, rather than to the Jews (like Jesus), was the reason St. Paul mentions homosexuality, since the Greeks were very much into “women are for business; boys are for pleasure.” It’s also why he mentions sacrificing to idols.

Christi pax,

Lucretius

 

[TimothyH]

Several Catholic organizations in the US seem to be uncomfortably and awkwardly preoccupied with gay issues. Catholic Answers Live, a radio show I love, sometimes has specific shows dedicated to same-sex marriage or homosexuality. I just switched on EWTN on my TV and the show was talking about the “militant homosexual agenda.” Catholic bloggers and articles are always dedicating topics on this issue; everytime I go to NewAdvent.org, there is a good chance I’ll see a highlighted article casting the issue in a severe light.

I want to point out that these are not “The US Catholic Church”. These are private organization. They are not run by the Church.

I think the US Council of Catholic Bishops put out a statement after the court decision and I know there were homilies that week on the topic but that’s all I am aware of from the US Catholic Church.

I don’t think it correct to say that the Church is obsessed. All the noise and obsession seems to be coming from places other than the Church herself.

-Tim-

 

[polki]

tfpstudentaction.org/politically-incorrect/homosexuality/12-quotes-against-sodomy-that-every-catholic-should-know.html

 

[Corki]

Several Catholic organizations in the US seem to be uncomfortably and awkwardly preoccupied with gay issues. Catholic Answers Live, a radio show I love, sometimes has specific shows dedicated to same-sex marriage or homosexuality. I just switched on EWTN on my TV and the show was talking about the “militant homosexual agenda.” Catholic bloggers and articles are always dedicating topics on this issue; everytime I go to NewAdvent.org, there is a good chance I’ll see a highlighted article casting the issue in a severe light.

My question is, what is this emphasis on this issue meant to achieve? Is it supposed to help those gay persons who are already struggling to find a place in the Church? Is it supposed to convince the “militant homosexual” activists? Is it supposed to reach out to those in the Church and the world who disagree with church teaching and accept homosexual relationships? Or is it supposed to comfort those who already agree with church teaching?

Maybe I am just sensitive. But I do not see the point with this over-emphasis. I could see how such a preoccupation would turn away those from the Church, as it is making me really disappointed with the USA church’s outreach to those on the fringes.

I don’t think there is an over emphasis. If anything, the need to resist this evil has not been emphasized loudly or often enough. The Church should have been much stronger in her opposition much earlier and maybe we would not be in the situation we are in now.

 

[Lucretius]

Also, I have spoken many times on these forums about homosexuality in the Bible. Suffice it to say, Paul certainly was referring to homosexual behavior. That is one thing. It is another thing to conclude from that that every single gay sexual act is in and of itself immoral.

So I guess that when St. Paul refers to murderers, he didn’t mean that “every single act of murder is in and of itself immoral” either, right?

And it is a bigger assumption to say Paul’s words apply to committed, loving relationships. We know two things: Paul and other biblical writers did not conceive of homosexuality as we do today, as an innate orientation. They saw it manifested in specific behaviors, such as pederasty or prostitution. In addition, Paul and others were not familiar with equal-status, committed homosexual relationships – the kinds we speak of today.

Yes, which is why the Church doesn’t condemn the orientation, but just the behaviors.

There are adequate statements from Jesus that we can use to determine that wife-beating is wrong. Love thy neighbor as yourself, etc.

We agree Of course, you will probably disagree when I say that “love my neighbor as myself” requires me to condemn homosexual behaviors. God doesn’t hate homosexual behavior because He is in love with some air, abstract law that we should for some reason follow, but because such behavior cause concrete harm to society, and more importantly the individual performing such acts. He hates the sin because of what the sin does to the sinner

Christi pax,

Lucretius

 

[catholic1seeks]

I don’t think there is an over emphasis. If anything, the need to resist this evil has not been emphasized loudly or often enough. The Church should have been much stronger in her opposition much earlier and maybe we would not be in the situation we are in now.

Look at your profile picture.

So much for the Church needing to be for the Church needing to be for rather than against,
a Church of yes rather than a Church of
No.

 

[ctb95]

Did you see what I was replying to??? The post said “Jesus condemned homosexual activity.” Also, I have spoken many times on these forums about homosexuality in the Bible. Suffice it to say, Paul certainly was referring to homosexual behavior. That is one thing. It is another thing to conclude from that that every single gay sexual act is in and of itself immoral. And it is a bigger assumption to say Paul’s words apply to committed, loving relationships. We know two things: Paul and other biblical writers did not conceive of homosexuality as we do today, as an innate orientation. They saw it manifested in specific behaviors, such as pederasty or prostitution. In addition, Paul and others were not familiar with equal-status, committed homosexual relationships – the kinds we speak of today.

There are adequate statements from Jesus that we can use to determine that wife-beating is wrong. Love thy neighbor as yourself, etc.

Yes, I did read the post that you responded to. I also think that Jesus made pretty adequate statements about marriage as well:

“He answered, Have you never read, how he who created them, when they first came to be, created them male and female; and how he said, A man, therefore, will leave his father and mother and will cling to his wife, and the two will become one flesh? And so they are no longer two, they are one flesh; what God, then, has joined, let not man put asunder.”

-Matthew 19: 4-6