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STT
Guest
And in regards to subject of this thread, what is the purpose of setting Devils free?
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inocente
Guest
How do you think an ice cream tempts you? Do you really think it contains demons which fly into your head to manipulate your thoughts?
If you do then SEE YOUR DOCTOR.
Otherwise stop trying to blame these illusions, and take responsibility for your own thoughts, your own temptations, and for yourself.
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Roseeurekacross
Guest
Great words from my Priest, and a great help and comfort to me. I spent decades dialoging with the devil, giving it permission to run riot in my life and corrupt others.
The last 6 months, since God hit me with the hey you remember Me ugly stick, there is a bit of a spiritual war going on, it isnt accepting its defeat graciously. To be expected. Sometimes I fall, sometimes not.
The more the secular veil is falling away, the more amazed I am.
Today is St Patricks Day, in Mass a fellow parishoner pointed out a 4 leaf clover. The difference between the 3 leaf Shamrock that represents the Trinity, and the 4 leaf lucky charm…the former good and used by St Patrick to teach the Trinity; the latter- the 4 leaf clover steeped in superstition and new age charms.
I had to think about that, it seemed such a little thing, but its not, if we keep with our Lord’s teachings.
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Vico
Guest
Angels have free will just as mankind does. Angels that choose sin are devils. Those that love God will be happy in heaven, otherwise those that do not love God will not be where they do not want to be, that is, with God. The fallen angels were cast out of heaven: they were eternally condemned to hell…
Baltimore Catechism
210 A. God created all things for His own glory and for their or our good.
216 A. Angels are pure spirits without a body, created to adore and enjoy God in heaven.
219 A. The angels were also created to assist before the throne of God and to minister unto Him; they have often been sent as messengers from God to man; and are also appointed our guardians.
221 A. The Archangel Michael drove Satan out of heaven; the Archangel Gabriel announced to the Blessed Virgin that she was to become the Mother of God. The Archangel Raphael guided and protected Tobias.
229 A. Before he fell, Satan, or the devil, was called Lucifer, or light-bearer, a name which indicates great beauty. He was cast out of heaven because through pride he rebelled against God.
231 A. The devil tempts us because he hates goodness, and does not wish us to enjoy the happiness which he himself has lost.
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STT
Guest
That is alright if you don’t believe in Devils. I don’t however understand why you engage to such a discussion.
I have my doctor for my depression but he fortunately he believes in Demons and Angels so no problem there.
I think I can make distinction between illusion, hallucination and a real experience.
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STT
Guest
I mean why they should be free to do what they are doing. They are more powerful than us and they could misguide us. What is the purpose for setting them free?
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mikekle
Guest
Not really, when they were cast out of heaven, God sent them down to earth…among us, not to hell or some other place.
Satan seemed to gain quite bit of power/ability/ influence when he fell.
Other than ‘eventually’ ending up in the pit, can you think of one other way the fall negatively effected Satan?
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mikekle
Guest
So ‘the fall’ really needed to happen, in order for us to learn this and have free will…agree?
What would free will look like if there was no ‘other choice’?
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mikekle
Guest
Yes…they are an essential cog in Gods master plan.
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Vico
Guest
I am going by the Church teaching. Baltimore Catechism
Q. 227. Did all the angels remain good and happy?
A. All the angels did not remain good and happy; many of them sinned and were cast into hell, and these are called devils or bad angels.
2 Peter 2
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but delivered them, drawn down by infernal ropes to the lower hell, unto torments, to be reserved unto judgment:
Jude 6
6 And the angels who kept not their principality, but forsook their own habitation, he hath reserved under darkness in everlasting chains, unto the judgment of the great day.
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Vera_Ljuba
Guest
Right on. And since God only created “good”, they are also “good”. Did they rebel? If they did that was also part of God’s plan.
Nothing can happen if God does not permit it. And if God permits something that he disapproves of, then he would be irrational. But since God is rational, he approved of the “rebellion”, it was part of his “master plan” before he created the world… how peculiar.
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Bookcat
Guest
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Vera_Ljuba
Guest
What a surprise. None of the parents I met ever allowed their children to play with Uzi-s or scalpels, or allowed them to poke a wire into a live socket. Or gave them a cup of poison while warning them that drinking it will kill them… What a shame that they never “respected” the free will of their children.
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Bookcat
Guest
What I noted - I noted. Not what your going off in another direction on.What a surprise. None of the parents I met ever allowed their children to play with Uzi-s or scalpels, or allowed them to poke a wire into a live socket. Or gave them a cup of poison while warning them that drinking it will kill them… What a shame that they never “respected” the free will of their children.
Parents can see quite readily that the other statement was not correct.
And this is all off topic.
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Techno2000
Guest
I don’t know, that question is above my paygrade.
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STT
Guest
Yes.
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rinnie
Guest
No they were created good. But God gave them free will to choose. If God created them good, right there was what God wanted. But God loved them enough to give them the free will to remain good and obey him, or sin and disobey him.Right on. And since God only created “good”, they are also “good”. Did they rebel? If they did that was also part of God’s plan.
Who ever denied that God did not permit sin? Surely not Catholic Teaching. What good would it do for God to give someone free will and then refuse to let them us it? That is what would be irrational.
It is against the word of God to claim that God approves sin, and it is also wrong. God gave us free will to do as we want. It was not with his approval, it was with his disapproval.
If I do not approve of my Son using drugs but he uses his own free will and goes against my will and uses them, then it was part of my master plan for him to use drugs?? Come on!
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rinnie
Guest
Could you also explain to me how someone not approving of something, but lets them do it anyway against their wishes, is approving it?Right on. And since God only created “good”, they are also “good”. Did they rebel? If they did that was also part of God’s plan.
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rinnie
Guest
What a surprise. None of the parents I met ever allowed their children to play with Uzi-s or scalpels, or allowed them to poke a wire into a live socket. Or gave them a cup of poison while warning them that drinking it will kill them… What a shame that they never “respected” the free will of their children.
Because God never gave free will to a child until they were at a age they could be responsible to use it.
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