Why you should think that the Natural-Evolution of species is true

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Aloysium said:
I will have to pursue what others come up with, but I wonder what it means that God “called” the “light” “day”.
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I suspect it’s mostly a justification for the authority of whatever language the author who first wrote it used himself. I believe there is a subtext about the reason the words sun and moon are not mentioned in the early chapters of Genesis too,
 
Hugh_Farey said:
I suspect it’s mostly a justification for the authority of whatever language the author who first wrote it used himself.
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Not that it is a strong argument, but I don’t see any culture today feeling a need to justify their language. I suppose it arises when the Jews’ claim to have a covenant with God is seen as being outrageous and requiring justification. From that perspective, holy scripture is a collection of stories whose purpose is to bring a people together, defining who they are morally and historically by a shared mythology passed on through the ages. While the Torah, the Bible does serve that function, it is secondary to that which the church proclaims. It is the inspired revelation of the Word of God.

Coincidentally, yesterdays Gospel reading was:
They said, “Where did this man get all this?
What kind of wisdom has been given him?
What mighty deeds are wrought by his hands!
Is he not the carpenter, the son of Mary,
and the brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon?
And are not his sisters here with us?”
And they took offense at him.
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Knowing Jesus as a carpenter, a son and brother rendered them incapable of seeing Him as prophet, king, priest and brother to all, as the first Son of God the Father within the Trinity. They did not see Him because they thought they knew Him. The sacred is present in every moment, hidden in our daily lives, by our “daily lives”.

There are too many ongoing incidents where what seemed unintelligible in scripture is found to contain a depth of meaning and truth. It is unwise to leave it at a surface level. I firmly believe that Genesis is literally true. The problem is finding the key that will open it up to reason. That key is a Light that illumines our darkness, the Light that is Jesus Christ, through the grace of the Holy Spirit.

We name, classify, and analyse things as one of the key aspects of our nature that define us as human beings. A name identifies an object and its character. It is an expression of authority. Doctors provide a diagnosis and in doing so allow us to transcend our ailments and pursue healing, the peace that follows acceptance, if no cure is possible. Reality exists as a system of events that exist as themselves. That order and the capacity to grasp it, is established by God at the beginnings of creation.The name given by a person fixes a set of associations in the mind to the particular object, whose reality, what it is in its context, is given by God through the name He assigns.

A few more points come to mind. The idea of the creation of light at the beginning before that of the sun is consistent with the understanding that physics provides. The speed of light is at the centre of what constitutes space and time, as the constant around which both are measured. You don’t need the relationship between the sun and the earth to separate light from darkness. What we call “day” and “night” would be an abstraction of what they mean, projected onto the diurnal variations of sunlight resulting from the rotation of the earth. The words describe a state of being.
 
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Aloysium said:
Not that it is a strong argument, but I don’t see any culture today feeling a need to justify their language.
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No? Do a bit of searching. All over the world minority peoples are trying to get their languages officially recognised, and majority peoples are trying to suppress them. Even in the UK there are excited campaigners for Welsh, Gaelic, Cornish and Manx. The French have an entire Government Department devoted to the purity of the French language, and in Spain there are endless squabbles over Catalan and Basque. I’m afraid I don’t know the status of the indigenous languages of America or Australia, but I would be very surprised if their native speakers are not “feeling a need to justify their language.”
Aloysium said:
The idea of the creation of light at the beginning before that of the sun is consistent with the understanding that physics provides.
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It is, but in my opinion that is entirely fortuitous. Whoever wrote Genesis only knew about daylight, and did not associate it with the Sun.
 
Hugh_Farey said:
Whoever wrote Genesis only knew about daylight, and did not associate it with the Sun.
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You see that’s a significant point on which we differ. There exist revelations, visions and intuitions that allow for entrance into the mysteries of existence.

I don’t want to burst anyone’s bubble here, but I have to say that what we do in science merely tells us what stuff does on the most superficial of levels. As much as we may change the verb we discover/invent, it fails to enter into what anything is.

Genesis is a revelation of the Word of God, establishing the words that can connect us, our thoughts, feelings and actions, to the ultimate Truth that is God. The Bible offers us insight into the nature of God, who we are and His relationship with us.

As a significant part of Christian tradition, it’s contemplation as well as our prayers in solitude and as a community, our participation in the sacraments, obedience to His moral laws, in the giving of our will to what is the good of the other, we journey along the Way that is Jesus Christ.
 
Hugh_Farey said:
Do a bit of searching.
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I’m sorry if you felt annoyed.

I seem to have misunderstood what you were trying to say when you wrote “I suspect it’s mostly a justification for the authority of whatever language the author who first wrote it used himself.” I interpreted it to mean that Hebrew was being portrayed as the chosen language of God. I haven’t heard this claim made by any Jews today, nor by other traditions. While the Quran is written in Arabic because any translation is feared to alter its meaning, to my way of thinking, that’s not specifically claiming that Arabic has some specific authority.

Clearly, globalization is felt to be a threat by many people and the fear of losing one’s culture and heritage is behind the rise in populist movements throughout the world. As I indicated in my post, that part in scripture which spoke of God’s naming night and day, could be interpreted as supporting the language, as would all of the Torah, in bringing “a people together, defining who they are morally and historically by a shared mythology passed on through the ages”. Although that’s what a sociocultural lens on the reading may reveal, there is a greater truth behind Genesis.
 
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Aloysium said:
The speed of light is at the centre of what constitutes space and time, as the constant around which both are measured. You don’t need the relationship between the sun and the earth to separate light from darkness. What we call “day” and “night” would be an abstraction of what they mean, projected onto the diurnal variations of sunlight resulting from the rotation of the earth. The words describe a state of being.
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And to think that we’re being accused of an interpretation that’s too allegorical… 🤣 😉
 
Aloysium said:
I interpreted it to mean that Hebrew was being portrayed as the chosen language of God.
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I doubt if it was Hebrew, but I suspect that the authors did indeed want to suggest that. Whenever it was written (and particular words became set in stone), it was a deliberate attempt to establish religious and political unity among a fairly loose association of tribes and traditions, and establishing a common vocabulary, particularly for words of theological importance, was important. It seems that the words for ‘sun’ and ‘moon’ had connotations of deity among some people, which is why they were deliberately omitted from the Priestly source sections of Genesis.
 
A sociocultural interpretation does not preclude the metaphysical/theological, which is at the core of scripture as the revelation of the Word of God.
 
And now we see the god of BUC (blind unguided chance) creating encryption codes so the target is the only one to be able to read it. Fantastic stuff this evolution! 😀 We know who can do this though… an intelligent designer…

Encrypted messages in biological processes

In recent years, research has shown an unprecedented impact of RNA modifications at all steps of the maturation process. More than a hundred RNA modifications have been identified with roles in both inhibiting and facilitating binding to proteins, DNA and other RNA molecules. This encryption by RNA modification is a way to prevent the message of the RNA in being read by the wrong recipients.

http://mbg.au.dk/en/news-and-events/news-item/artikel/encrypted-messages-in-biological-processes/
 
buffalo said:
And now we see the god of BUC (blind unguided chance)…
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Your knowledge of of evolution obviously lacks the presence of natural selection. Natural selection is not “blind unguided chance”, so your comment is of no relevance to evolution.

In case you had not noticed, evolution, which includes natural selection, can result in very complex systems. The presence of complexity on its own neither confirms nor denies evolution as a cause.

rossum
 
It appears that, at least for some, there is no debate. I find your articles helpful as well. After years of reading threads like this, it’s clear the goal is not promoting science but a certain worldview.
 
buffalo said:
And now we see the god of BUC (blind unguided chance) creating encryption codes so the target is the only one to be able to read it. Fantastic stuff this evolution! 😀 We know who can do this though… an intelligent designer…

Encrypted messages in biological processes

In recent years, research has shown an unprecedented impact of RNA modifications at all steps of the maturation process. More than a hundred RNA modifications have been identified with roles in both inhibiting and facilitating binding to proteins, DNA and other RNA molecules. This encryption by RNA modification is a way to prevent the message of the RNA in being read by the wrong recipients.

Encrypted messages in biological processes
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Yes… " Natural Selection" is way too simplified a term to use these days.
 
edwest211 said:
After years of reading threads like this, it’s clear the goal is not promoting science but a certain worldview.
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I agree. Ya’ll have been “promoting a certain worldview” – that is, the hermeneutic of a strict Scriptural literalism – through these threads. 😉
 
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