Will I go to Hell

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elvisman said:
Funny how you omitted the verse right BEFORE Mark 2:28, because in verse 27, Jesus says:
"The sabbath was made for man, NOT man for the sabbath."

Well, I didn’t use that verse because I was making a specific point that Jesus makes it clear that the Sabbath is the Lord’s day. Funny that you don’t mention that in your post, but now as long as you bring up Mark2:28 look what is says. ]“The sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath.” Where in this verse does it say anything about Jews?

For the Jews in the Old Testament, the Sabbath was the seventh day on which the Lord rested after the Creation of the Heavens and the Earth. In the New Testament, we find that the Apostles and the early Christians worshipped and broke bread (celebrated the Mass**) on the first day of the week, Sunday (Acts 20:7, 1 Cor. 16:2, Rev. 1:10).

Sunday became our day for observing the Third Commandment because it symbolizes the new creation that was ushered in by Christ’s Resurrection. For Christians it is the first of all days, the first of all feasts, the Lord’s Day.
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Again Mark2:27 The son of man is Lord of the sabbath. Making the Sabbath the Lord’s day and Mark2:28 The sabbath was made for man not man for the sabbath. The Sabbath was made for man. Not the Jews. This includes Christians
 
Monica4316 said:
there are MANY Catholic priests spreading God’s word. I personally know several. Your post is very judgemental, I’m sorry.
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Well. Judgmental doesn’t quite say it. I’d call it defensive and he has every reason to be.
He is being questioned and attacked because of his ministry.
A lot of people would have gotten upset a while ago…
He is volunteering for a good cause and all he gets is people mocking him.
 
Janet1983 said:
Well. Judgmental doesn’t quite say it. I’d call it defensive and he has every reason to be.
He is being questioned and attacked because of his ministry.
A lot of people would have gotten upset a while ago…
He is volunteering for a good cause and all he gets is people mocking him.
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Thank you. At least someone here understands the true meaning of being a Christian is.
 
credoinunum said:
Friends in Christ: please do be careful in this thread. In reading some of the responses, folks seeming to be treading closer and closer to a Feeneyist argument and interpretation of extra ecclesiam nulla salus. Please remember that, as the Second Vatican Council stated in Unitatis Redintegratio:The brethren divided from us also use many liturgical actions of the Christian religion. These most certainly can truly engender a life of grace in ways that vary according to the condition of each Church or Community. These liturgical actions must be regarded as capable of giving access to the community of salvation. It follows that the separated Churches and Communities as such, though we believe them to be deficient in some respects, have been by no means deprived of significance and importance in the mystery of salvation.

Further Dominus Iesum reminds us for those who are not formally and visibly members of the Church, salvation in Christ is accessible by virtue of a grace which, while having a mysterious relationship to the Church, does not make them formally part of the Church, but enlightens them in a way which is accommodated to their spiritual and material situation. This grace comes from Christ; it is the result of his sacrifice and is communicated by the Holy Spirit; it has a relationship with the Church, which, according to the plan of the Father, has her origin in the mission of the Son and the Holy Spirit

From this modern Church thought, I take it that one will NOT go to Hell for being outside of the Catholic Church, but one certainly does not have access to all of the wonderful sacraments there, which can only serve to build up our relationship with God.
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Thank you!!! I guess everyone else didn’t read this. Heaven is obtainable outside the Catholic Church.

May God Bless!

Ed
 
credoinunum said:
Kindly develop your argument. It is a bad habit to treat flat denial as evidence. I agree with the notion of invisible ignorance, but we seem to be at loggerheads on the interpretation of the Vatican II documents. If I am mistaken…prove it, or at least do the intellectually honest thing and explain my error. It strikes me that you’d just rather argue that engage in any fruitful discussion.

By the way, I am not canonizing protestants, although there are some protestants who should, perhaps, be canonized (Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. for example) and some non-Christians too (i.e., Gandhi). But that’s beside the point.
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Who is using only a flat denial as evidence? The Vatican II documents you site are in harmony with the teaching of invincible ignorance. Your problem is in taking** excerpts out of context and presenting them as a blanket approval of Protestantism.**
Why** would you canonize Martin Luther King, Jr? What criteria would you use? Same with Gandhi – why? There is ample recorded evidence that MLK was a habitual adulterer. Whether it’s absolutely true or not would hinder your canonization of him.**
As for Gandhi – he may have had** FULL**** knowledge of the Gospel and rejected it. You don’t know either way. How do you KNOW that these men fell under the invincible ignorance criteria set forth by the Church?**
As for the teaching of invincible ignorance, here is an excerpt from “Ignorance - Invincible and Vincible”** - by Jimmy Akin, which is based on the Catechism of the Catholic Church:**
Depending on its type and degree, ignorance may remove, diminish, leave unaffected, or even increase one’s culpability for a materially sinful act (cf. CCC 1735, 1746, 1859). Conversely, it may have the same effects on one’s imputability for a materially righteous act. Here we will deal only with the effects of ignorance on one’s culpability for sin.
A person who is ignorant of the gospel of Christ and his Church through no fault of his own (or, by extension, through his merely venial fault) can be saved-if he otherwise does what is required for salvation, according to the level of opportunity, enlightenment, and grace God gives him (CCC 847, 1260).
In such cases, people are not saved apart from the true Church. Though they are not “fully incorporated” into the mystical Body of Christ, they are “joined” or “related” to the Church (to use Vatican II’s language) by the elements of saving grace God has given them. One might thus speak of them as having been “partially incorporated,” though not obtaining membership in the proper sense (Pius XII, Mysitici Corporis 22).
Unfortunately, there are a number of erroneous views regarding salvation and invincible ignorance that need to be pointed out. First, the fact that someone is invincibly ignorant of the true faith is not a ticket to heaven. A person who is not culpable for sins against faith may still be culpable for other mortal sins-the same ones people of faith can commit-and may be damned on that account.
 
Richard_Kastner said:
Well, I didn’t use that verse because I was making a specific point that Jesus makes it clear that the Sabbath is the Lord’s day. Funny that you don’t mention that in your post, but now as long as you bring up Mark2:28 look what is says. ]“The sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath.” Where in this verse does it say anything about Jews?

Again Mark2:27 The son of man is Lord of the sabbath. Making the Sabbath the Lord’s day and Mark2:28 The sabbath was made for man not man for the sabbath. The Sabbath was made for man. Not the Jews. This includes Christians
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HUH??** Man, that’s convoluted thinking.**
First of all, Jesus was driving home the point that the Sabbath was NOT what was important but doing the will of God. The Apostles were being condemned by the Pharisees for gleaning grain on the Sabbath because they needed to eat. THAT’S why Jesus rebuked them.
As for Jesus calling it the Lord’s Day – that’s NOT what he said. He said, “… the Son of Man is lord even of the Sabbath” – which he IS. He was telling them that he was Lord OVER ALL**. He NEVER called it the Lord’s day.**
Peter spoke well of you when he said:
2 Peter 3:16
“In them there are some things hard to understand that the ignorant and unstable distort to their own destruction, just as they do the other scriptures.”
 
Richard_Kastner said:
Ok, elvisman lets go slow here so we don’t misunderstand one another. Above is your original reply to my post. Because of this statement: The Mosaic Law was the forshadowing of Jesus - he is the REAL thing.We worship - as did the early Church in the New Testament - on Sunday, the Lord’s Day. PS - Jesus IS the Lord I assumed that you thought that the Sabbath commandment was of the Mosaic law and therefore subject to change. Was I wrong in assuming this. I guess your post here to me anyway does not answer the question as to why you seem to think the Sabbath was changed to Sunday.

In this post you say:Similarly, in Col. 2:16-17, Paul tells us not to let ANYBODY judge us regarding the sabbath.
Guess what? That includes YOU.
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You apparantly think that Paul is talking about the Sabbath of the decalogue. Is this right?

To answer your question Paul didn’t meet on Sunday it is extremely apparent in the book of Acts that Paul was a Sabbath keeper.
**To answer your allegation that the early Church didn’t meet on Sunday - I offer the following passages in Scripture reject your position: Acts 20:7, 1 Corinthians 16:2, Colossians 2:16-17, and Revelation 1:10. They show that the Sabbath is no longer binding and that Christians are to worship on the Lord’s day, Sunday, instead. **
The Early Church observed Sunday as the Day of the Lord – from the 1st CENTURY on:
The Didache
"But every Lord’s day . . . gather yourselves together and break bread,** and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure. But let no one that is at variance with his fellow come together with you, until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice may not be profaned" (Didache 14 A.D. 70]).
**
The Letter of Barnabas
"We keep the eighth day [Sunday]** with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead" (Letter of Barnabas 15:6–8 A.D. 74]).
**
Ignatius of Antioch
*"[T]hose who were brought up in the ancient order of things * have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s day, on which also our life has sprung up again by him and by his death" (Letter to the Magnesians 8 [A.D. 110]).

Justin Martyr
"[W]e too would observe the fleshly circumcision, and the Sabbaths, and in short all the feasts, if we did not know for what reason they were enjoined [on] you—namely, on account of your transgressions and the hardness of your heart. . . . How is it, Trypho, that we would not observe those rites which do not harm us—I speak of fleshly circumcision and Sabbaths and feasts? . . . God enjoined you to keep the Sabbath, and imposed on you other precepts for a sign, as I have already said, on account of your unrighteousness and that of your fathers . . ." (Dialogue with Trypho the Jew 18, 21 A.D. 155]).

“But* Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly*, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead” (First Apology 67 A.D. 155]). **
 
FRANCISPIE said:
I very much want to quit the catholic church and become an
Assembly of God member. Am i doomed for hell?

I don’t fit in with the CC, there is no enthusiasm there.
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Francispie:

I address this directly to you my friend. Your question asks will you go to hell if you become a member of a church other than the catholic church? The answer is no.

When you get to heaven God is not going to ask you for your church ID and say, “Ok, you’re in.” He is not going to ask to see your credentials to see if you fulfilled all of your “sacraments.” OUR Lord and Saviour is much much bigger than that. He is much more loving that that!!!

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. John 14 5-7

Francispie, Jesus died for our sins. To believe otherwise or think that performing a series of rites and rituals are going to get you to heaven would be a mockery of what HE did for us on that cross.

Be free of any guilt you feel regarding your choice to follow the Lord. Listen to His voice.
 
elvisman said:
To answer your allegation that the early Church didn’t meet on Sunday - I offer the following passages in Scripture reject your position: Acts 20:7, 1 Corinthians 16:2, Colossians 2:16-17, and Revelation 1:10**. They show that the Sabbath is no longer binding** and that Christians are to worship on the Lord’s day, Sunday, instead.
The Early Church observed Sunday as the Day of the Lord – from the 1st CENTURY on:
The Didache
"But every Lord’s day . . . gather yourselves together and break bread,** and give thanksgiving after having confessed your transgressions, that your sacrifice may be pure. But let no one that is at variance with his fellow come together with you, until they be reconciled, that your sacrifice may not be profaned" (Didache** 14 A.D. 70]).

The Letter of Barnabas
"We keep the eighth day [Sunday]** with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead" (Letter of Barnabas** 15:6–8 A.D. 74]).

Ignatius of Antioch
"[T]hose who were brought up in the ancient order of things * have come to the possession of a new hope, no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s day*, on which also our life has sprung up again by him and by his death" (Letter to the Magnesians 8 [A.D. 110]).

Justin Martyr
"[W]e too would observe the fleshly circumcision, and the Sabbaths, and in short all the feasts, if we did not know for what reason they were enjoined [on] you—namely, on account of your transgressions and the hardness of your heart. . . . How is it, Trypho, that we would not observe those rites which do not harm us—I speak of fleshly circumcision and Sabbaths and feasts? . . . God enjoined you to keep the Sabbath, and imposed on you other precepts for a sign, as I have already said, on account of your unrighteousness and that of your fathers . . ." (Dialogue with Trypho the Jew 18, 21 A.D. 155]).

“But* Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly*, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead” (First Apology 67 A.D. 155]).

I might have missed something here, all this talk about Sunday as the sabbath, but don’t most Catholic churches have Saturday evening mass?

Also, does this answer the original question in this thread?

Lord, forgive us for all of this squabbling. Let us break bread together and share the common love you have for each and every one of us - regardless of the rites and rituals we adhere to in trying to honor you. We all fall short.
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Monica4316 said:
huh?!?

there are MANY Catholic priests spreading God’s word. I personally know several. Your post is very judgemental, I’m sorry.
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It’s funny how for two thousand years Catholic priests have gone to the ends of the earth to proclaim God’s word (I don’t know how else we could have reached more than 1 billion members without their efforts) only to be derided by the likes of prejudiced people who believe they aren’t. :rolleyes:
 
josie_L said:
It’s funny how for two thousand years Catholic priests have gone to the ends of the earth to proclaim God’s word (I don’t know how else we could have reached more than 1 billion members without their efforts) only to be derided by the likes of prejudiced people who believe they aren’t. :rolleyes:
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I believe this is in responce to my post that was commented on. Now if you read my post I said “not where I live.” How is this being prejudice if I’m speaking the truth about this where I live. Now if you speak the truth is being prejudice? I’m far from being prejudice. I never said anything bad about the priests, as a matter of fact I have said in other sites that I respect them and have nothing against them. Now I’m prejudice because I said nothing against them except “not where I live” that don’t sound prejudice to me. Look at the whole picture before you call others prejudice.
 
rev_kevin said:
“”"
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Ya why where I live at they don’t got outside their church and hold services for people in the nursing homes. I wonder why? Why don’t they do it? Could it be because its not the proper setting like the church is?

rev you do not know what youare trying to saymI,m Cathloic and in my Church we have 6 priest that goes to a nursing homes and has service for these people eack week and some during the day each day.
we have 5 retiern priest that say mass 7 days a week,at nursing homes,we have two priest that have mass each day at the hosp
As you know that Cathloic priest must say mass once a day
rev Sorry to say but your statement is Wrong
 
Bill_Pick said:
Ya why where I live at they don’t got outside their church and hold services for people in the nursing homes. I wonder why? Why don’t they do it? Could it be because its not the proper setting like the church is?
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rev you do not know what youare trying to saymI,m Cathloic and in my Church we have 6 priest that goes to a nursing homes and has service for these people eack week and some during the day each day.
we have 5 retiern priest that say mass 7 days a week,at nursing homes,we have two priest that have mass each day at the hosp
As you know that Cathloic priest must say mass once a day
rev Sorry to say but your statement is Wrong

I beg to differ with you, my statement is correct. Do you live where I live? If not then you don’t know this not to be true. Just because it is done where you live doesn’t mean it happens everywhere.
I didn’t say all priests I said where I live at do we understand the words where I live at. Then I asked 3 questions.
  1. I wonder why? I got no answer
    2 Why don’t the do it? I got no answer
  2. Could it be because its not the proper setting like the church is? I got no answer
Now I hope you now understand what “where I live” means.
And I hope you now know these are questions not statements.
 
rev_kevin said:
rev you do not know what youare trying to saymI,m Cathloic and in my Church we have 6 priest that goes to a nursing homes and has service for these people eack week and some during the day each day.
we have 5 retiern priest that say mass 7 days a week,at nursing homes,we have two priest that have mass each day at the hosp
As you know that Cathloic priest must say mass once a day
rev Sorry to say but your statement is Wrong
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I beg to differ with you, my statement is correct. Do you live where I live? If not then you don’t know this not to be true. Just because it is done where you live doesn’t mean it happens everywhere.
I didn’t say all priests I said where I live at do we understand the words where I live at. Then I asked 3 questions.
  1. I wonder why? I got no answer
    2 Why don’t the do it? I got no answer
  2. Could it be because its not the proper setting like the church is? I got no answer
Now I hope you now understand what “where I live” means.
And I hope you now know these are questions not statements.

Dont you live in Texas,how many Churchs do you have t\where you live
 
Bill_Pick said:
I beg to differ with you, my statement is correct. Do you live where I live? If not then you don’t know this not to be true. Just because it is done where you live doesn’t mean it happens everywhere.
I didn’t say all priests I said where I live at do we understand the words where I live at. Then I asked 3 questions.
  1. I wonder why? I got no answer
    2 Why don’t the do it? I got no answer
  2. Could it be because its not the proper setting like the church is? I got no answer
Now I hope you now understand what “where I live” means.
And I hope you now know these are questions not statements.
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Dont you live in Texas,how many Churchs do you have t\where you live

To answer your question I have no idea how many churches but there is only 1 catholic church in my city but there are others in the surrounding area. How many I don’t know but I would guess more than 1.

Now I have asked 3 questions and have not got a single answer.
 
elvisman said:
No, you are self-divroced from the Body of Christ. A separated brother.
By rejecting his Church - you reject HIM (Luke 10:16).

Remember - it is the CHURCH that has the final say on earth (Matt. 16:15-19, 18:15-18, John 16:12-15, 20:21-23) - NOT you.
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I and many of my protestant siblings Have recieved Christ and believe His name thus we are children of God born of God.

John 1:12 But to all who did receive him,(S) who believed in his name,(T) he gave the right(U) to become(V) children of God, 13who(W) were born,(X) not of blood(Y) nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Scripture cannot be broken.
Should I believe God or should I believe a false doctrine?
Christ founded an assembly a congregation those that who are His are members of that assembly—His Church. Christ has demonstrated that we are His by His dwelling within us and He giving His Holy Spirit.
So how can you deny us when God has accepted us? We are approved of God I would be foolish to believe any false doctrine of man.

Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

No Condemnation!!!
Who has given you the ministry of accussor of the brethern? It was not God!

Romans 8:4
in order that(I) the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us,(J) who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5For(K) those who live according to the flesh set their minds on(L) the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on(M) the things of the Spirit. 6For to set(N) the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. 7For the mind that is set on the flesh is(O) hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law;(P) indeed, it cannot. 8Those who are in the flesh cannot please God. 9You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact(Q) the Spirit of God dwells in you.(R) Anyone who does not have(S) the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. 10But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11If the Spirit of(T) him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies(U) through his Spirit who dwells in you.
Heirs with Christ
12So then, brothers,[d] we are debtors,(V) not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you(W) put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are(X) led by the Spirit of God are(Y) sons[e] of God. 15For(Z) you did not receive(AA) the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of(AB) adoption as sons, by whom we cry,(AC) “Abba! Father!” 16(AD) The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17and if children, then(AE) heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ,(AF) provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.

What God has joined with Himself let NO MAN attempt to split!
 
Jars_of_Clay said:
I might have missed something here, all this talk about Sunday as the sabbath, but don’t most Catholic churches have Saturday evening mass?

Also, does this answer the original question in this thread?

Lord, forgive us for all of this squabbling. Let us break bread together and share the common love you have for each and every one of us - regardless of the rites and rituals we adhere to in trying to honor you. We all fall short.
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For your information, I didn’t start the Sabbath/Sunday issue - Richard Kastner did. I was defending the Christian position about the Lord’s Day being on Sunday.

I see you’re new here and don’t understand how things work yet. The Sabbath/Sunday topic IS relevant to this thread as it speaks to Church Authority.

Probably better if you minded your own business - or at least read the posts.
 
1 Ptr 1:23(BD) since you have been born again,(BE) not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through(BF) the living and abiding word of God;

We have been born of imperisable seed and you would deny that we are not of His Church. How can we be born of God and not be part of His Church. You deny Christ.

1 Jn 5:1(A) Everyone who believes that(B) Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and(C) everyone who loves the Father loves whoever has been born of him. 2(D) By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and obey his commandments. 3For(E) this is the love of God, that we(F) keep his commandments. And(G) his commandments are not burdensome. **4For(H) everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. **And this is the victory that has overcome the world—(I) our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes(J) that Jesus is the Son of God?

2Cor 5:18All this is from God,(AB) who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us(AC) the ministry of reconciliation;

We have been reconciled to Him we are part of His congregation His assembly
 
Hisalone said:
I and many of my protestant siblings Have recieved Christ and believe His name thus we are children of God born of God.

John 1:12 But to all who did receive him,(S) who believed in his name,(T) he gave the right(U) to become(V) children of God, 13who(W) were born,(X) not of blood(Y) nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

Scripture cannot be broken.
Should I believe God or should I believe a false doctrine?
Christ founded an assembly a congregation those that who are His are members of that assembly—His Church. Christ has demonstrated that we are His by His dwelling within us and He giving His Holy Spirit.
So how can you deny us when God has accepted us? We are approved of God I would be foolish to believe any false doctrine of man.

Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

No Condemnation!!!
Who has given you the ministry of accussor of the brethern? It was not God!

Romans 8:4
in order that(I) the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us,(J) who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5For(K) those who live according to the flesh set their minds on(L) the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on(M) the things of the Spirit. 6For to set(N) the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. 7For the mind that is set on the flesh is(O) hostile to God, for it does not submit to God’s law;(P) indeed, it cannot. 8Those who are in the flesh cannot please God. 9You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact(Q) the Spirit of God dwells in you.(R) Anyone who does not have(S) the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. 10But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11If the Spirit of(T) him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies(U) through his Spirit who dwells in you.
Heirs with Christ
12So then, brothers,[d] we are debtors,(V) not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you(W) put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14For all who are(X) led by the Spirit of God are(Y) sons[e] of God. 15For(Z) you did not receive(AA) the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of(AB) adoption as sons, by whom we cry,(AC) “Abba! Father!” 16(AD) The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17and if children, then(AE) heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ,(AF) provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.

What God has joined with Himself let NO MAN attempt to split!
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I’M not trying to deny you anything. As a Protestant - YOU’VE done that yourself.

You are right about ONE thing in your post:
"What God has joined with Himself let NO MAN attempt to split!"

The Protestant Revolt was just that - an ecclesiastical divorce from the Body of Christ.
Again - Protestantism was born of divorce - that’s why you have perpetually splintering Protestant sects, constantly divorcing themselves from one another.

Matt.7:21
"Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.
 
Hisalone said:
1 Ptr 1:23(BD) since you have been born again,(BE) not of perishable seed but of imperishable, through(BF) the living and abiding word of God;

We have been born of imperisable seed and you would deny that we are not of His Church. How can we be born of God and not be part of His Church. You deny Christ.

1 Jn 5:1(A) Everyone who believes that(B) Jesus is the Christ has been born of God, and(C) everyone who loves the Father loves whoever has been born of him. 2(D) By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and obey his commandments. 3For(E) this is the love of God, that we(F) keep his commandments. And(G) his commandments are not burdensome. **4For(H) everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. **And this is the victory that has overcome the world—(I) our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes(J) that Jesus is the Son of God?

2Cor 5:18All this is from God,(AB) who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us(AC) the ministry of reconciliation;

We have been reconciled to Him we are part of His congregation His assembly
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No - the CHURCH has - and you ain’t part of it until you swallow your pride and come home.
 
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