Wives, Submit to your own husbands as to the Lord

[Baron_Korf]

Of course there will be a fuss-no one likes to be told to obey someone even if they had less brains just because of their gender.

Words have Gender, People have Sex.

If only it were as simple as you say. There is nothing unfair on the husband’s side. In real life these days, its safe to say no husband needs to worry about being crucified for his wife so I dont know what you are on about.

It is that simple. You don’t do allegory well, do you? I used the image of crucified, but St Paul says “gave himself up”. How did he do this? As Isaiah foretold him to be, the suffering servant. So a husband is to patiently deny himself in the service of his wife and his family. Christ wasn’t kidding when he said that he could summon throngs of angels to save him from that fate, but he accepted it as the Father’s will and suffered patiently and praying for those who were doing him wrong. Also recall the washing of the feet, and all of his lectures on leaders must serve and not be served.

So by St Paul telling the husbands to be as Christ, it means to take on a life as the suffering servent. Whether that means a drudging job, giving up selfish habits, putting up with wife’s idiocyncries, etc, we men are to suffer this gladly for the sake of our wives and the sake of the kingdom. As leaders we must think of what is best for the family, especially when pitted against our own interest.

But as you say, there is nothing unfair.

So are you saying wives should obey their husbands because their husbands are willing to and queueing to be crucified or to suffer such other horrible deaths for them?

No, that would be a tit for tat situation. Wives are to submit to their husbands, because that’s what Paul is teaching. Husbands are to be the suffering servant for thier wives for the same reason. Since it is not a give and take, that means you are to do this regardless if your husband is a jerk or your wife is a shrew. Look at the saints, like St Monica, who’s holiness led to her husband’s conversion before his death. Marriage is a sacrament which means its primary purpose is oriented to holiness. As we have learned by being Christians, holiness and worldly happiness don’t normally go hand in hand.

 

[severus68]

Words have Gender, People have Sex.

It is that simple. You don’t do allegory well, do you? I used the image of crucified, but St Paul says “gave himself up”. How did he do this? As Isaiah foretold him to be, the suffering servant. So a husband is to patiently deny himself in the service of his wife and his family. Christ wasn’t kidding when he said that he could summon throngs of angels to save him from that fate, but he accepted it as the Father’s will and suffered patiently and praying for those who were doing him wrong. Also recall the washing of the feet, and all of his lectures on leaders must serve and not be served.

So by St Paul telling the husbands to be as Christ, it means to take on a life as the suffering servent. Whether that means a drudging job, giving up selfish habits, putting up with wife’s idiocyncries, etc, we men are to suffer this gladly for the sake of our wives and the sake of the kingdom. As leaders we must think of what is best for the family, especially when pitted against our own interest.

But as you say, there is nothing unfair.

No, that would be a tit for tat situation. Wives are to submit to their husbands, because that’s what Paul is teaching. Husbands are to be the suffering servant for thier wives for the same reason. Since it is not a give and take, that means you are to do this regardless if your husband is a jerk or your wife is a shrew. Look at the saints, like St Monica, who’s holiness led to her husband’s conversion before his death. Marriage is a sacrament which means its primary purpose is oriented to holiness. As we have learned by being Christians, holiness and worldly happiness don’t normally go hand in hand.

Your trying to explain is appreciated. I have read quite a lot on this and other matters. My understanding on what the message is supposed to mean may not be totally the same as your. I believe if both husband and wife live their marriages and their lives as Christ would want, that would be a perfect marriage. We are not perfect and we fail but the trying is most important.

I think sometimes the emphasis on this submission of wives and the insistence on “your” meaning is done on purpose to get to people. My apologies if that is not your purpose. I also believe that sarcasm should not be used to force your views. We do know what an allegory is.

It should be mutual. Christ accepted the Father’s will, husbands and wives can submit to God. A wife should not give in to the abuse of a husband and vice versa. It is not about tit for tat but a marriage of mutual love and repect.

By the way men, husbands or otherwise can be just as idiocyncratic as women.

 

[ac_claire]

Good points, severus…However it should be noted that nobody said men couldn’t be idiocyncratic or that any woman should give in to an abusive man, or that love and respect shouldn’t be mutual, etc., etc. You’re arguing with a bunch of straw men here.

 

[severus68]

Good points, severus…However it should be noted that nobody said men couldn’t be idiocyncratic or that any woman should give in to an abusive man, or that love and respect shouldn’t be mutual, etc., etc. You’re arguing with a bunch of straw men here.

Well then, since no one have said or intimated anything of that sort on this thread, my apologies to all. We all appear tp be in agreement with all that is important.