You can't be both a Catholic and a Feminist

[ElizabethAnne]

yochumjy:

I hope you realize, I was supporting you. You do admit, as with many things the vocal minority gets noticed the most. And of course it is impossible to truly uphold the dignity of woman and degrade men and children, but that IS the attempt by radical feminism. My guess is we are on the same side here! On the other hand in order to overcome the wrongness of the radical part of feminism, you need to accept that they are there and overcome them with truth. Forgive me if I’m wrong but you sound defensive, and when you react like that it simply puts people off. Of course, I would never do anything like that myself!

Hello yochumjy. I did understand that you were supporting me, and I appreciate it. I don’t know what you mean by saying that I sounded defensive. I may defend the fact that feminism is not only a group of women trying to free themselves from the “oppression” of men, but I never intended to be defensive.

kev7:

You didn’t answer my question. Why do you need to add the ‘Label’ of feminist to your title as a catholic.

You are right. NOBODY ELSE NEEDS FEMINISM . Catholics don’t need it because the church already upholds the rights of women. Mother Teresa proved this.

When it comes to the protection of women and support that they need I would rather trust the catholic church. I would rather trust Jesus.

Why do you think that Catholic teaching isn’t Clear? Did the holy father through his inspired works not help us in that regard?

The word of God is clear. It is the truth and it always will be.

You can not say, “I follow the word of God and the word of feminism”

The word of God is all you need.

I know that the Catholic Church upholds the rights of women. I don’t call myself a Feminist Catholic. I am a Catholic first, but I am also a feminist because there is nothing wrong with being Catholic and believing in the equal dignity of men and women. We are equal but not the same, that is what the Church teaches. It is a beautiful teaching that I hope to bring to others.

I want to show them that a feminist can be pro-life. That believing in equal rights doesn’t mean supporting the killing of unborn babies. How important is that message? I think it’s terribly important for confused women who think that the only way men and women will truly be equal is when women have “reproductive freedom.”

kev7:

Discontinue your membership and join “Catholics for life” be a catholic woman and not a feminst woman.

Do you know anything about the organization Feminists for Life? The group brings pro-lifers together and crosses the boundaries of religious and political party differences. I believe it is always good to cooperate with those who have pro-life values. The central organization works hard at lobbying the legislature and passing laws that are good for women and good for their unborn children. As I said before, the group also points out that the early feminists like Susan B. Anthony and Elizabeth Cady Stanton were pro-life! Hence bringing the definition of feminism back to its roots.

You can visit their website at feministsforlife.org/.

 

[Pug]

kev7:

Discontinue your membership and join “Catholics for life” be a catholic woman and not a feminst woman.

I think a Catholic can belong to a political organization that does not have “Catholic” in the title. If the organization is doing things locally to advance Catholic interests, this is a good thing. Why not work together with those who are not Catholic as well as those who are Catholic?

Unless there is something wrong with the agenda of this specific organization?

 

[kev7]

ElizabethAnne:

. I am a Catholic first, but I am also a feminist because there is nothing wrong with being Catholic and believing in the equal dignity of men and women. We are equal but not the same, that is what the Church teaches. It is a beautiful teaching that I hope to bring to others.

I want to show them that a feminist can be pro-life. That believing in equal rights doesn’t mean supporting the killing of unborn babies. How important is that message? I think it’s terribly important for confused women who think that the only way men and women will truly be equal is when women have “reproductive freedom.”

I still don’t understand why beliving in the equal dignity of men and women isn’t part of your catholic faith alone. Why is it a feminist concept? Again I ask you, what is your need to be a feminist? What is it about feminism that the catholic church does not have for you? Why must you step outside your faith and include yourself in an organization that is full of moral relativism.

That is like saying to Jesus, “when it comes to helping women I do not do it in your name, but I’m still your follower”

Life is an important message, but when you are a follower of Christ you teach in his name.

 

[Michael_Welter]

kev7, by your argument, a Catholic should not belong to the Republican or Democratic parties, either, since the Church provides everything we need. I am a registered Republican, so I am a Republican Catholic. Am I worng for saying this?

 

[kev7]

Pug:

I think a Catholic can belong to a political organization that does not have “Catholic” in the title. If the organization is doing things locally to advance Catholic interests, this is a good thing. Why not work together with those who are not Catholic as well as those who are Catholic?

Unless there is something wrong with the agenda of this specific organization?

It is not a point of working together with those who are non catholic. I agree with you on that

The point I’m trying to make is that when you do work with non Catholics you should work with them AS a catholic. You should represent! That is the problem with some people today. They fail to represent the church. They would rather join a group that has an undefined moral center then stay true to their faith - A faith that provides them with everything.

When I vote I do so as a catholic and a catholic alone. When it comes to political parties I an NOT GUILTY!

 

[kev7]

Michael Welter:

kev7, by your argument, a Catholic should not belong to the Republican or Democratic parties, either, since the Church provides everything we need. I am a registered Republican, so I am a Republican Catholic. Am I worng for saying this?

Yes I would have to say that you are wrong for saying that.

Would jesus call himself the son of God and then say “hail Ceser?”

I think not! he would say, “give to Ceser what is Cesers’”

I just don’t understand the need to be a Republican Catholic. If you are a republican catholic then are you not in conflict with the churches teachings on the iraq war? If you are a democrat catholic then are you not in conflict with the churches teachings on abortion?

I can tell you that I do not and would never call myself anything but a catholic. That is who I am. It is the foundation of all the choices I make in my life at every level. I need no other doctrine or political association.

 

[La_Chiara]

Well, good for you Kev! But who are you to define feminism for women? One, you are not a woman and two, you are not the Pope (or a member of the Magisterium). You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But if you are going to convince anyone, you ought to find a less aggressive way to sell your thoughts. Just my :twocents:. And BTW, like Elizabeth Anne, I consider myself a faithful Catholic woman, a feminist, pro-life, and conservative politically.

 

[Michael_Welter]

kev7:

I just don’t understand the need to be a Republican Catholic. If you are a republican catholic then are you not in conflict with the churches teachings on the iraq war? If you are a democrat catholic then are you not in conflict with the churches teachings on abortion?

I am a registered Republican. This allows me to vote in the primaries. I don’t agree with everything that the Republican party preaches. For example, I disagree with the party’s support of the death penalty. I never violate my Catholic beliefs in the way I vote. I am not in conflict with the Church’s teaching on the war in Iraq, as the Church has not issued any dogmatic teaching on the war in Iraq.

 

[Joseph_Bilodeau]

kev7:

…All you women who call yourselves feminist need to take [Mother Teresa] as role model.

I know several who do. There are doubtless many, many more I do not know who also do.

 

[Aesq]

kev7:

When I vote I do so as a catholic and a catholic alone. When it comes to political parties I an NOT GUILTY!

And the Church is who got women the right to vote? The Church is politically working for equal pay issues? Really. A woman would not have the right to vote as a catholic if it were not for some non-catholic organizations of the past.

 

[ElizabethAnne]

kev7:

It is not a point of working together with those who are non catholic. I agree with you on that

The point I’m trying to make is that when you do work with non Catholics you should work with them AS a catholic. You should represent! That is the problem with some people today. They fail to represent the church. They would rather join a group that has an undefined moral center then stay true to their faith - A faith that provides them with everything.

When I vote I do so as a catholic and a catholic alone. When it comes to political parties I an NOT GUILTY!

I think it is very unfair for you to say that anyone who is a feminist or a republican is not representing their Catholic faith. I am extremely dedicated and true to my faith. As I said before, I am Catholic first. From there I meet other people and become involved in organizations I believe in like Feminists for Life.

My pro-life views come from the Catholic Church, and my views on what it is to be female and have dignity come from the Church. But this doesn’t mean that I am somehow denying my faith by getting involved with a non-Catholic organization. In fact, I am being the “salt of the earth and light of the world.”

To quote one of my earlier posts:
“I want to show people that a feminist can be pro-life. That believing in equal rights doesn’t mean supporting the killing of unborn babies. How important is that message? I think it’s terribly important for confused women who think that the only way men and women will truly be equal is when women have ‘reproductive freedom.’”

 

[kev7]

Michael Welter:

I am a registered Republican. This allows me to vote in the primaries. I don’t agree with everything that the Republican party preaches. For example, I disagree with the party’s support of the death penalty. I never violate my Catholic beliefs in the way I vote. I am not in conflict with the Church’s teaching on the war in Iraq, as the Church has not issued any dogmatic teaching on the war in Iraq.

What are you talking about? John Paul II was against the "preemptive war” doctrine.

You see by your own words you are not a republican. You are a catholic. You only support some of the republicans policy because it is the same as catholic doctrine.

It is important for you not to consider yourself a republican. You clearly are not.

 

[kev7]

ElizabethAnne:

I think it is very unfair for you to say that anyone who is a feminist or a republican is not representing their Catholic faith. I am extremely dedicated and true to my faith. As I said before, I am Catholic first. From there I meet other people and become involved in organizations I believe in like Feminists for Life.

My pro-life views come from the Catholic Church, and my views on what it is to be female and have dignity come from the Church. But this doesn’t mean that I am somehow denying my faith by getting involved with a non-Catholic organization. In fact, I am being the “salt of the earth and light of the world.”

To quote one of my earlier posts:
“I want to show people that a feminist can be pro-life. That believing in equal rights doesn’t mean supporting the killing of unborn babies. How important is that message? I think it’s terribly important for confused women who think that the only way men and women will truly be equal is when women have ‘reproductive freedom.’”

when are you going to answer my questions? Why did you call yourself a feminist and a catholic? why do you feel the need to call yourself a feminist? what is it about feminism that you feel is lacking from the catholic church.

It is clear to me that YOU ARE NOT A FEMINST YOU ARE A CATHOLIC! your own statements prove this.

You are a catholic and a catholic only. You might infiltrate other social or political groups to promote your faith in the church, but you are truely not part of them.

Did I not explain the damange that you cause when you say, “I am a feminist and a catholic?” What does that say to people out side the church? What kind of image is that for church? It tells everyone outside the church that its women do not agree with the church and that they are fighting it.

Just because I put a christmas tree up like the pagans did, doesn’t mean I should call myself a pagan Catholic.

 

[Michael_Welter]

kev7:

What are you talking about? John Paul II was against the "preemptive war” doctrine.

Yes, he expressed his opinion that war was wrong, but he never that official Church teaching, and never obliged all Catholics to agree with him on that issue.

BTW, it was not a preemptive war. The US was attacked, and responded. But that’s a whole other thread.

 

[kev7]

La Chiara:

Well, good for you Kev! But who are you to define feminism for women? One, you are not a woman and two, you are not the Pope (or a member of the Magisterium). You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But if you are going to convince anyone, you ought to find a less aggressive way to sell your thoughts. Just my :twocents:. And BTW, like Elizabeth Anne, I consider myself a faithful Catholic woman, a feminist, pro-life, and conservative politically.

Why must I be a woman? Sounds like a feminist argument. If I was a woman would you listen? Would that make any difference?

I guess you would listen to jesus more if he wasn’t a man.,

You are right I am not the pope. But I have a right to defend my faith as a catholic from moral relativism. Feminism is a part of moral relativism.

As a woman maybe you can help me understand why you need to call yourself a feminist? Why can’t you support the church as a woman?. The church is in need of women like you to support it. You need to walk with Jesus.

 

[kev7]

Aesq:

And the Church is who got women the right to vote? The Church is politically working for equal pay issues? Really. A woman would not have the right to vote as a catholic if it were not for some non-catholic organizations of the past.

gee I wonder why that is? Perhaps it was because the women of the Catholic church didn’t act as catholics!

For your information the Church has made many statments regarding the rights of women.

 

[Bella3502]

kev7:

when are you going to answer my questions?

Sounds like she has answered your questions… you just don’t like her answers.

Right on Elizabeth Anne… nothing else need be said.

 

[kev7]

Bella3502:

kev7:

when are you going to answer my questions?

Sounds like she has answered your questions… you just don’t like her answers.

Right on Elizabeth Anne… nothing else need be said.

no she did not answer my questions. I still don’t know why she needs to call herself a feminist. Can she not defend the rights of women and the life of unborn children as a catholic? Why should the feminists get all the credit for her work? She even said herself that her actions are based on the catholic church.

It really makes me sad to see people who are inspired by Christ like Elizabeth Anne) not giving him the credit that he deserves.

It would be like preaching the teachings of Christ without telling everyone about him.

Why is it so hard for everyone to see that you should act and live your life as a catholic and a catholic only. Why are there Catholics who act in a plural fahsion? Are they ashamed of the Catholic church? Are they not strong enough in their faith to act as Catholics?

I guess this is just another result of moral relativism. People are taking on many labels and pluralistic views. They don’t believe that the catholic church teaches exclusive truth I guess.

 

[Pug]

kev7:

The point I’m trying to make is that when you do work with non Catholics you should work with them AS a catholic. You should represent!

This is a good point: many Catholics are too quiet about being Catholic. I don’t mean any of the women on this thread, I just mean in general. ]

I agree with another poster, though. It is nice to be registered in a political party so that you can vote in the primary. In many places, the primary *is *the election, as the small offices run uncontested. However, I am not satisfied with either party as a whole.

 

[siamesecat]

Aesq:

And the Church is who got women the right to vote? The Church is politically working for equal pay issues? Really. A woman would not have the right to vote as a catholic if it were not for some non-catholic organizations of the past.

You said what I was going too but couldnt figure out how to phrase it. The Catholic Church does not do work for equality of women, even if its a teaching. So by using the teachings of the church, these Catholic women are going to non-Catholic organizations that do work for these things. I dont see your problem. Everyone has their cause. Can I not work for a charity that isn’t Catholic because “Im a humanitarian” and not a Catholic?