Young single Catholics

  • Thread starter Thread starter oldfashcathgirl
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
LightFromLight said:
Sorry but this is not the case. In the Catholic Church a marriage is not valid until consummated. Remember, Mary and Joseph were married under Jewish law, which was different.
Click to expand...
You are incorrect. A marriage is valid at the vows. It becomes indissoluable at the consummation.
 
57thDimension said:
I don’t think people feel the need to appreciate it as a significant act if non-appreciation is not recognized and objected to.

If both spouses are not hypersexualized individuals, as society tends to drive people to be, then infidelity will almost certainly not occur. You have two factors: interest and impulsivity. Having both very low (in both spouses) nearly guarantees a marriage free of infidelity. Having both high/very high will increase the odds a great deal for infidelity. Promiscuity as well occurs due to high levels of both. So, as a society we need to lower interest/drive and structure our lives in a less impulsive way.

The primary purpose of marriage is the procreation of children, not having some arbitrarily high level of sexual interaction with one’s spouse. If I met a Catholic women who had a low sex drive (by societies absurd standards), it wouldn’t bother me. Marriage isn’t supposed to be a carnal playground.

+Sebastian
Click to expand...
If you don’t want to have sex with your wife don’t marry her. You are making a false promise in the first place if you do this. Sex has a two-fold purpose: unity and procreation. Having sex purely to have children is actually sinful, just like having sex purely for pleasure.

Believe it or not people want to have sex with their spouse as an expression of their love, not because they are “hypersexualized”. This kind of thinking is dangerous, as it labels individuals who want love and affection as you said, “hypersexualized”.

I entirely disagree, society needs to understand the reason and purpose for sex. It can be a perfect act if carried out in a loving manner as God wishes it to be.
 
agapewolf said:
You are incorrect. A marriage is valid at the vows. It becomes indissoluable at the consummation.
Click to expand...
A marriage with no intention for procreation (you have to have sex to do that) is not valid. The Catholic Church does not allow this.
 
rkwittem said:
Nonsense. Sex is the cherry on top of the sundae. I don’t buy a banana split at Dairy Queen so I can get the maraschino cherry on top. I get it for everything else- the ice cream, bananas, and the feeling of satisfaction it gives me. If we extend this analogy to marriage, sex is the cherry on top and the actual relationship and kids and other, fundamental components of marriage are the “meat” of the marriage (the ice cream, bananas, etc.). A marriage can exist without sex. But it cannot exist without respect, trust and a host of other elements that are required for a stable, healthy, and holy marriage. Sex is only truly needed for child-rearing.
Click to expand...
Sex has a two-fold purpose unity and procreation. Having sexual intercourse purely for children and not out of love for your spouse is actually sinful.

This is the problem, you think that respect, trust and holiness is at odds with sex, when it is a fundamental part of a sexual relationship that these values are present. Dangerous thiking.
 
LightFromLight said:
A marriage with no intention for procreation (you have to have sex to do that) is not valid. The Catholic Church does not allow this.
Click to expand...
The church DOES allow for josephite marriages.

But the original statement you made was absolutely incorrect. You said the marriage was not valid until consumnated. That is incorrect.

It is valid at the vows. It becomes indissoluable at consumnation.
 
agapewolf said:
The church DOES allow for josephite marriages.

But the original statement you made was absolutely incorrect. You said the marriage was not valid until consumnated. That is incorrect.

It is valid at the vows. It becomes indissoluable at consumnation.
Click to expand...
So you deem a marriage that is dissoluable as valid? Sounds like a contradiction.

Absolutely not under Catholic teaching are celibate marriages allowed. It is a complete contradiction of terms. Abstaining from sex can be a good thing, but only temporary.

“Have you not heard that he who made man from the beginning made
them male and female? For this cause shall a man leave father and
mother, and shall cleave to his wife, and they two shall be in
one flesh.”

God has spoken.
 
LightFromLight said:
Sex has a two-fold purpose unity and procreation. Having sexual intercourse purely for children and not out of love for your spouse is actually sinful.

This is the problem, you think that respect, trust and holiness is at odds with sex, when it is a fundamental part of a sexual relationship that these values are present. Dangerous thiking.
Click to expand...
I didn’t say they were at odds with intercourse- I said those virtues are much more important in a marriage than sex.

Having children is an act of love. The sex is does not make it more or less loving. The very fact that you are willing to have kids with your spouse shows enough unity and sacrifice.
 
LightFromLight said:
So you deem a marriage that is dissoluable as valid? Sounds like a contradiction.

Absolutely not under Catholic teaching are celibate marriages allowed. It is a complete contradiction of terms. Abstaining from sex can be a good thing, but only temporary.

“Have you not heard that he who made man from the beginning made
them male and female? For this cause shall a man leave father and
mother, and shall cleave to his wife, and they two shall be in
one flesh.”

God has spoken.
Click to expand...
catholic.nowealthbutlife.com/valid-consummated/
 
PHSshamrock said:
catholic.nowealthbutlife.com/valid-consummated/
Click to expand...
Celibacy and Marriage are contradictions. To marry in the first place one must be open to procreate.

“A valid marriage between the baptized is called ratum tantum if it has not been consummated; it is called ratum et consummatum if the spouses have performed between themselves in a human fashion a conjugal act which is suitable in itself for the procreation of offspring, to which marriage is ordered by its nature and by which the spouses become one flesh.”

This does not clear up whether the couple must be open to procreate or not.
 
LightFromLight said:
Celibacy and Marriage are contradictions. To marry in the first place one must be open to procreate.

“A valid marriage between the baptized is called ratum tantum if it has not been consummated; it is called ratum et consummatum if the spouses have performed between themselves in a human fashion a conjugal act which is suitable in itself for the procreation of offspring, to which marriage is ordered by its nature and by which the spouses become one flesh.”

This does not clear up whether the couple must be open to procreate or not.
Click to expand...
The quote above proves my point. A marriage is valid at the vows. It becomes indissoluable at the consumnation. They are 2 different things and not in conflict with each other.

2 non-baptized people can have a valid marriage. It can be dissolved with a pauline or petrine privilege. 2 baptized people can have a valid marriage at the vows, but might be able to be dissolved if not consummated. If it is consummated then it is indissoluble.

You’re spouting off things from your own logic that does not match the church’s teachings.

I PROMISE YOU there is such a thing as a josephite marriage.

At the vows, there are promised to be open to children. That is what is necessary for a valid marriage (and ability to consummate). It is perfectly valid AT THE VOWS.
 
LightFromLight said:
If you don’t want to have sex with your wife don’t marry her. You are making a false promise in the first place if you do this. Sex has a two-fold purpose: unity and procreation. Having sex purely to have children is actually sinful, just like having sex purely for pleasure.

Believe it or not people want to have sex with their spouse as an expression of their love, not because they are “hypersexualized”. This kind of thinking is dangerous, as it labels individuals who want love and affection as you said, “hypersexualized”.

I entirely disagree, society needs to understand the reason and purpose for sex. It can be a perfect act if carried out in a loving manner as God wishes it to be.
Click to expand...
👍👍
 
I just joined this forum not too long ago. This group is a great idea! I’ll gladly join. I’m Mat by the way. I’m 19 and obviously single. :D. And also gladly willing to discuss anything and everything!
 
agapewolf said:
At the vows, there are promised to be open to children. That is what is necessary for a valid marriage (and ability to consummate). It is perfectly valid AT THE VOWS.
Click to expand...
Basicly thats what I wanted to say. You have to admit though, saying a marriage is valid but dissolvable seems contradictory (not saying it is, just on the surface). Especially when consummate means to complete or to perfect something. I supposed you could say its valid but not complete?

So what if I use my own logic? Logic is a necessity for the faith. Its not like I’m a Pope speaking during infallibility anyway.
 
LightFromLight said:
Basicly thats what I wanted to say. You have to admit though, saying a marriage is valid but dissolvable seems contradictory (not saying it is, just on the surface). Especially when consummate means to complete or to perfect something. I supposed you could say its valid but not complete?

.
Click to expand...
But thats not what you said…you said, quite firmly:
LightFromLight said:
A marriage with no intention for procreation (you have to have sex to do that) is not valid. The Catholic Church does not allow this.
Click to expand...
LightFromLight said:
So you deem a marriage that is dissoluable as valid? Sounds like a contradiction.

**Absolutely not under Catholic teaching **are celibate marriages allowed. It is a complete contradiction of terms. Abstaining from sex can be a good thing, but only temporary.

“Have you not heard that he who made man from the beginning made
them male and female? For this cause shall a man leave father and
mother, and shall cleave to his wife, and they two shall be in
one flesh.”

God has spoken.
Click to expand...
 
agapewolf said:
But thats not what you said…QUOTE]

Yes, a couple cannot marry if they are not open to children, a catholic priest will not marry a couple who are not open to new life. You just said that. I have said that, you have said that. What is the issue?

I don’t understand what exactly you are pursuing me on.
Click to expand...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top