100% of Florida Sheriffs Refuse to Enforce federal Gun Bans

  • Thread starter Thread starter Geist
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Not to mention the black mark (which already exists) would increase exponentially.
What is “the black mark?”
Do they have a history of such reckless uninformed positions?

Yes.

I.E. Homosexual priests. Pedophile rehabilitation. Embracing Liberation Theology. Backing the disaster that is universal health care. And on and on.
It is generally accepted here that if you want to change topics, you start your own thread. I really think a shotgun ad hominem attack against the bishops in the United States if very appropriate. Each one you mention could receive an response in the right venue to point out the errors.
 
What will the unified sheriffs of Florida do if the feds withhold grant money? I know one of those sheriffs personally. He was just elected in a rural county. Federal grant money means a lot. 😉
I don’t think federal grant money is being withheld, or if it has even been threatened. Local law enforcement have no obligation to enforce a federal gun ban any more than they have an obligation to enforce immigration law. In any case, there really is no legal obligation to arrest unless a judge so orders an arrest for a specific individual, and even that is limited.

I think they are pretty safe in Florida with this stand, legally at least.
 
Or, what if I agree to sell my Ruger MkII pistol to my next door neighbor for $200? He gives me cash, I give him the gun. It is a private transaction. And if you can “regulate” this sort of thing, what stops the federal government from regulating the private sale of brownies, or furniture, or sports equipment, or anything for that matter? Do we really want the federal government scrutinizing every single aspect of our lives? I don’t.
Oh someone may have finally hit on the real reasons for these private transactions becoming regulated…taxation.

How long before a special tax is imposed on firearm sales between private parties?

And people think the government cares about their safety.:rolleyes:
 
Because those who want to put more guns in more places don’t seem to take into account of placing guns in the presence of children. That’s placing them more in harm’s way than protecting.
This is not necessarily true. If children are trained as to the dangers, they are less dangerous to themselves and each other then adults. My son (the cop) has had guns in the house all his children’s lives and they are more respectful of their dangers then most adults. It’s all in the training. If you owned a boat, would you keep your kids away or would you make sure they knew how to swim?
 
Any gun that is used in the commission of a crime is an “assault weapon”. A baseball bat that is used in the commission of a crime is an “assault weapon”. “Assault weapon” is code word for politicians that means “a scary thing that we, the state, need to get control of to create a political issue”.
I agree with you. You’re preaching to the choir here.

I simply posted the exact wording of the title of the article.

You’re point is well taken though.

Thank you. 🙂
 
2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility.

Seems there maybe a disagreement on interpretation. 🤷

Those rights were given by a secular government, or ‘Caesar’. Give to Caesar, give to God…
And herein is our VERY different interpretation:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men
Self defense (or LIFE, per the Catechism) is NOT a “right” given by Caesar. It’s a right given by God. Caesar’s only role is to “secure” that right.

I can’t stress this point enough.
 
Oh someone may have finally hit on the real reasons for these private transactions becoming regulated…taxation.

How long before a special tax is imposed on firearm sales between private parties?

And people think the government cares about their safety.:rolleyes:
I think the taxation is simply a means to an end. It is the easiest and most insidious legal conduit for the State and ultimately the Federal Gov to police firearm transactions. Look no further than the precedent set by ObamaCare.
 
And herein is our VERY different interpretation:

Self defense (or LIFE, per the Catechism) is NOT a “right” given by Caesar. It’s a right given by God. Caesar’s only role is to “secure” that right.

I can’t stress this point enough.
People keep forgetting the the Constitution was established to secure the principles established in the Declaration of Independence. I hear way too many people say “The DoI is not binding as law”. Yes, that is true. The Declaration is a statement that declares “These are our natural rights and no government has the authority to infringe upon them”. If government infringes on our right to life (self-defense, even against the government), then we as people have a natural right to dissolve said government and establish a new one that is more disposed to respect its role in society.
 
Here it is again:

How Criminals Get Guns:

pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl…ocon/guns.html
The elephant in the room. Universal background checks, and “registration” (on the path to confiscation, IMHO) DON’T stop Black Market sales or straw buyers.

The never have, they never will, or can.

Short of the CONFISCATION that PS1 supports, Conneticut had EVERY SINGLE law on the books the day the shooting happened.

We should curtail the rights of others, to no effect…why??

“Well, we can’t just do nothing!”

By that logic, we should allow conceal carry for teachers. “You can’t say it won’t work if we don’t try it!”.
 
People keep forgetting the the Constitution was established to secure the principles established in the Declaration of Independence. I hear way too many people say “The DoI is not binding as law”. Yes, that is true. The Declaration is a statement that declares “These are our natural rights and no government has the authority to infringe upon them”. If government infringes on our right to life (self-defense, even against the government), then we as people have a natural right to dissolve said government and establish a new one that is more disposed to respect its role in society.
You know your history, Scott! 👍

In the larger picture, the DoI and Constitution were based on the political philosphy in Locke’s Two Treatises of Government, that most Americans were familiar with at the time.
 
But what the good Bishop, perhaps because of his experience and viewpoint as an American, may not have contemplated is the history of the world and the question:

What happens when the legitimate authority not only fails in its grave duty to defend those it is responsible for, but becomes the threat? This really does happen. The holocaust was real, the Soviet disarming and starvation of millions really did occur, the killing fields of Cambodia really did happen, etc. etc. I don’t believe those people were different than myself or those around me.

Who takes on that grave duty then? How can anyone step in if they have been stripped of the means?

And more importantly, would those tragedies have occurred if the general population had remained well armed?
The sheriffs are sworn, legitimate, protectors. Even though I don’t know the exact verbiage of their oaths, I know it’s to uphold and enforce the laws. They can’t legislate by what they will and won’t do.

Yes, those things you list did happen, but the only reason is seems that is brought up in this country is when an election takes place. We supposedly have the safeguards in place to prevent one person from setting themselves as a dictator. We began and have continued to operate under ‘majority rule.’ We have those who keep the government at bay, in this evil country, and then argue against immigration. The point being, people want to be here.

The grave duty in those evil instances fall under the just war teaching, of course some were humanitarian issues and no resources at stake.

As good as we have it here, we should thank God everyday, and not take this blessing for granted. We should be willing to share this goodness with all that come here, and those already here. We should be people of life and not those who fall into the cheapening of life as Cardinal Dolan ? Even though we may walk through the valley in the shadow of death, we shall fear no evil; why? Because He is with us, not because of anything we can do for ourselves.

There are people on this thread that fight any and all controls, often times minimizing the deaths of innocents while doing it, in my opinion. Let’s slow down the discussion and answer one question at a time. I’d like an honest answer to the following question, please.

How can background checks/registrations, for all sales, impede one’s ‘right’ to self defense?

I’m going to address your question, referencing the armed population. Even with ‘assault weapons,’ the government is far over matched with weaponry. We are not self sufficient enough to live without the grocery stores, drug stores, clothing stores, utilities, gas, etc., and the transports of all that. The majority of people are not going to put their families through an active war within these borders, not over the pettiness of partisanship. I remember the force used against the young people of the 60s, and they didn’t use any weapons, yet the government reared it’s head and put the people in place. Don’t think that our government wouldn’t unleash it’s power against those who would rise up against it; it would. While the action might be offensive, at the same time it would find support, and could change views at the same time; however, to use arms against this country could very well be the end of the right to bear arms, and at what cost to lives? There is always that collateral damage. Are we ready to put our families in that kind of danger? I think if it came down to it, people would seek peaceful solutions. A war among ourselves would weaken this country to a point of being an easy target for an outside aggressor .
 
The elephant in the room. Universal background checks, and “registration” (on the path to confiscation, IMHO) DON’T stop Black Market sales or straw buyers.

And then there is the law of unintended consequences. Say you successfully confiscate the legally owned guns in the US, eliminate ability for law abiding to sell or thieves to steal from the law abiding. You have now created, just like drugs, a huge market for smuggling of foreign weapons.

So, instead of our government abetting the flow of illegal semi-automatic weapons into Mexico, and approving legitimate foreign military sales of full auto weapons to South American nations. We’ll have the reverse. The same drug cartels smuggling drugs will now find a very lucrative market for smuggling weapons into the US. And those won’t be the semi-automatic variety. They’ll be the full auto variants stolen/bought from government forces or purchased on the international black market in Europe and the mid-east. The UK has seen that even in an island nation the criminals will get weapons. Given our government’s reluctance, incompetence and the racial politics being played in securing the border, the US will be even less effective.
 
The elephant in the room. Universal background checks, and “registration” (on the path to confiscation, IMHO) DON’T stop Black Market sales or straw buyers.

The never have, they never will, or can.

Short of the CONFISCATION that PS1 supports, Conneticut had EVERY SINGLE law on the books the day the shooting happened.

We should curtail the rights of others, to no effect…why??

“Well, we can’t just do nothing!”

By that logic, we should allow conceal carry for teachers. “You can’t say it won’t work if we don’t try it!”.
The fact that anyone supports CONFISCATION tells me all I need to know about their irrational diehard support to vilify “assault” weapons in the face of overwhelming data that proves such weapons are less than 2% of all gun crimes. Why go after such an irrelevant politically manufacture “problem” - simple: The political “optics” are perfect. And it provides an avenue for broader more insidious legislation to follow.

We’re beyond legislative “baby-steps” with this Admin. This is the era of Marxist ‘shock and awe’ with legislative leap-frog maneuvers via the daily manufactured crisis that must, MUST be acted upon now! It’s for the children don’t ya know! You don’t hate children do you?

This is all very Alinsky:
  • RULE 3: “Whenever possible, go outside the expertise of the enemy.” Look for ways to increase insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty. (This happens all the time. Watch how many organizations under attack are blind-sided by seemingly irrelevant arguments that they are then forced to address.)
  • RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.” If the rule is that every letter gets a reply, send 30,000 letters. You can kill them with this because no one can possibly obey all of their own rules. (This is a serious rule. The besieged entity’s very credibility and reputation is at stake, because if activists catch it lying or not living up to its
  • RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions. (Pretty crude, rude and mean, huh? They want to create anger and fear.)
  • RULE 6: “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.” They’ll keep doing it without urging and come back to do more. They’re doing their thing, and will even suggest better ones. (Radical activists, in this sense, are no different that any other human being. We all avoid “un-fun” activities, and but we revel at and enjoy the ones that work and bring results.)
  • RULE 8: “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.” Keep trying new things to keep the opposition off balance. As the opposition masters one approach, hit them from the flank with something new. (Attack, attack, attack from all sides, never giving the reeling organization a chance to rest, regroup, recover and re-strategize.)
  • RULE 9: “The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself.” Imagination and ego can dream up many more consequences than any activist. (Perception is reality. Large organizations always prepare a worst-case scenario, something that may be furthest from the activists’ minds. The upshot is that the organization will expend enormous time and energy, creating in its own collective mind the direst of conclusions. The possibilities can easily poison the mind and result in demoralization.)
And on and on…

bestofbeck.com/wp/activism/saul-alinskys-12-rules-for-radicals
 
The fact that anyone supports CONFISCATION tells me all I need to know about their irrational diehard support to vilify “assault” weapons in the face of overwhelming data that proves such weapons are less than 2% of all gun crimes. Why go after such an irrelevant politically manufacture “problem” - simple: The political “optics” are perfect. And it provides an avenue for broader more insidious legislation to follow.

We’re beyond legislative “baby-steps” with this Admin. This is the era of Marxist ‘shock and awe’ with legislative leap-frog maneuvers via the daily manufactured crisis that must, MUST be acted upon now! It’s for the children don’t ya know! You don’t hate children do you?

This is all very Alinsky:
  • RULE 3: “Whenever possible, go outside the expertise of the enemy.” Look for ways to increase insecurity, anxiety and uncertainty. (This happens all the time. Watch how many organizations under attack are blind-sided by seemingly irrelevant arguments that they are then forced to address.)
  • RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.” If the rule is that every letter gets a reply, send 30,000 letters. You can kill them with this because no one can possibly obey all of their own rules. (This is a serious rule. The besieged entity’s very credibility and reputation is at stake, because if activists catch it lying or not living up to its
  • RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating. It also works as a key pressure point to force the enemy into concessions. (Pretty crude, rude and mean, huh? They want to create anger and fear.)
  • RULE 6: “A good tactic is one your people enjoy.” They’ll keep doing it without urging and come back to do more. They’re doing their thing, and will even suggest better ones. (Radical activists, in this sense, are no different that any other human being. We all avoid “un-fun” activities, and but we revel at and enjoy the ones that work and bring results.)
  • RULE 8: “Keep the pressure on. Never let up.” Keep trying new things to keep the opposition off balance. As the opposition masters one approach, hit them from the flank with something new. (Attack, attack, attack from all sides, never giving the reeling organization a chance to rest, regroup, recover and re-strategize.)
  • RULE 9: “The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself.” Imagination and ego can dream up many more consequences than any activist. (Perception is reality. Large organizations always prepare a worst-case scenario, something that may be furthest from the activists’ minds. The upshot is that the organization will expend enormous time and energy, creating in its own collective mind the direst of conclusions. The possibilities can easily poison the mind and result in demoralization.)
And on and on…

bestofbeck.com/wp/activism/saul-alinskys-12-rules-for-radicals
Did this previous post of mine violate the rules of this forum?

I’m asking in all sincerity.

Is this considered “Agenda Posting”?

I would appreciate some feedback.

Thank you.
 
Did this previous post of mine violate the rules of this forum?

I’m asking in all sincerity.

Is this considered “Agenda Posting”?

I would appreciate some feedback.

Thank you.
No. that post was awesome.
 
I don’t think federal grant money is being withheld, or if it has even been threatened. Local law enforcement have no obligation to enforce a federal gun ban any more than they have an obligation to enforce immigration law. In any case, there really is no legal obligation to arrest unless a judge so orders an arrest for a specific individual, and even that is limited.

I think they are pretty safe in Florida with this stand, legally at least.
I don’t think any has been withheld, or threatened. I shared the thought knowing how politics can work. I also know the impact such actions, or threats, would have on rural counties where budgets are so tight. I would imagine grants to be as important to the metropolitan areas.

Then I think of the implications of local law enforcement ‘refusing to enforce federal gun laws.’ The federal government could very well stop new weapons being introduced into the market. The refusing seems to be at the point of ‘confiscating’ should a ban include such an action. Then what would be the sheriff’s response to legislation that would put them in control of background checks and registrations, with the potential of an additional income going to their departments? Would they refuse that enforcement if it were legislated at a federal level? Let’s also remember, their refusal is at a ‘federal level’. There’s no changes to state level legislations, current or future.
 
Oh someone may have finally hit on the real reasons for these private transactions becoming regulated…taxation.

How long before a special tax is imposed on firearm sales between private parties?

And people think the government cares about their safety.:rolleyes:
Surely we wouldn’t put taxes above attempts to save lives, and I really think taxes is a reach of the real reasons of regulating private parities. In Florida, and I imagine the rest of the country, one cannot ship a gun legally without going through licensed gun dealers. Background checks and registrations of private sales would more than likely go through the licensed system, or possibly a state government system.
 
I don’t think any has been withheld, or threatened. I shared the thought knowing how politics can work. I also know the impact such actions, or threats, would have on rural counties where budgets are so tight. I would imagine grants to be as important to the metropolitan areas.

Then I think of the implications of local law enforcement ‘refusing to enforce federal gun laws.’ The federal government could very well stop new weapons being introduced into the market. The refusing seems to be at the point of ‘confiscating’ should a ban include such an action. Then what would be the sheriff’s response to legislation that would put them in control of background checks and registrations, with the potential of an additional income going to their departments? Would they refuse that enforcement if it were legislated at a federal level? Let’s also remember, their refusal is at a ‘federal level’. There’s no changes to state level legislations, current or future.
States are implementing Firearms Freedom Acts all over the country. Basically, they are saying that any gun that is made and sold in the same state are not subject to federal regulation.

Similar laws have been passed in Montana, Alaska, Arizona, Idaho, South Dakota, Utah, Tennessee, and Wyoming. Attempts to do so have also been made in Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, New Hampshire, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, Texas, Virginia, West Virginia and Washington.

These are basically nullification laws.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top