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LastStand
Guest
Depends, are they linked to Italian supremacists?
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Inisfallen
Guest
No more than the San Diego La Raza Lawyers’ Association. Which is to say, not at all.
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Metis1
Guest
“To cooperate with evil is evil”.-- Gandhi.
If you don’t actually know that Trump has made racist statements and taken some racist actions in the past then I’ll just leave you to be in your own bubble that’s largely devoid of reality. Here, maybe these will help you to get out of it:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...to-know/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0d5e8096a195
Trump's Full List of 'Racist' Comments About Immigrants, Muslims and Others
www.theguardian.com
Etc.
If you don’t actually know that Trump has made racist statements and taken some racist actions in the past then I’ll just leave you to be in your own bubble that’s largely devoid of reality. Here, maybe these will help you to get out of it:
Here are 10 times President Trump's comments have been called racist
Many of President Trump's comments have been aimed at those who have opposed him, such as Omarosa, while other remarks were a reaction to the news.
www.usatoday.com
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...to-know/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0d5e8096a195
Trump's Full List of 'Racist' Comments About Immigrants, Muslims and Others
Let's drop the euphemisms: Donald Trump is a racist president | Richard Wolffe
Trump is a walking contradiction – but his nativism is consistent. On his UK tour, he has threatened the safety of migrants worldwide
www.theguardian.com
Etc.
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Theo520
Guest
a bit of humor on the subject
12/23/2018, 4:52 pm
The House Committee on Intelligence released a shocking report on Thursday largely undermining claims made by the Trump administration about the origins of Christmas. According to Rep. Luis Gutierrez (D-IL), who serves on the Intelligence Committee, the original reason for this season was the granting of political asylum to Jesus by the progressive Egyptian government, and a subsequent extension of refugee status to his family in what later became known as “chain migration.”
The committee, which is still in the process of conducting a full bipartisan review, said in its initial report that the intelligence community’s assessment, or ICA, was a “sound intelligence product” whose conclusions were “reached in a professional and transparent manner, and the tradecraft was strong.”
Gutierrez exposes the shocking origins of Christmas
12/23/2018, 4:52 pm
The House Committee on Intelligence released a shocking report on Thursday largely undermining claims made by the Trump administration about the origins of Christmas. According to Rep. Luis Gutierrez (D-IL), who serves on the Intelligence Committee, the original reason for this season was the granting of political asylum to Jesus by the progressive Egyptian government, and a subsequent extension of refugee status to his family in what later became known as “chain migration.”
The committee, which is still in the process of conducting a full bipartisan review, said in its initial report that the intelligence community’s assessment, or ICA, was a “sound intelligence product” whose conclusions were “reached in a professional and transparent manner, and the tradecraft was strong.”
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LastStand
Guest
Of course the lawyers have no links to Italian supremacists, La Raza is composed of Hispanic supremacists.
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Inisfallen
Guest
First, define your terms. Who do you mean by “La Raza?”
Second, if that’s your position (assuming you tell us who you’re talking about), how about presenting us with some evidence of your claim, rather than just asserting it (repeatedly)?
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LastStand
Guest
Ah yes, the good old technique of spamming numerous links. Going through each of those and taking them apart would require several essays. Suffice it to note that I do not take opinions about racism seriously from the NYT given their endorsement of racism against white Americans. By the standards of their employee Sara Jeong, Donald Trump is merely counter-trolling his critics who happen to be racial minorities.
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Inisfallen
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Four or five links hardly amounts to “spamming.”
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13pollitos
Guest
La Raza is a legitimate term many Hispanics/Latinos use to call ourselves. It’s especially prevalent with Mexicans and those of Mexican dissent. My husband uses it and paisano (countryman) all the time when speaking to or about another Mexican. It’s like white people calling each other white or people in the US calling each other American. Many of us from other parts of the Americas find that offensive because they see it as we are all Americans. I don’t because I grew up in the US and my husband has been here long enough it doesn’t bother him either. Many from other countries in the Americas do not understand that though. They call people in the US norteamericanos (North Americans) instead. Since they take offense does that make it wrong to use that term (American) when referring to people in the US? Absolutely not.
I think it is easy to get in a cycle of pitting groups against each other. It is much easier to feel threatened by someone than to accept differences. When we do learn to accept the differences we begin to see how similar we all really are.
I think it is easy to get in a cycle of pitting groups against each other. It is much easier to feel threatened by someone than to accept differences. When we do learn to accept the differences we begin to see how similar we all really are.
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MonteRCMS
Guest
You need to add the realities of drug smuggling and human trafficking.
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Metis1
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Whereas I put forth numerous links to verify what I posted, you put forth nothing but your own opinion. And it certainly comes as no surprise that you don’t take racism seriously based on what else you’ve posted.
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LastStand
Guest
I already pointed out the racial supremacist origins of the term. You on the other hand cited a source that just very publicly endorsed racist behavior.
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Inisfallen
Guest
Exactly. And I think that’s been clearly demonstrated at some length above.
It looks like some want to make a case for guilt by association based on nothing more than a couple of words in common in the names of organizations.
The organization to which Judge Curiel belongs (or belonged) is your garden-variety local lawyers’ association, just like, for example, the example I gave above, the Irish-American Bar Association of New York. Nobody seems to have a problem with the IABANY, or to beleive that it’s a “supremacist” group or that members of that organization have some kind of divided loyalties.
Afterthought: The issue of this organization has come up in the past here at CAF. I noticed that some criticize it as merely a reflexive defense of anything President (or candidate) Trump says, and some have deeper issues with organizations with the words “la raza” in their names. But all of the critics were very quick to conflate this lawyers’ association with other, unrelated organizations with that phrase in their names.
It looks like some want to make a case for guilt by association based on nothing more than a couple of words in common in the names of organizations.
The organization to which Judge Curiel belongs (or belonged) is your garden-variety local lawyers’ association, just like, for example, the example I gave above, the Irish-American Bar Association of New York. Nobody seems to have a problem with the IABANY, or to beleive that it’s a “supremacist” group or that members of that organization have some kind of divided loyalties.
Afterthought: The issue of this organization has come up in the past here at CAF. I noticed that some criticize it as merely a reflexive defense of anything President (or candidate) Trump says, and some have deeper issues with organizations with the words “la raza” in their names. But all of the critics were very quick to conflate this lawyers’ association with other, unrelated organizations with that phrase in their names.
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Ridgerunner
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Deleted as redundant.
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Inisfallen
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Very much true.
In this case it’s quite similar to denouncing an Irish-American bar association as IRA sympathizers or supporters simply because it has the word “Irish” in the name.
In this case it’s quite similar to denouncing an Irish-American bar association as IRA sympathizers or supporters simply because it has the word “Irish” in the name.
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Ridgerunner
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Possibly an entirely white organization that called itself “The Race” would be thought of in this way. But I can’t even begin to imagine that. How about the National Association for the Advancement of White People? That would be thought “racist” by most without their knowing a thing about it.
It’s certainly possible Trump harbors racist thoughts. I think everybody does. Some just won’t admit it. Unfortunately, not admitting it prevents doing anything about it. It’s like denying that adulterous thoughts are sinful. Deny the reality, and you’ll not reform. We do not know Trump’s thoughts about people of other races.
But simply violating the rules of political correctness some have does not make one a racist.
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Inisfallen
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I would argue that, and say that some of his words and actions are indicative of certain attitudes. And if they’re not, they indicate a willingness to pander to voters who do have certain attitudes.
But (conceding your point for the sake of argument), there is no evidence whatsoever that the organization of which Judge Curiel (who is, it bears repeating, an American, not a Mexican) belongs or belonged is a racist organization. None whatsoever. A similarity of names with an organization which may be racist (a point which I do not concede) is not evidence of racist intent or thought.
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Ridgerunner
Guest
At least Trump didn’t ridicule Mexican heritage.
But you sure made yourself clear on how you regard southerners.
But you sure made yourself clear on how you regard southerners.
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Ridgerunner
Guest
It might be interesting to look at the membership and the scholarship recipients. If I was a member of an organization of white people who avowedly raised scholarships for white people and gave them only to white people (yes, with one or two token Hispanics) you would not hesitate to consider it at least a mildly racist organization. And if I called it “Aryan Fund” or something, you would absolutely, unequivocally declare it racist.
“The Race” does not have the same meaning among whites as it does among Mexicans. To whites it is equivalent to “a race”. Among Mexicans it is much more specific to Mexicans, particularly non-Mayan Mexicans.
“The Race” does not have the same meaning among whites as it does among Mexicans. To whites it is equivalent to “a race”. Among Mexicans it is much more specific to Mexicans, particularly non-Mayan Mexicans.
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Inisfallen
Guest
No, I wouldn’t. Not necessarily. There are plenty of quite legitimate ethnically-based organizations in this country that probaby give scholarships in some form or other, and I don’t consider that inherently racist. That said, yes, an organization that gave scholarships only to “white” people would almost certainly be racist. I suppose it’s possible that some theoretical organization could exist for the benefit of white people without being racist, but in practice, it’s fairly obvious that organizations that purport to exist for the benefit of “white people” are always racist. But that’s different from, say, an Irish-American bar association handing out some scholarship aid to promising Irish-American kids, and I wouldn’t call that racist.
Well, yes. Words have history, and that’s part of their meaning. If you’re trying to draw some parallel between organizations with the word “Aryan” in their name, and organizations with the phrase “la raza” in their name (and I don’t know that you are), well, no, that won’t fly.
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