Amazon Synod and Pagan Rituals

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Don’t be troubled, pray for our Pope and trust him. I think in USA there is a part of the Church that can’t stand him and is using everything to discredit him and label him as heretical. He has a good knowledge of material and spiritual poverty in the world and he is trying to bring the love ofJesus and the promise ofSalvation to the rejected of the world. The ritual was not a Catholic ceremony and should not be presented as such. The context is important, the context here was totally distorted to fit the narrative of an unworthy Pope and to create scandal and division in the Church. Remember, Satan loves division, a divided house (or Church) cannot stand.
 
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And this is precisely what I mean when I don’t find defense of Pope Francis convincing. It’s always the same routine:
  1. Just trust him
  2. He’s smarter than you/playing 4d chess
  3. “Out of context”
  4. Why are you sowing division?
 
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Really? 🤷‍♀️🤔
The Amazon Synod is not going to be the downfall of the Catholic Church.
And based on what you have stated you are worried about, you are listening to the wrong media outlets.

Get your information from the Vatican News Service if you want truth without spin.
 
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Roland_Deschain said:
I know “The Gates of Hell will not prevail” and all that, but with every theologian worth his salt
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No they aren’t. A relatively few have spoken out. Unless you define a theologian worth his salt as “one who agrees with me” this simply isn’t true. The parable has a warning that should disturb those who wish to embrace that which Jesus condemned, both progressives and traditionalists. Do not embrace the role of the Pharisee, which is the older brother.

The Church has not ordained female deacons, so the hatchet never came out.
If you read St. John Paul’s Ordinatio sacerdotalis you will see it does not include the diaconate. The version of the Church that is seen by some, including a very small number of clergy, might be in danger, but there is no danger of any real contradiction from this synod. The solution is not to leave, but to understand better the limit of one’s own understanding of what constitutes doctrine, and what is legitimately changeable.

By the way, I see no need to defend the Holy Father. He has not done anything outside his purview of one who holds the keys of Peter. Even if he has made mistakes, most of which are debatable, they were still reasonable.
 
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pnewton said:
The solution is not to leave, but to understand better the limit of one’s own understanding of what constitutes doctrine, and what is legitimately changeable.
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Again, I don’t find this 2smart4u argument convincing. In fact, I think it’s insulting, as if I can’t read or understand.
 
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We are the Church too. All those faithful raising their voices in alarm are also the Church. The gates of Hell may prevail against some, but not all unless we also lose the faith.

As St. Vincent de Lerins said Catholic Christians should do the following in times like this:
What, if some novel contagion seek to infect not merely an insignificant portion of the Church, but the whole? Then it will be his care to cleave to antiquity, which at this day cannot possibly be seduced by any fraud of novelty.
http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3506.htm
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The prophet Jeremiah says the same to those will be faithful, noting those who will not:
Jeremiah 6:15 Were they ashamed when they committed abomination?
No, they were not at all ashamed;
they did not know how to blush.
Therefore they shall fall among those who fall;
at the time that I punish them, they shall be overthrown,”
says the Lord.

16 Thus says the Lord:
“Stand by the roads, and look,
and ask for the ancient paths,
where the good way is; and walk in it,
and find rest for your souls.
But they said, ‘We will not walk in it.’
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I know. Nothing is convincing. That is why John used the phrase, “Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches.” I feel like I have stumbled onto a Jack Chick website.
 
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Roland_Deschain said:
taking a hatchet to Holy Orders by “ordaining” deaconesses.
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When did that happen? How did I miss that? News article link, please! :roll_eyes:
 
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The worst kind of heretic is the one who convincingly portrays himself as a faithful Catholic.
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Actually many of the photos are coming from Catholic media outlets that aren’t known for their “divisiveness”.

This can’t be explained or dismissed or redirected to focus on “the humanitarian” aspect. We’re talking about pagan worship, false idols, worthless deities, propaganda which shows how everything is connected and the lines are blurred between human, animal and deity.

What dialogue are we supposed to gain from this???

How is showing a picture of a mother holding an infant while nursing an animal going to spread awareness about deforestation in the Amazon?!?!!!
 
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Crusader13 said:
Actually many of the photos are coming from Catholic media outlets that aren’t known for their “divisiveness”.
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True, yesterday I was listening to priest on EWTN, and at the beginning of his show he was stating his concerns and fears about this Amazon synod and the “slippery slope” that could come from it. There is a tendancy to want to make all those who are concerned and alarmed out to be just a bunch of extremists and that just isn’t true.
 
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godisgood77 said:
The Synod in no way is even considering endorse moral and/or spiritual corruption… Fear not! The Synod is a good…it is meant to be a dialogue about the right way to evangelize in a remote and extremely important part of the world.
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It´s not.
godisgood77 said:
If you don’t mind me asking, what about the synod troubles you?
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I´m also troubled by the synod. Especially in regards to echo-theology, it´s pan-theistic approach, openness to the female diaconate, and even more. I´d never leave the Church, but if heresy are implemented and our Faith are changed - I´d see no other option than going to the SSPX. However, I´d never leave Christ for anything. NEVER! We might be in pain as a result of the synod, but I´d never ever leave Christ.
 
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Yes, the evil one wants division and Crux as well as NCR aren’t helping at all. They are promoting division as well as America SJ mag.
 
What about Voris?!? what about Lifesitenews or Breibart? They are attacking viciously the current Pope.
 
Yes, you forgot Remnant too. I see what you mean, so where do you think the middle road might be. Let’s say both of those sides are extreme and causing division but where do you think truth is? You meaning anyone.
 
Really? Nothing to see here? C’mon. I’ve been as much Team Francis as anyone could be — but what on earth is going on in the Vatican right now? We’re not converting more through non-Catholic rituals that involve what appear to be fertility symbols. He’s our legit pope without question, the gates of hell will never prevail, and I’m not fearful. But all of this seems misguided at best.
 
You are not the only one. People are tired of the excuses. I don’t buy them anymore. With that pagan ritual at the Vatican, some people said that the Pope didn’t like it because he didn’t deliver his remarks and just said an Our Father. Well I don’t have much sympathy for him if that’s true. If he wants to get angry at the person who authorized that show, he can look in the mirror. When you appoint people who put language in the synod working document about integrating native rituals into Church liturgy, what do you expect that’s going to look like? Personnel is policy. No one should be surprised that this stuff is happening. The writing has been on the wall for years now.

Unfortunately few bishops are willing to go on the record publicly about this. Only those who know that they’ve reached their limit and have nothing to lose are going to risk putting their necks on the line. You hear often that there’s a lot of discontent in Rome, in the Curia, but little to back it up. Look at the German synod. Blatant heresy is being proposed there, and you know there are plenty of bishops who don’t like it, but almost none are willing to speak out. They care more about preserving the appearance of unity than speaking out with the hard truth. This mentality has been ingrained in them from decades of past of Popes who were willing to defend orthodoxy. Back then the bishops didn’t have to worry about speaking out against the crazy stuff because they knew Rome would handle it. Now that you have a Pope that is content to let clerics like the Germans do whatever they want, the rest of the bishops are running around like chickens with their heads cut off. By the time they gain the courage to speak up, it will be too late.
 
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You are not alone in your concern. There are many people and some are very careful who they express their concerns to regarding this pope. We have had so many popes and have had the great privilege for decades of having very, orthodox, brilliant and holy popes. This too will pass and God will keep us with the Church that Christ gave us. The Church is not it’s artifacts, buildings or property. These are treasures of our faith, but not what we put our faith in. We need to be very, serious people of prayer (rosary - today is the memorial Our lady of the Rosary) and some fasting would also help. You are not alone in your concern and heartache.
 
SERIOUSLY? This isn’t about Voris or Lifesite news!

This is about pagan worship and false idols at the Vatican! This is a serious situation that can’t be explained by claiming the Pope was taken out of context, it was a bad translation, Vatican II says …, correlation does not equal causation, it’s about dialogue; or whatever else is ALWAYS said to defend something that brings confusion and ambiguity to the Church!

This is beyond merely dividing the church into two camps of right vs left.

This same type of pagan worship is often spoken about throughout scripture and guess what, it didn’t turn out well for those involved.
 
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