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Peace-bwu
Guest
This is the perfect advice for you.
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Peace-bwu
Guest
You are right she is literally draining you in order to get through her daily life. She’s like a drug addict, you are her drug. She will do whatever she must do to get that drug. Allowing her to use you is not helping her. She needs professional help.Thank you, and yes, it does sound familiar … esp. the guilt trips. She does the inviting herself to go to Mass with me on Sundays too. Or stopping by unannounced with a “little something” for me … normally some item that I have absolutely no use for … nor want … that ends up in the trash or donation pile as soon as she leaves. The phone messages that are urgent or the pitiful tear filled voice begging me to call her as soon as I can. She drains me.
I appreciate all the replies thus far. I guess my intent in posting was to see if it was sinful to perhaps be a little rude. I don’t want to, but I have gone from hinting to being direct with no results. And that it is okay to end the friendship.
Thanks everyone. Ya’ll are great!
You are the one giving and being taken advantage of. You are trying to be a good Christian, but perhaps God has a lesson in here for you. Pray about it and ask what the Lord wants you to learn from this experience. Enforcing your boundaries may be exactly what she needs to grow and change, no matter how painful it might be for her. My guess is she will eventually find another unsuspecting “friend” to use, or maybe it will be a catalyst for change she needs. It is not sinful to end the friendship, exactly the opposite.
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FOS
Guest
Take an example from today’s gospel. Jesus healed the leper, because he had pity on him, and told him specifically not to tell anyone, but to go directly to the priest at the temple for the proper purification ceremony. But instead the leper went and blabbed to everyone in sight. So then, whereever Jesus went he was besetted by needy people. So, he had to hide out in the desert because people wouldn’t leave him alone.
Which goes to show that even the Lord needed some space and couldn’t answer every need. Even the Lord didn’t like too many demands. So, take it from Jesus, you have a right to your privacy and aren’t obligated to personally fullfill this woman’s endless needs.
Which goes to show that even the Lord needed some space and couldn’t answer every need. Even the Lord didn’t like too many demands. So, take it from Jesus, you have a right to your privacy and aren’t obligated to personally fullfill this woman’s endless needs.
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AlanFromWichita
Guest
This is an interesting take on the situation.
I’ve noticed that when Julie and I were on the “spiritual journey” and making progress, there have been a number of people who seemed to “need” us a lot, then soon they kind of faded away, usually on good terms. I’m wondering if there are two sides to the equation: someone needy is automatically drawn toward a person who has something to offer.
Alan
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Peace-bwu
Guest
That has been my experience too. My husband and I are very close and are each other’s best friend. We have always made the effort to have our own friends and be friends with other couples. I can’t count how many people have hurt us or used us until they didn’t need us anymore. It has been a struggle sometimes for us but last year we came to the conclusion that maybe it is a part of God’s plan for us. Maybe we are meant to be friends to those who need us, but not to necessarily have friends. I don’t know it makes sense. We also learned alot about boundaries from the expereince. Allowing others to be hurtful is not “helping” them. I have learned alot about depending on God for my comfort.
We have had “friends” who stole from us, gossiped about us, betrayed us, and even try to seduce one of us. It usually ends the same way, people whom we think are good friends end up letting us down in a heartless and cruel manner. Some just drift away but others ended in severe betrayal. For awhile we were asking “What is wrong with us?” our answer was that we were letting it happen out of a misaligned sense of charity. I also learned a bit about vanity and being more humble, that we are always in a process of “letting go” of this world, and viewing the world with the eyes of Jesus, setting our sights on the kingdom of heaven, rather than putting too much emphasis on our treasures on Earth, like friends. Friends and family certainly are treasures but I learned to be careful to keep those treasures in perspective with the Greatest Treasure.
I have learned from situations similar to yours that we all have something to learn from our expereinces with others. Even the person who is being taken advantage of, who is in the “right” can learn more about the Nature of God, ourselves and our relationships with others.
I have gone from being burdened and devastated when this happens, feeling sorry for myself or defensive or angry, to being thankful for the experience and open to learning from it.
I tell you this in hopes that it will help you to view this experience, by letting go of the guilt, sadness and exhaustion, to finding a treasure beneath.
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BLB_Oregon
Guest
It is important to note that we are called to serve the needy… including the neurotically needy.
But if we don’t draw appropriate boundaries, let’s face it… we will be the only friends they ever have and they will be the only people we ever serve.
When drawing the line with this woman, it is important to let her know that it is her refusal to respect your boundaries that you take issue with. You can’t both love her and continue to let her act in that way. That wouldn’t be fair to anyone, including all the children involved. (Don’t think that her children’s behavior is ever going to change before their mother’s illness is dealt with–and this woman has an illness, no doubt about it.) Besides, she is totally violating the peace of your home. Protecting that is your duty, too.
That is what I meant by treating her like one of your own children. If you can still manage it at this point, it would be great to let her know that she would be welcome back when she has given your friendship some time to recover (that is, a certain amount of time with* no contact*) and she is willing to respect your boundaries: she will not come over without calling, she will not come over when you have told her it is a bad time, she will leave when asked, and so on.
In today’s gospel, Jesus didn’t leave the leper a leper. He healed him. That is always the goal.
Jesus was pretty fierce with the Pharisees, too… not because God didn’t love them, but because they behaved in ways that were incompatible with a loving relationship with God and others. He couldn’t both love them and tolerate that. So it is clear that being hard on people isn’t necessarily a bad thing. Sometimes, there is no getting around it. Sometime, it is your duty.
Hang in there. God be with you, dear one. Please do find a professional to give you advice on this, by the way. Your local county health department or suicide hot line may have someone you can talk to, someone with more professional and specific advice.
K
KCT
Guest
Does she have a cell phone? If so, do you know the number? The next time she’s at your door, call her cell phone and tell her you’re too busy for company. Don’t even open the door. Call out the window to her if you have to, but don’t open the door
As for her calling you ump-teen times a day, turn off your ringer (or silence your cell). You can check periodically for legitimate messages.
I’m glad she’s getting help (your post mentioned her therapy), but keep in mind that as long as you let her get away w/ this behavior, you’re not helping her. As hard as it is, be firm. That will help her.
—KCT
As for her calling you ump-teen times a day, turn off your ringer (or silence your cell). You can check periodically for legitimate messages.
I’m glad she’s getting help (your post mentioned her therapy), but keep in mind that as long as you let her get away w/ this behavior, you’re not helping her. As hard as it is, be firm. That will help her.
—KCT
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StephanieC
Guest
Ana,
She may be the world’s best manipulator, but you are allowing her to sharpen her skills on you!
Ready for a sisterly pep-talk? Okay, here goes:
Get protective, woman! Stop thinking of the stunts she is pulling as being about the two of you. She is forcing her way into your family’s home and taking your attention away from your primary vocation.
If, as you say, you have said and done all of the things that have been suggested to you, perhaps you need to practice being a Mama Grizzly Bear with someone–ask another friend, or even your husband to role-play with you. Have them come to the door, and try to weasel their way in. Your job is to say “no,” mean it, and enforce it. Let them tell you what they think of your attempts to say “no” convincingly.
And, last but not least: think of the lesson your children are learning by your actions (or inaction.)
She may be the world’s best manipulator, but you are allowing her to sharpen her skills on you!
Ready for a sisterly pep-talk?
Okay, here goes:Get protective, woman! Stop thinking of the stunts she is pulling as being about the two of you. She is forcing her way into your family’s home and taking your attention away from your primary vocation.
If, as you say, you have said and done all of the things that have been suggested to you, perhaps you need to practice being a Mama Grizzly Bear with someone–ask another friend, or even your husband to role-play with you. Have them come to the door, and try to weasel their way in. Your job is to say “no,” mean it, and enforce it. Let them tell you what they think of your attempts to say “no” convincingly.
And, last but not least: think of the lesson your children are learning by your actions (or inaction.)
F
FOS
Guest
The thing is, I don’t think this is a true friendship, as I define it. It’s too unbalanced.
There’s a nursery rhyme that speaks to this. One teapot was made of clay, another of brass. They were friends, but unequal ones because they were made of two different materials. The brass teapot accidentally hit the clay one and the clay teapot cracked.
The moral is that friendships work best when on an equal basis.
There’s a nursery rhyme that speaks to this. One teapot was made of clay, another of brass. They were friends, but unequal ones because they were made of two different materials. The brass teapot accidentally hit the clay one and the clay teapot cracked.
The moral is that friendships work best when on an equal basis.
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FOS
Guest
The Two Pots, an Aesops Fable
A RIVER carried down in its stream two Pots, one made of
earthenware and the other of brass. The Earthen Pot said to the
Brass Pot, “Pray keep at a distance and do not come near me, for
if you touch me ever so slightly, I shall be broken in pieces,
and besides, I by no means wish to come near you.”
Moral of the Story— Equals make the best friends.
A RIVER carried down in its stream two Pots, one made of
earthenware and the other of brass. The Earthen Pot said to the
Brass Pot, “Pray keep at a distance and do not come near me, for
if you touch me ever so slightly, I shall be broken in pieces,
and besides, I by no means wish to come near you.”
Moral of the Story— Equals make the best friends.
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Rob_s_Wife
Guest
**ACK! Good grief! Can you move?!
**
I must say I don’t think this woman is even a “nice” person. “Nice” people do not destroy your home and walk all over you like this.
I wouldn’t hide out in my own home either, but I would buy that door chain and NOT undo it when she comes knocking. Keep it short and sweet, “I do not want or need company right now.” and SHUT that door.
I don’t know about anyone else, but if she continued to bang and yell at my door (as some have said has happened to them) - I’d call the police. I wouldn’t say another word to her, I’d just call the police. That just sounds creepy/scary to me and I know my dc would be more than a bit freaked out by it!
**I must say I don’t think this woman is even a “nice” person. “Nice” people do not destroy your home and walk all over you like this.
I wouldn’t hide out in my own home either, but I would buy that door chain and NOT undo it when she comes knocking. Keep it short and sweet, “I do not want or need company right now.” and SHUT that door.
I don’t know about anyone else, but if she continued to bang and yell at my door (as some have said has happened to them) - I’d call the police. I wouldn’t say another word to her, I’d just call the police. That just sounds creepy/scary to me and I know my dc would be more than a bit freaked out by it!
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Giannawannabe
Guest
It is not sinful to be “rude” to this woman. She is destroying your family life, being inconsiderate of your time, and being manipulative. She’s taken extreme advantage of your good nature. I certainly wouldn’t call your relationship with her a “friendship”. I agree with the posters who said to not let her in when she stops by unannounced. Every time she does, tell her you are busy homeschooling and can not visit. Sometimes just don’t answer the door, sometimes answer with an excuse. Do not answer the phone to her–especially during homeschooling hours. If your children were at school, their lessons would not be interrupted like that. This technique may take some time, but she will eventually “need” to have someone else to take advantage of. She won’t be able to stand it, and will move on. Believe me. It works.I appreciate all the replies thus far. I guess my intent in posting was to see if it was sinful to perhaps be a little rude. I don’t want to, but I have gone from hinting to being direct with no results. And that it is okay to end the friendship.
Thanks everyone. Ya’ll are great!
I
Island_Oak
Guest
This woman is clearly disturbed and cannot be counted upon to react rationally to reasonable requests.
Enlist the help of your husband immediately. Have him contact this woman’s husband and kindly, but firmly explain that her visits have become frequent, very disruptive to your home and schedule and insist that she refrain from visiting your home unannounced. Her spouse is, no doubt, well aware of her issues. Beyond that, it may be difficult to prevent her from calling, but you never have to answer a phone–esp. if you use caller ID to determine who is on the line.
Enlist the help of your husband immediately. Have him contact this woman’s husband and kindly, but firmly explain that her visits have become frequent, very disruptive to your home and schedule and insist that she refrain from visiting your home unannounced. Her spouse is, no doubt, well aware of her issues. Beyond that, it may be difficult to prevent her from calling, but you never have to answer a phone–esp. if you use caller ID to determine who is on the line.
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8isgr8
Guest
I had a friend somewhat like this-- especially the badly behaved children. In addition to the destruction and mistreatment of our things, her daughter was a monster to my son. I finally realized that, in all my efforts to stop her daughter tormenting him-- without hurting her feelings– I was putting her feelings above my son’s well-being. I finally understood that SHE clearly did not care much about his or my feelings, & my first duty was to protect my son.
My husband & I made the decision the girl would under no circumstances be allowed in our home again, NO MATTER WHAT WE HAD TO DO. Honestly, MAKING THE DECISION to quit worrying about her feelings was the hard part. Once we were firm in our obligations, following through would have been the easy part. As it was, our daughter, not understanding tact, passed our decision on to the friend. When the friend called me on it and pressured me and pressured me, my decision was made, and I found it easy to politely but firmly tell her no and why as often as she needed to hear it.
I will say, in our case, it got quite ugly. I worked at a school with my friend’s husband. I taught a class her daughter was in. The daughter acted up in class, lied about it to her parents, I ended up in the principal’s office being accused of things I hadn’t done by the girl and a friend of hers, forced by the principal (who was scared of the dad) to allow the girl to skip music every day, etc., etc. But you know… despite all their ugliness, all I could think was-- I wish I’d stood up for myself 4-1/2 years ago. It was so good to be free of it.
My husband & I made the decision the girl would under no circumstances be allowed in our home again, NO MATTER WHAT WE HAD TO DO. Honestly, MAKING THE DECISION to quit worrying about her feelings was the hard part. Once we were firm in our obligations, following through would have been the easy part. As it was, our daughter, not understanding tact, passed our decision on to the friend.
When the friend called me on it and pressured me and pressured me, my decision was made, and I found it easy to politely but firmly tell her no and why as often as she needed to hear it.I will say, in our case, it got quite ugly. I worked at a school with my friend’s husband. I taught a class her daughter was in. The daughter acted up in class, lied about it to her parents, I ended up in the principal’s office being accused of things I hadn’t done by the girl and a friend of hers, forced by the principal (who was scared of the dad) to allow the girl to skip music every day, etc., etc. But you know… despite all their ugliness, all I could think was-- I wish I’d stood up for myself 4-1/2 years ago. It was so good to be free of it.
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Ana
Guest
I would like to say thank you again, to all who took the time to read my post, and share their thoughts and experiences. Although I have participated in the moral theology forum debating particular issues, this is the first time I have posted asking for “help.” I am overwhelmed by the amount of people who care enough to advise me, and I see how much I have been missing by not reaching out sooner.
I am so grateful to everyone and each and every post has had something to offer, so although I posted this general “thank you,” I still intend to respond to each post individually.
I have come to the decision to end the relationship, which I wanted to do anyway, but I wasn’t sure if it was the right thing to do. Now, I am. You all have given me the validation and motivation to follow through in spite of the initial discomfort that might come from “hurting her feelings.” I think this may be one of the few times that I have ever seen a thread where everyones response was UNANIMOUS!!
Not only that, but my husband agrees with all that has been said too, what more can I ask for in the way of confirmation?
Thanks again everyone, this "reaching out’ has been so successful, don’t be too surprised if I do it again soon. If before I thought of you all as aquaintances, I now think of all of you as friends. This is even better than the solution to my problem. Thanks again all!!
I am so grateful to everyone and each and every post has had something to offer, so although I posted this general “thank you,” I still intend to respond to each post individually.
I have come to the decision to end the relationship, which I wanted to do anyway, but I wasn’t sure if it was the right thing to do. Now, I am. You all have given me the validation and motivation to follow through in spite of the initial discomfort that might come from “hurting her feelings.” I think this may be one of the few times that I have ever seen a thread where everyones response was UNANIMOUS!!
Not only that, but my husband agrees with all that has been said too, what more can I ask for in the way of confirmation?Thanks again everyone, this "reaching out’ has been so successful, don’t be too surprised if I do it again soon. If before I thought of you all as aquaintances, I now think of all of you as friends. This is even better than the solution to my problem. Thanks again all!!
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Ana
Guest
You are absolutely right, in fact when I do speak with her and “end” this, I will find out the number and give it to her…
Thank you for giving me permission to “not be perfect”, sometimes I need to remember that.
A
Ana
Guest
JMJ Theresa:
Yes, and he has expressed that he is willing to do so. So far, so good.
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Ana
Guest
This sentence REALLY penetrated.
She is mentally ill. She has been diagnosed bipolar, but it seems like on my end. evidence of an attatchment disorder as well. And your right the answer is no. I am not the one to help her (except through prayer at this point.)
This is it in a nutshell.
Ohmigosh … she does think she is “helping” me. She comes over all the time with food that I don’t need, clothes and junk that gives her a reason to drop by. Sometimes she will just stop by with a gallon of milk in her hand that I did not ask for, so i just thank her and add it to the other three gallons in my fridge cause I just went shopping yesterday!
I am soooooo looking forward to it.
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Ana
Guest
Thanks to all of the validation I have received, I plan on doing that if she continues to come over after I have spoken to her.
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Forest-Pine
Guest
So glad you are seeing that it isn’t rude to be firm about your family’s boundaries. It might make you feel guilty, but it isn’t wrong or rude of you.
When she knocks on the door, open it enough to be clearly visible, but not enough for her to breeze by you, say that you sure wish that she had called before dropping by unannounced as you simply can’t have company over now (do NOT provide an explanation for why), and say that you look forward to seeing her some other time. Don’t engage in conversation. Say you are busy and have to go. Say sorry and shut that door.
If you give an excuse (the baby is sleeping, you have to do housework, it is your family time, your quiet time, etc) she will argue the point with you. You do not have to have a reason why. You do not need to justify it to her. You simply are busy now and cannot entertain her. Then shut the door! You’ll feel bad for doing it, but it is what you have to do. And it isn’t rude!
When she knocks on the door, open it enough to be clearly visible, but not enough for her to breeze by you, say that you sure wish that she had called before dropping by unannounced as you simply can’t have company over now (do NOT provide an explanation for why), and say that you look forward to seeing her some other time. Don’t engage in conversation. Say you are busy and have to go. Say sorry and shut that door.
If you give an excuse (the baby is sleeping, you have to do housework, it is your family time, your quiet time, etc) she will argue the point with you. You do not have to have a reason why. You do not need to justify it to her. You simply are busy now and cannot entertain her. Then shut the door! You’ll feel bad for doing it, but it is what you have to do. And it isn’t rude!
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