Any Catholic Martial Artists?

  • Thread starter Thread starter BryanW
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I have studied traditional Okinawan karate (Ryuei Ryu) for many years, and have specifically contemplated the issue of compatibility of the martial arts with Christianity.

I believe there is no inherent conflict at a general level, but particular martial philosophies or attitudes might be in conflict with the Church.

At a bais clevel, the key is to recognize and understand the just war doctrine. Defense of self or others, within the stated conditions, can justify the use of force - even lethal force under the right circumstances. It follows that if force can be justified, then study of how to apply force is also justified.

In my experience, traditional martial arts are defensively oriented and seek to build character, avoid unnecessary confrontation, and use the minimum force to accomplish a necessary goal. In this sense, the traditional martial arts - at least as I have practiced them - are enitrely in accord with Church teaching.

The other danger you can run into is martial philosophies, such as the notion of Chi in some Chinese forms of Kung Fu. Subscribing to these philosophies can be strictly forbidden, and is incompatible with Christianity. Be careful before you agree to believe in something. Other philosophies, such as a code requring you “to seek to attain perfection of character” would be fine.
 
I learned my martial arts from a very American ex-GI who learned his in Korea.

He spent ZERO time talking about chi or spirit or life force. So if I spent any time calming myself, that’s all I did - slow the heart rate, control the breathing, loosen the body… but no religious component to it. Ethics? Yes. We were being taught a dangerous skill set and we were expected to treat it with the same respect as a loaded gun - but we didn’t need to appeal to a Cosmic Muffin or anything.

There were guys in my dojo who had no faith, others who had strong protestant faiths, and me with my Catholic faith. No problems, no conflicts, no worries.
 
I think you misunderstand - chi has nothing to do with another diety or anything else. It is just simply another form of channeling energy. I am putting this very simply - now I am simply tlaking about the form of meditation that I have learned through studying taijutsu and aspects of ninjutsu. Some may have had other teachers that have taught differently this is just my experience. There are many Japanese Catholics that have been able to meld both practices and are fine. It is very centering as a matter of fact it is just another form of looking at self through channeling. I still pray the rosary, I still go to mass, I still take the sacraments, I still love God and Christ.
 
joandarc2008 said:
I think you misunderstand - chi has nothing to do with another diety or anything else. It is just simply another form of channeling energy. I am putting this very simply - now I am simply tlaking about the form of meditation that I have learned through studying taijutsu and aspects of ninjutsu. Some may have had other teachers that have taught differently this is just my experience. There are many Japanese Catholics that have been able to meld both practices and are fine. It is very centering as a matter of fact it is just another form of looking at self through channeling. I still pray the rosary, I still go to mass, I still take the sacraments, I still love God and Christ.
Click to expand...
Pardon me. You mentioned “channeling”. Channeling what?:confused:
 
Centering prayer might be dangerous. It’s focus can be on the self, and not on God, which is why the Church discourages centering prayer.

Same with Chi. It might be “natural energy”, but it’s safer just to stick with what is known scientifically and avoid any spiritual ideas that are not from the Church.
 
I don’t even know what ‘centering prayer’ is. Someone take pity on me and please 'splain?
 
a. I would not exactly call meditation using kuji-in “centering prayer” but it is close.

b. If centering prayer is so dangerous why does my parish offer it every Friday at 630 pm before the weekend?

c. Personally, self reflection is a necessity however you do it- it is actually required prior to the sacrament of reconciliation.

d. I am not saying to use this as the only method of meditation but when done well and with correct intention it can be a valuable addition. However, when one has a bias against it from the start than obviiously it will not be.
 
tedfay said:
Centering prayer might be dangerous. It’s focus can be on the self, and not on God, which is why the Church discourages centering prayer.
Same with Chi. It might be “natural energy”, but it’s safer just to stick with what is known scientifically and avoid any spiritual ideas that are not from the Church.
Click to expand...
Actually that is not true, centering prayer is a way of meditating, praying in a ‘‘silent’’ way. St Theresa of Avila practiced this type of prayer method, but probably didn’t dub it ‘centering’ prayer. It is a way to be very silent, in meditation with God, that’s really the gist. The parish that we belonged to back in PA, had centering prayer ‘‘meetings’’ …I never attended, but it’s not centering on one’s self. It’s centering on God, but in a silent, calming way. It’s just different, but not anti-Catholic, from what I have heard and read. You pick a word to center on…such as Jesus, Savior, etc. It CAN be practiced by non Catholics, but the whole concept of centering prayer is not wrong, if the center of the prayer is of course God. You don’t pray anything in particular…you are centered on God. It’s nothing like Reiki, or anything like this…it’s not new age. Just wanted to add my two cents.
 
Notice that I said can be, not is. You have to understand the context and individual intent. I am not accusing anyone of anything.

Also, just because a parish offers it does not mean that it is orthodox or acceptable. I have been to parishes that allow blatant and flagrant practices that are in direct violation of canon law and defy the magesterium. I won’t get into those examples, as they are not relevant, but it shows that just because something is offered by a parish doesn’t mean it must be good.
 
joandarc2008 said:
a. I would not exactly call meditation using kuji-in “centering prayer” but it is close.

b. If centering prayer is so dangerous why does my parish offer it every Friday at 630 pm before the weekend?

c. Personally, self reflection is a necessity however you do it- it is actually required prior to the sacrament of reconciliation.

d. I am not saying to use this as the only method of meditation but when done well and with correct intention it can be a valuable addition. However, when one has a bias against it from the start than obviiously it will not be.
Click to expand...
*Exactly…it’s not dangerous. I think there is some misinformation here. I thought it was odd too, when I first heard about it being offered at my parish back in PA. But, I researched it, and the origins would surprise many. It could lead to someone centering on self, but the design of it is to center on God, and just be silent in that mediation. *
 
Thanks, whatever girl that was a pretty good synopsis. Basically the other forms of meditation works the same way - it is clearing your mind completely by focusing on nothing and allowing the energy (God) to guide you. The energy is just what we name it. We as Catholics obviously believe it is God. Others have different names.
 
joandarc2008 said:
Thanks, whatever girl that was a pretty good synopsis. Basically the other forms of meditation works the same way - it is clearing your mind completely by focusing on nothing and allowing the energy (God) to guide you. The energy is just what we name it. We as Catholics obviously believe it is God. Others have different names.
Click to expand...
*I think the potential risks that others speak of, however, IS very real. I watched a show, I think it was on fit tv last year, where they were featuring a specific kind of yoga. After the class, each student walked up to the instructor, knelt down, and kissed his feet. WHAT??? I guess you didn’t have to, but it looked like every student was doing this. I couldn’t believe it. I have taken yoga, love it, but would never subscribe to lifting up my instructor like a diety. THAT is dangerous. When we allow what others are doing around us, to pressure us to doing the same. Whem we look at exercise as more than that…as some mystical cosmic experience. It can be alluring, I have known a few people who were Catholics, and left to follow zen, or buddhism. It can happen, if we let our guard down. The devil is always waiting for us to let him in. *
 
I’m saying you need to be careful. Emptying yourself is not good - you have to be focused on God, not on emptiness and not on yourself; otherwise those energies you feel might or might not be good - even if they feel good.

Here’s what the apologists on this site say about centering prayer, it’s the same thing I’m saying. Be careful, and it depends on what you are doing and why.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=60764

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=86216

catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9711fea1.asp

The last article is a very long article by a priest that appeared in This Rock magazine. I highly recommend you read it.

Again, I’m not accusing anyone of anything. I’m just saying that you must be informed on the issues and act accordingly.
 
tedfay said:
I’m saying you need to be careful. Emptying yourself is not good - you have to be focused on God, not on emptiness and not on yourself; otherwise those energies you feel might or might not be good - even if they feel good.

Here’s what the apologists on this site say about centering prayer, it’s the same thing I’m saying. Be careful, and it depends on what you are doing and why.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=60764

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=86216

catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9711fea1.asp

The last article is a very long article by a priest that appeared in This Rock magazine. I highly recommend you read it.

Again, I’m not accusing anyone of anything. I’m just saying that you must be informed on the issues and act accordingly.
Click to expand...
*I don’t disagree with you. I think there are risks, if perceived incorrectly. Emptying one’s self…means emptying one’s self of worldly concerns…but focusing on what God wants for you, etc. I don’t think it means creating an emptiness. I don’t follow “centering prayer,” I just know some about it, from my parish back in PA offering it. I haven’t seen it offered here in Florida, at these Catholic parishes. I think contemplative prayer is our version of meditating on God, other than saying the Rosary, etc. *
 
*I read the article in The Rock, Ted…what??? I didn’t know that much about it, but didn’t think it’s dangerous. I appreciate these links…according to the priest who wrote the article, it appears that there is a centering on self, to an extent. And eastern mysticism brought into the whole thing. That isn’t how it has been interpreted to me…and I wonder now why any Catholic parish would permit these prayer meetings to go on? :confused: It seems according to the article, that it’s anti-Catholic. I have no interest in it personally, but apparently I didn’t know the half of it! 😊 Again, thanks for the links.

Sorry, to the OP–didn’t mean to go off topic. *
 
I did Taekwondo when I was younger, before I was Catholic. It was a wonderful experience.

I am currently considering getting back into martial arts. What I really want to learn is Tai Chi, because its something that not only can you use for self defense if necessary, but you can do it for your entire life and it promotes good health.

I personally think martial arts are for the most part a very good thing. I say for the most part because it seems in recent times there has been a big rise of “mixed martial arts”. I personally am against MMA because the entire point of it seems to be hurting other people.

If you are interested in martial arts, I strongly encourage you to stick with the traditional martial arts, especially defensive forms. This could be Aikido, Hapkido, Tai Chi, etc. I recommend these becuase not only are they good for your body, but they are also good for you spiritually and instill you with discipline and confidence.
 
whatevergirl said:
*I don’t disagree with you. I think there are risks, if perceived incorrectly. Emptying one’s self…means emptying one’s self of worldly concerns…but focusing on what God wants for you, etc. I don’t think it means creating an emptiness. I don’t follow “centering prayer,” I just know some about it, from my parish back in PA offering it. I haven’t seen it offered here in Florida, at these Catholic parishes. I think contemplative prayer is our version of meditating on God, other than saying the Rosary, etc. *
Click to expand...
A lot of it simply depends on the teacher and what they teach. As many different systems of martial arts as there are there are just as many if not more systems of meditation - one has to be careful not to overgeneralize when saying that it is or is not sinful/anti-Catholic. I have had a positive experience and it has been healthy. Others have had a negative. It depends on the teacher and the system.
 
joandarc2008 said:
A lot of it simply depends on the teacher and what they teach. As many different systems of martial arts as there are there are just as many if not more systems of meditation - one has to be careful not to overgeneralize when saying that it is or is not sinful/anti-Catholic. I have had a positive experience and it has been healthy. Others have had a negative. It depends on the teacher and the system.
Click to expand...
*I might drop you a pm about this, if you don’t mind. *
 
Ok, I liked the articles - I am very much a believer in the fact that one must be careful in what they are doing and why they are doing it. So as it says:
These and similar proposals to harmonize Christian meditation with eastern techniques need to have their contents and methods ever subjected to a thorough-going examination so as to avoid the danger of falling into syncretism.
Click to expand...
However if one is using the meditation to focus on God and therefore commune with God than:
Within the Church, in the legitimate search for new methods of meditation it must always be borne in mind that the essential element of authentic Christian prayer is the meeting of two freedoms, the infinite freedom of God with the finite freedom of man.
Click to expand...
This is a very deeply personal path. No one should ever be forced to do it nor should anyone be forced not to research it without researching it fully. I am very well read on this subject. I have also talked to various priests on this same subject. But that is my personal situation. I disagree with teachers who force this on people. If people are not comfortable they shouldn’t be forced to do it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top