BAHA'I thread III - feel free to ask of Baha'i any questions

  • Thread starter Thread starter Servant19
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Servant19 said:
There is plenty of anecdotal evidence for the miracles of the Bab and Baha’u’llah by Bahai and maybe some non-Bahai writers (I’m really not sure, it’s not important to me to find out)
Click to expand...
Except that it turns out that one of your biggies–the survival of the Bab after being shot at by 750 muskets–is actually not true.
 
Servant19 said:
There is plenty of anecdotal evidence for the miracles of the Bab and Baha’u’llah by Bahai and maybe some non-Bahai writers (I’m really not sure, it’s not important to me to find out) EGG-ZACTLY the same as there is only anecdotal evidence by only Christian writers for Jesus’ miracles. No difference there…

The miracles of Jesus are attested to by NT writers…and the stigmatics in the Catholic Church throughout her 2000 yr history.

So can you point out a stigmatic in the Bahai?
I would ask you then, based on your own parameters for the factual verification of any miracles, what evidence is there for Jesus’ divinity?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
IgnatianPhilo said:
How have you not learned from the scripture that humanity cannot save itself but by the grace of God? What did the old law teach us? That we cannot be saved by following strictly the law, that we of our own selves are fallen sinners who need God’s grace to overcome anything in our lives. God is the saviour not humanity. What do you expect will stop abortion, murder and disease in the future? Mankind by science?

The bahai goal relies on the pure fantasy of saying “men will save themselves.” No God will save us and this world.
Click to expand...
Gods grace is found in the Bahai Faith.

Google “Most Great Peace Bahai reference” and you will get the official teaching in when evil will be overcome. It’s already happening in several communities around the world, and its not a utopia…
 
SteveVH said:
Yes, I’ve noticed that. Considering some of the answers it doesn’t appear that our posts are given the least consideration as to their actual content.
Click to expand...
I notice that still the Catholics believe that Baha’is teach that Jesus was a mere man.

I notice that still the Catholics believe that Baha’is teach that Jesus was not the Second Person in the Trinity.

I notice that still the Catholics want to know what is new about the Bahai Faith in terms of what it brings to the world. I wrote a bullet pointed post 15 or so pages ago, not one response

Do the Catholics read “any” of the Bahai posts?
 
eddie_too said:
the most important thing for christians to take from this thread is that bahai is a non-christian religion that denies that Jesus is true God and true man, the Second Person of the Most Holy Trinitity. also, the bahai do not believe in the Most Holy Trinity.
Click to expand...
Dear friend Eddie,

This is totally incorrect, Baha’is ABSOLUTELY accept that Jesus was the Second Person in the Trinity. Can we please move on from this point because we have spent 2000 posts trying to explain why we do agree on this
eddie_too said:
from these two facts, it becomes obvious that a christian receives just as much of value from a bahai as they would receive from a mormon, or a muslim, or a hindu, or david koresh or jim jones or any of the other many men and women who have claimed to be the final word on mankind’s relationship with its Creator.

that is to say that none of these self-proclaimed prophets, teachers or manifestations have anything of value. they have nothing truthful to add to the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Click to expand...
This is exactly the sorts of things that the Jews said about Jesus 🙂
 
eddie_too said:
daler,

your 410 pm post is simply an example of an erroneous interpretation of the christian sacred scriptures. your interpretations’ errors occur because you have not received from Jesus or the Holy Spirit the authority to interpret sacred scripture.

these erroneous interpretations, that you and other bahai who have posted to this particular thread, are designed to separate christians from the Holy Spirit and the saving efforts of Jesus Christ.

this is not to say you are NOT sincere and believe these misinterpretations, but it is to say that a christian is wasting his or her time if they spend any amount of time studying your erroneous intepretations.
Click to expand...
Again, the Pharisees and the Saducees said the same thing.

How exactly was Jesus the King of the Jews again? And why did He not fulfill the Messianic prophecies exactly the way the JEWS were taught through their Traditions???
 
SteveVH said:
Yes, and they will get much worse before the end and Christ’s true return.
Click to expand...
…and the Jews are STILL waiting for the Messiah. I think their scripture talks about the year 6000. Is that when the true Messiah will come?
 
PRmerger said:
Except that it turns out that one of your biggies–the survival of the Bab after being shot at by 750 muskets–is actually not true.
Click to expand...
No biggie at all PR, we have had 3000 posts on the Bahai Faith, this is the first time I’ve discussed the martyrdom of the Bab.
 
Servant19 said:
I notice that still the Catholics believe that Baha’is teach that Jesus was a mere man.

I notice that still the Catholics believe that Baha’is teach that Jesus was not the Second Person in the Trinity.

I notice that still the Catholics want to know what is new about the Bahai Faith in terms of what it brings to the world. I wrote a bullet pointed post 15 or so pages ago, not one response

Do the Catholics read “any” of the Bahai posts?
Click to expand...
What we notice is that you, like the LDS, re-define words to mean what you want them to mean.

That’s why it is so befuddling to Catholic readers, trying to decipher exactly what it is you mean in your theology.
 
Servant19 said:
No biggie at all PR, we have had 3000 posts on the Bahai Faith, this is the first time I’ve discussed the martyrdom of the Bab.
Click to expand...
So it’s not a biggie. Okay. Maybe not for you (although you have indeed referenced it here on the CAFs).

But it’s a biggie for daler. He mentions this miraculous event (that is apparently not a miracle) quite frequently. 🤷
 
Servant19 said:
The question is, why would you therefore deny the Divinity of Baha’u’llah when so many people attested to it during His lifetime and beyond, and that includes incredibly devout Christians and Muslims, who all knew exactly what literal occurrences must take place for Jesus Second Coming yet still attested to His station and submitted their whole lives to His hands?
Click to expand...
Well, a few reasons that I’ve found from this thread:

-because he had 4 wives. Simultaneously. That is a profound breach of the marital covenant given to us by God.

-because he didn’t do anything miraculous. It can all be explained away by science.
(Or by the fact that someone misunderstood and exaggerated some events.)
 
Servant19 said:
Gods grace is found in the Bahai Faith.

Google “Most Great Peace Bahai reference” and you will get the official teaching in when evil will be overcome. It’s already happening in several communities around the world, and its not a utopia…
Click to expand...
Evil is being overcome where? In the west sexual licentiousness is growing at an ever increasing rate. In africa poverty and illiteracy are ever present. The islamic world is killing itself and its enemies. Where is evil being overcome exactly? I see the same old problem which only God with one magnificent sweep of his hand can fix and no other force. You may place your faith in humanity, but humanity has shown itself incapable time and time again.
 
Servant19 said:
Again, another quote straight from the Pharisees
Click to expand...
There is nothing wrong with quoting from the Pharisees, if what they said is true. Where they got it right, we give them a 👍. Where they got it wrong we say:



You are aware that the LDS denounce abortion, right?

They got that part right. So we say to the LDS, :clapping::yup:

That’s what’s so fundamentally awesome about Catholicism. We have been give the Truth, once and for all, and we recognize it wherever it is professed.
 
PRmerger said:
Egg-zactly.

So there is no evidence, whatsoever, that your holy prophets did anything miraculous.

And therefore no evidence, whatosever, that your holy prophets are divine.

The very scientific explanations will only serve to show this: your holy prophets are men who write some very nice things.

I happened to read some things by Thomas Merton the other day. His writings are interesting spiritually.

I might put your holy prophets on the same page as Thomas Merton. Interesting spiritual teachings, but where they diverge from the Word of God is where we say, “Nope, not so much.”

And Thomas Merton, while being an astute spiritual thinker, like your holy prophets, is definitely NOT part of the Godhead.
Click to expand...
Servant19 said:
All of which can therefore be attributed to Jesus.

Unless of course, you look beyond the miracles 👍
Click to expand...
Sorry. I am not understanding your point.

Are you saying that everything that Merton and your prophets said can be attributed to Jesus? :confused:
 
Servant19 said:
With the request for evidence that you are now requesting from the Baha’is, I am assuming that you are now equally in need of similar evidence for Jesus’ miracles (unless of course you are directing this line of argument for uncharitable purposes), which would beg the question if any aspect of Jesus’ life story is actually factual, but rather a conveyance of Truths.
Click to expand...
Just so you know, you are using the phrase “beg the question” incorrectly.

What you mean, I presume, is to say, “prompts the question”.

Begging the question is actually a philosophical term which is a fallacy in which one assumes the point that one is arguing.

See here for more info:

philosophy.avemaria.edu/post/29691374480/begging-the-question-vs-raising-the-question
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top