Biden picks Kamala Harris as running mate

[Ridgerunner]

“It might reduce them. It might not”. Wow. You are claiming there is no proportional reason to support a pro-choice candidate and have just admitted that making abortion illegal might not reduce the number of abortions and you never claimed otherwise. I guess there are lots of proportional reasons now, aren’t there?

This really is mocking the Church.

If you’re okay with a society that countenances killing children, that’s your moral choice. It is not mine. Can you prove there would be no reduction in abortions? If you cannot, then your position is like that of a man with a rifle considering whether to shoot without aiming into a crowded stadium.

 

[upant]

They are default settings to shut down the discussion and lead to the obvious conclusion not supported by the Bishops.

That Catholics cannot vote for democrats in good conscience.

not shut down discussion but trying to have a discussion on how one can vote democrat when these policies are against Catholic teaching

but some want to limit it to just these two when you also have these

the entire LGBT agenda, euthanasia, embryonic stem cell research, transgenderism, identity politics, the destruction of the family, contraception, socialism, breaking the seal of the confession, federal funds to pay for abortions, forced abortions in Catholic hospitals, the selection of liberal judges who will uphold these policies, etc

what is a proportionate reason to so many anti-catholic policies? it isn’t just abortion anymore

a person voting democrat is enabling this hedonistic lifestyle, if people do not know it is wrong, they won’t repent and could die in their sins.

There are many moral wrongs held in the political sphere. Some by Democrats and some by Republicans.

there is no comparison between the GOP and democrat moral dilemma.

yes, there are some GOP issues, but most of the problems people have with the GOP are social and they are just different ways to the same goal, they aren’t against church teaching and won’t cause people to lose their salvation.

 

[Ridgerunner]

No the default is bringing up abortion and the Little Sister’s of the Poor on every post in this subform.

For some of us, those things matter. After all, if the U.S. bishops say abortion is the preeminent issue in this election, we ought to pay attention to it and not sweep it under the rug.

 

[jeannetherese]

The discrimination against women, minorities, LGBT, and the disabled has been well documented in our country and continues to this very day.

Indeed, and many who are requesting assisted suicide speak to the pressures they feel in regard to finances and the sense that they are viewed as a burden by family and community.
https://dredf.org/public-policy/assisted-suicide/assisted-suicide-and-disability/

The Case Against Assisted Suicide | MCCL

Suicide is always tragic because every human life, without exception, is valuable—regardless of age, illness, disability, and dependency.

www.mccl.org

We’re told we are a burden. No wonder disabled people fear assisted suicide | Jamie Hale

I can see no safeguards to prevent people being pressured into ending their lives, says disability activist Jamie Hale

www.theguardian.com

 

[jeannetherese]

This is racist on so many levels.

First, you are saying that Indian-Americans are “lower” than Black Americans and calling someone Black is a “race-lift”.

Second, since both are true, there is no reason to bring this up.

I’m a little disappointed.

I read it as political opportunism on the part of the press. One markets what sells, and, currently, one sees much more media coverage of black-ness than of being Asian in the States.
The BBC news online has a whole section dedicated to stories surrounding this in its U.S. and Canada section which has been ongoing pretty much since the riots. Just scroll down to Race in America and check the focus:

US & Canada | Latest News & Updates | BBC News

Get all the latest news, live updates and content about the US & Canada from across the BBC.

www.bbc.com

 

[jeannetherese]

Now, why do you not support a stronger social safety net to reduce the number of abortions?

Perhaps we might develop a strong social net that emphasizes family support and responsibility rather than the government as father figure?
Ceding power to the state may create relationships of dependency and undermine the power of the individual and/ or the family.

 

[Nepperhan]

For some of us, those things matter. After all, if the U.S. bishops say abortion is the preeminent issue in this election, we ought to pay attention to it and not sweep it under the rug.

I don’t think that addressing the issue only when it is relevant is ‘sweeping it under the rug’. It cannot be termed the only issue in American politics and culture nor does it pertain to every issue.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I don’t think that addressing the issue only when it is relevant is ‘sweeping it under the rug’. It cannot be termed the only issue in American politics and culture nor does it pertain to every issue.

As the preeminent issue it demands attention and as such is relevant to every other issue.

 

[Nepperhan]

As the preeminent issue it demands attention and as such is relevant to every other issue.

‘Preeminent’ does not mean blanket or overweening. Your statement is a summation, not an explanation. That issue could not be relevant to every other issue under consideration.

 

[RidgeSprinter]

As the preeminent issue it demands attention and as such is relevant to every other issue.

That is the opinion of the Bishops. The Current Vicar of Christ (Pope Francis ) has written otherwise.

Abortion preeminent issue, global warming not urgent, say bishops | National Catholic Reporter

At the meeting, Cardinal Blase Cupich of Chicago attempted to insert into the letter a paragraph from Pope Francis’ encyclical “Gaudete et Exsultate.”

In the paragraph, the pope criticized the “ideological error” of believing that "the only thing that counts is one particular ethical issue or cause that they themselves defend."

“Our defense of innocent unborn, for example, needs to be clear, firm and passionate,” continued the pope. “Equally sacred, however, are the lives of the poor, those already born, the destitute, the abandoned and the underprivileged, the vulnerable infirm and elderly exposed to covert euthanasia, the victims of human trafficking, new forms of slavery, and every form of rejection.”

The drafting committee, chaired by Gomez, accepted the “equally sacred” language, but it refused to include the entire 183-word paragraph with its criticism of ideological error. The drafters said they were trying to keep the letter short. Cupich responded that the paragraph expressed the magisterial teaching of Pope Francis in a succinct way.

 

[Ridgerunner]

‘Preeminent’ does not mean blanket or overweening. Your statement is a summation, not an explanation. That issue could not be relevant to every other issue under consideration.

No. It means “preeminent”. And when someone brings up some lesser reason to vote for abortionists, the preeminent issue is always relevant.

 

[Nepperhan]

And when someone brings up some lesser reason to vote for abortionists, the preeminent issue is always relevant.

Its relevant to sewer expansion, storm drains and electronic filing of deeds? That’s on the ballot around here.

And now you’ve gone from insulting people as ‘pro-abortion’ to claiming they are ‘abortionists’? That’s not right.

 

[RidgeSprinter]

someone will have to copy my post. rr has me on ignore.

 

[Rubee]

Rubee:

RuthAnne:

A lot of pro-choicers are pro life.

Make it make sense, please

There’s not much to it. Some people believe it should be up to the individual to choose. When faced with the choice, some choose abortion, some choose life.

So. . . they’re not pro-life, just regular pro-choicers who maybe don’t get abortion themselves. In the old slavery days, they would’ve been the guys who didn’t keep slaves but supported its continuation. Then they could claim, in this manner of thinking, they were “pro-liberty.” Of course, they would mean liberty for slave-owners and the slaves they chose to free, not the slaves whose owners elected to keep in bondage. Just like these pro-choicers you’re talking about are pro-life for the mother and the babies they want to keep but not the ones they opt to kill.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Now you demand that I show you that it won’t affect the number of abortions, but the onus is on you to show that it will. Personally, I think that making abortion illegal will have little affect on the number of abortions unless there is a significant social safety net

Again, no proof.

Abortion is murder, as it is the deliberate killing of an innocent human being. Whether doing away with abortion on demand reduces abortions is not the entire point. If rape was legalized, you would not argue that making it illegal must predictably reduce rapes before considering outlawing it. You would consider rape an abomination and want it to be illegal no matter what.

Countenencing murder of children is even worse than countenancing rape. In the latter, at least the victim lives.

 

[Ridgerunner]

That is the opinion of the Bishops. The Current Vicar of Christ (Pope Francis ) has written otherwise.

No. Some just want to make him seem pro-abortion, or tolerant of it, but he isn’t.

• Pope Francis said Saturday that abortion was similar to “hiring a hitman,” and should not be carried out even if the fetus is deformed or very ill, the Associated Press reported.
• He previously compared abortions to Nazi killings during the Holocaust.

 

[StudentMI]

That is the opinion of the Bishops. The Current Vicar of Christ (Pope Francis ) has written otherwise.

We are supposed to obey our bishops as well as the Pope. Responding “well the Pope said this!” isn’t really showing obedience.

 

[RidgeSprinter]

We are supposed to obey our bishops as well as the Pope. Responding “well the Pope said this!” isn’t really showing obedience.

No we are not to obey the Bishops. We are to listen to them yes. Obey the Pope? Within reason of course. Pope tells you to jump off a cliff, you gonna jump? Yeah, I don’t think so.

I’ll side with the Pope in the words in his encyclical.
The opinionated words of Bishops? Meh!!!

What the Pope actually speaks is not as binding as what he puts in proverbial stone on pen and parchment.

 

[StudentMI]

Which is showing disobedience to the bishops in this country. The Pope’s words are universal. The bishops in each country decide how to implement those words.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I’ll side with the Pope and the words in his encyclical.

According to him, you’re supporting the Holocaust, so don’t forget that part.