Billboards proclaiming ‘Jesus is Muslim’ getting people upset

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Ontheway said:
There seem to be two concepts of Muslim at play here. One is the follower of the prophet, is a modern day Muslim, who reads the Koran and prays five times a day, etc.
The other is the one who submits to God. This is the concept that allows the Muslims to claim Jesus as a Muslim. In this context we are all Muslims, slaves or servants of God.
The billboard makers are using the word “muslim” in this second sense.
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And why don’t I believe them? We all know what they really mean.
 
Ontheway said:
Jesus can not be a Muslim, a follower, servant or slave of God, because that is not His mission.
Jesus is of the same essence.
Jesus is the alpha and omega, the beginning and the end.
Jesus is the redeemer of humanity and He brings salvation to the world, including the followers of Mohammad.
He is the redeemer of man through His sacrifice.
He loves you specifically and has brought you here to this forum for a reason.
:amen:

Lent is a special season of prayer. Pray and believe. Jesus loves you.
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The Isa of the Quran is not the Jesus Christians worship. This is fact, not an opinion. 🙂

John 10: 27- 30

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

And I give them life everlasting: and they shall not perish for ever, and no man shall snatch them out of my hand.

That which my Father hath given me, is greater than all: and no one can snatch them out of the hand of my Father.

I and the Father are one.

:highprayer:

MJ
 
IgnatianPhilo said:
See we’re not Muslims though. Crucial to Islam is the belief in the prophets and we reject Muhammad. I really think you are stretching here in order to make a point… I’m not sure as to the meaning of that point however. Lets do it with another word. Muslims are Christians. Why are they Christians because Christian means someone who believes in the Christ Jesus, therefore they are technically Christians.

So what do we accomplish here other than using words in a confusing way which means little in the end? Do you really think the Muslims who made the Billboard in the first place are arguing in your fashion?
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This is on point.
 
Ontheway said:
There seem to be two concepts of Muslim at play here. One is the follower of the prophet, is a modern day Muslim, who reads the Koran and prays five times a day, etc.
The other is the one who submits to God. This is the concept that allows the Muslims to claim Jesus as a Muslim. In this context we are all Muslims, slaves or servants of God.
The billboard makers are using the word “muslim” in this second sense.
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And it is dishonest because non-Muslims don’t use the term muslim in that way. Christians who understand Christianity would never agree. Those who are less knowledgeable and maybe fall for another great lie (Muslims and Christians believe in the same god) might be fooled and led further astray.

You can make up any term for any group of people to make any point you want. It doesn’t make it true. Jesus was not muslim, Christians are not muslims-in-waiting and the billboard is a lie. Though I have no proof, my opinion was that it was a calculated wordplay akin to calling abortion “health care.”
 
MartinJordan said:
The Isa of the Quran is not the Jesus Christians worship. This is fact, not an opinion. 🙂

John 10: 27- 30

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

And I give them life everlasting: and they shall not perish for ever, and no man shall snatch them out of my hand.

That which my Father hath given me, is greater than all: and no one can snatch them out of the hand of my Father.

I and the Father are one.

:highprayer:

MJ
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Good point. Im glad someone said it.
 
TheSufi;11862416]And that is what God teaches us in the Quran, everything submits willingly to God except man. ** So Islam is an invitation to man to submit to God.**
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Islam invites man to submit to God? Ponder that statement for a moment;
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When did God tell Islam or give Islam the divine authority on earth to invite man to submit to God?
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Muhammad never heard directly from God nor did Muhammad ever speak directly to God. God never reveals His true presence to Islam. To think so, wouldn’t that place Islam in direct blasphemy? Does Islam claim the ink and paper in the Quran is the presence of God?
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The billboard “Jesus was a Muslim”, (Jesus) Never teaches anyone to submit to God. Jesus gives us two commandments “Love God” and “Love neighbor”. There is nothing in Jesus teachings that invites anyone to “submit to God”. Therefore, the billboard deceives, Jesus to be a Muslim.
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If Jesus never teaches anyone to submit to God then Jesus is never Muslim.
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Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. A Son does not submit as a slave does to his master. A Son Loves His Father, therefore Jesus cannot be a Muslim as one who submits as a slave to the creator.

The prophet Muhammad died. Jesus lives. Islam follows a dead prophet of Islam. Christianity follows an eternal living King and Lord Jesus, who has already conquered.
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The billboard Jesus that Islam teaches does not exist nor did he ever exist.
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God says, **“Do you not see that God is He, Whom obeys whoever is in the heavens and whoever is in the earth, and the sun and the moon and the stars, and the mountains and the trees, and the animals and many of the people; and many there are against whom chastisement has become necessary; and whomsoever God abases, there is none who can make him honorable; surely God does what He pleases.” **
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(24:41)

Did God really say that directly in the presence of any Muslim? God never speaks in the second or third person when God “says”. Your quote decieves, because the person speaking is never God, the one writing is never God, the quote reveals a human mind relating to the things of God, the author does not speak for God nor is God speaking.
Islam is about God, for God, with God, to God. God is the central theme of Islam.
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I follow you that Islam is about God, for God, to God. When is Islam in the presence “with God”. Is that not blasphemy for a Muslim to claim to be “with God”?
Our purpose is to be in continuous worship of God. Worship how?
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You do well here, but when did the purpose change in Islam to conquer, or to invite man to submit to God according to the tenants of Islam.

Did God command this or did Muhammad order it?
Islam is about God, submission to Him and Him alone.
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It is easy for a slave to submit to his master whom the slave does not know. Islam submits to God, because Islam has never seen God.

Christians submission to God is freewill from the heart, soul, mind and strength in Love, because the Christian is with God and in God, when God is all and in all.

Jesus taught “I am In the Father and the Father is in me”. This teaching is never a submission to God therefore Jesus is never a Muslim.

Does a slave or Muslim who submits to God as his master ever know his master as his Father? The way Jesus teaches that Jesus came from His Father in heaven. Jesus cannot be Muslim, because Jesus never makes the claim that he is a slave of submission to God.

The Son does not work for a wage from His Father, as a Muslim submits to his/her master as a slave of Islam for a wage.

Peace be with you
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Ontheway said:
There seem to be two concepts of Muslim at play here. One is the follower of the prophet, is a modern day Muslim, who reads the Koran and prays five times a day, etc.
The other is the one who submits to God. This is the concept that allows the Muslims to claim Jesus as a Muslim. In this context we are all Muslims, slaves or servants of God.
The billboard makers are using the word “muslim” in this second sense.
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The billboard is a good strategy, because the Muslim knows the billboard grabs anyone’s attention and begs the invitation for all to look into Islam or what a Muslim is. Our liberal laws protects the freedom of speech and boy does the Muslm know it.

Hypothetical; If one were to take the Muslim to court for slandering Christianity and lieing about her founder Jesus. The Muslim would win every time, because the Term Muslim has a forked tongue meaning, and would be laughed out of court, when it is revealed that everyone is a Muslim who obeys and submits to the laws of God.

The Muslim get’s more public exposure to Islam, which is it’s goal. Secondly the Muslim would be hard pressed to prove Jesus was a practicing Musilm of Islam in a court setting. But the billboard never say’s that does it? It only reads “Jesus was a Muslim”. The past tense of the billboard message continues the deception because Jesus is alive even Islam teaches this.

Peace be with you
 
Publisher said:
Ahhh…so “we” define what “muslim” means instead of a Muslim?

Jesus, John the Baptizer, Simon Peter, James the Just were all “muslim”, they “submitted to God”, our Muslim friends are using their words and terminology to make a…IMO…valid statement. They see themselves in the long line of “those who submit” to the will of God…hence…“muslim”.🙂
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Sir, I want you to know that, if I ever become Christian again I’d be a quaker. Because you are truly Christlike.
 
IgnatianPhilo said:
Again you have to miss the point. If Jesus was a Muslim, then I am a Muslim, you are a Muslim and every theist is a Muslim. The Muslims should have a poster saying “everyone is a Muslim, except atheists and agnostics,” if you want to argue in such a fashion. I also do consider your argument extremely silly and extremely flawed in that you insist on the literal meaning of the word thereby making it meaningless to call Jesus a Muslim. When Muslims say Jesus believed in Islam, they mean something else entire, that Jesus was a believer of Islam, who will return one day, kill all the pigs, destroy the crosses and establish the caliphate. That he did not believe himself to be God and he did not die on the cross. This is some of the things they mean when they think of Jesus as one of them.
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By this logic Protestants are Catholics.
 
Zachary said:
And it is dishonest because non-Muslims don’t use the term muslim in that way. Christians who understand Christianity would never agree. Those who are less knowledgeable and maybe fall for another great lie (Muslims and Christians believe in the same god) might be fooled and led further astray.

You can make up any term for any group of people to make any point you want. It doesn’t make it true. Jesus was not muslim, Christians are not muslims-in-waiting and the billboard is a lie. Though I have no proof, my opinion was that it was a calculated wordplay akin to calling abortion “health care.”
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You are absolutely right. The best proof is that our Sufi friend does not object to this line of argumentation.
 
Lokadottir said:
Sir, I want you to know that, if I ever become Christian again I’d be a quaker. Because you are truly Christlike.
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Christ also flipped tables and raised His voice, you know.:eek:

I find it quite odd that your eternal salvation, philosophy, and way of life is contingent upon how you perceive a person, rather than truth and reason. Interesting.

Although I suppose its better to be Christian at all, than not.
 
Lokadottir said:
By this logic Protestants are Catholics.
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Seeing as I’m arguing for a responsible use of language and not merely reducing words to their technical meaning I don’t see how by my logic we arrive at that.
 
Gabriel_of_12 said:
Islam invites man to submit to God? Ponder that statement for a moment;

When did God tell Islam or give Islam the divine authority on earth to invite man to submit to God?

Muhammad never heard directly from God nor did Muhammad ever speak directly to God. God never reveals His true presence to Islam. To think so, wouldn’t that place Islam in direct blasphemy? Does Islam claim the ink and paper in the Quran is the presence of God?

The billboard “Jesus was a Muslim”, (Jesus) Never teaches anyone to submit to God. Jesus gives us two commandments “Love God” and “Love neighbor”. There is nothing in Jesus teachings that invites anyone to “submit to God”. Therefore, the billboard deceives, Jesus to be a Muslim.

If Jesus never teaches anyone to submit to God then Jesus is never Muslim.

Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. A Son does not submit as a slave does to his master. A Son Loves His Father, therefore Jesus cannot be a Muslim as one who submits as a slave to the creator.

The prophet Muhammad died. Jesus lives. Islam follows a dead prophet of Islam. Christianity follows an eternal living King and Lord Jesus, who has already conquered.

The billboard Jesus that Islam teaches does not exist nor did he ever exist.

I follow you that Islam is about God, for God, to God. When is Islam in the presence “with God”. Is that not blasphemy for a Muslim to claim to be “with God”?

You do well here, but when did the purpose change in Islam to conquer, or to invite man to submit to God according to the tenants of Islam.

Did God command this or did Muhammad order it?

It is easy for a slave to submit to his master whom the slave does not know. Islam submits to God, because Islam has never seen God.

Christians submission to God is freewill from the heart, soul, mind and strength in Love, because the Christian is with God and in God, when God is all and in all.

Jesus taught “I am In the Father and the Father is in me”. This teaching is never a submission to God therefore Jesus is never a Muslim.

Does a slave or Muslim who submits to God as his master ever know his master as his Father? The way Jesus teaches that Jesus came from His Father in heaven. Jesus cannot be Muslim, because Jesus never makes the claim that he is a slave of submission to God.

The Son does not work for a wage from His Father, as a Muslim submits to his/her master as a slave of Islam for a wage.

Peace be with you
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We believe in the same person, Jesus. Our differences concerning him is how we perceive him.

Christians see Jesus as God.

I, as a Muslim see Jesus as a man, worthy of the Jewish titles, Son of Man, Elohim (god), Son of God, the Messiah, as understood within the Jewish theology. As well as the lofty titles within Islamic theology, the Messiah, a word of God, servant of God, Messenger of God, and Muslim.

I do not believe Jesus is God, nor the literal son of God.
We will continue to disagree concerning these issues, so I will not go any further.

Concerning some of the others you addressed.
Did God really say that directly in the presence of any Muslim? God never speaks in the second or third person when God “says”. Your quote decieves, because the person speaking is never God, the one writing is never God, the quote reveals a human mind relating to the things of God, the author does not speak for God nor is God speaking.
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It is part of the eloquence of the Arabic language. One needs to know Arabic pretty well to understand that point, one needs to know Arabic Rhetoric and Grammar.

How do you explain the details of physics if ones does not know calculus? In other words there are certain prerequisites needed in order to understand certain things.
I follow you that Islam is about God, for God, to God. When is Islam in the presence “with God”. Is that not blasphemy for a Muslim to claim to be “with God”?
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How could it be??? when God says, " We (I, God) are closer to him (man) than his jugular vein." ( Quran 50:13)

When Prophet Muhammad said, that God says, ** When I love him (the servant of God), I become his hearing with which he hears, his seeing with which he sees, his hand with which he strikes, and his foot with which he walks. If he were to ask Me for something, I would give it to him. If he were to ask Me for refuge, I would give him refuge.’"** (Bukhari)

Concerning some of the other issues, some of the topics I responded to in the past caused me to get banned. So I won’t address them.

And God knows best.
 
TheSufi said:
I, as a Muslim see Jesus as a man, worthy of the Jewish titles, Son of Man, Elohim (god), Son of God, the Messiah, as understood within the Jewish theology. As well as the lofty titles within Islamic theology, the Messiah, a word of God, servant of God, Messenger of God, and Muslim.
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From the get go Muslims already are mistaken. The Jews knew Jesus was claiming to be God. When Jesus said he was the Son of God (in Islam Isa, where did he claim to be Son of God?), the Biblical narrative understood Jewish theology, wanted to stone Jesus for his claims.

Jesus was concerned with the eternal Salvation of Man and the Jews knew he was not a fool or a nut case. They were afraid of being proven wrong by this Rabbi (Jesus) amd rather kill him than face their own people for being so stubborn.

MJ
 
MartinJordan said:
From the get go Muslims already are mistaken. The Jews knew Jesus was claiming to be God. When Jesus said he was the Son of God (in Islam Isa, where did he claim to be Son of God?), the Biblical narrative understood Jewish theology, wanted to stone Jesus for his claims.

Jesus was concerned with the eternal Salvation of Man and the Jews knew he was not a fool or a nut case. They were afraid of being proven wrong by this Rabbi (Jesus) amd rather kill him than face their own people for being so stubborn.

MJ
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From the get go Christians are mistaken.
 
TheSufi said:
We believe in the same person, Jesus. Our differences concerning him is how we perceive him.

Christians see Jesus as God.

I, as a Muslim see Jesus as a man, worthy of the Jewish titles, Son of Man, Elohim (god), Son of God, the Messiah, as understood within the Jewish theology. As well as the lofty titles within Islamic theology, the Messiah, a word of God, servant of God, Messenger of God, and Muslim.

I do not believe Jesus is God, nor the literal son of God.
We will continue to disagree concerning these issues, so I will not go any further.

Concerning some of the others you addressed.

It is part of the eloquence of the Arabic language. One needs to know Arabic pretty well to understand that point, one needs to know Arabic Rhetoric and Grammar.

How do you explain the details of physics if ones does not know calculus? In other words there are certain prerequisites needed in order to understand certain things.

How could it be??? when God says, " We (I, God) are closer to him (man) than his jugular vein." ( Quran 50:13)

When Prophet Muhammad said, that God says, ** When I love him (the servant of God), I become his hearing with which he hears, his seeing with which he sees, his hand with which he strikes, and his foot with which he walks. **If he were to ask Me for something, I would give it to him. If he were to ask Me for refuge, I would give him refuge.’" (Bukhari)

Concerning some of the other issues, some of the topics I responded to in the past caused me to get banned. So I won’t address them.

And God knows best.
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