Bishop responds to Boy Scouts' decision on admission of homosexual members [CWN]

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BroomWagon said:
It is an act of corporal mercy to visit the sick. Perhaps we should not say this is about “separation”, too, we should not be “cooperating with sin”, the Holy Father was not cooperating with sin in showing merciful treatment of the afflicted but Catholic/Christian charity.
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No, he was showing accepting them with respect, compassion, and sensitivity, as the Catechism teaches.

We cannot justify separating ourselves, and call ourselves evangelizing to the Church, or more importantly Him.

That’s all I have to say on the subject. I’ve repeated myself enough, and some have offered advice for those who would not hear. 😉
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
No, he was showing accepting them with respect, compassion, and sensitivity, as the Catechism teaches.

We cannot justify separating ourselves, and call ourselves evangelizing to the Church, or more importantly Him.

That’s all I have to say on the subject. I’ve repeated myself enough, and some have offered advice for those who would not hear. 😉
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Matthew 25:35, 36 Christ commands us to do these things.

"…sick, and you visited me: I was in prison, and you came to me. "

The Beatitudes? Someone correct me.

Perhaps it is “Evangelizing” to the world to not be permissive towards Homosexuality, it’s very clear, a lot of people are going to leave Scouting and they will be evangelizing in this way.
 
BroomWagon said:
Matthew 25:35, 36 Christ commands us to do these things.

"…sick, and you visited me: I was in prison, and you came to me. "

The Beatitudes? Someone correct me.

Perhaps it is “Evangelizing” to the world to not be permissive towards Homosexuality, it’s very clear, a lot of people are going to leave Scouting and they will be evangelizing in this way.
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No one has promoted being permissive towards homosexuality. I have tried to explain loving the sinner and rejecting the sin.

If we evangelize all sinners the way you explain it, the Churches will be empty from now on. 😦
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
No one has promoted being permissive towards homosexuality. I have tried to explain loving the sinner and rejecting the sin.

If we evangelize all sinners the way you explain it, the Churches will be empty from now on. 😦
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Actually, it might be a positive witness that would attract churchgoers. And that latter statement is a bit condescending. We should be able to disagree without being disagreeable.

But let’s remember, what if one is for Scouts to be morally straight. What if somehow and considering that it could actually happen, a male got into the Scouts, was HIV positive and somehow another Scout was infected? The Scout was openly gay? Maybe this is far fetched but one could see how there could be problems that arise. We are also stewards of what God has given to us.

And that is the last I will speak on this.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
So, in separating ourselves from others, please explain how we’re calling them to leave other organizations and come to His? :rolleyes:
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Do as the Apostles did. St Paul preached in the synagogues and at the Greek temples, not to make them better Jews or Pagans, but to become Catholics.

We can evangelize others, not only into Catholic orgs, but into the Catholic Church.

We would show up at Scouting events, like St Paul into Ephesus, and seek to gain bring members into a fully Catholic org. Staff tables, pass out flyers, public service projects etc…

That is no more separation that the Apostles separated themselves from the Jews.
 
Brendan said:
Do as the Apostles did. St Paul preached in the synagogues and at the Greek temples, not to make them better Jews or Pagans, but to become Catholics.

We can evangelize others, not only into Catholic orgs, but into the Catholic Church.

We would show up at Scouting events, like St Paul into Ephesus, and seek to gain bring members into a fully Catholic org. Staff tables, pass out flyers, public service projects etc…

That is no more separation that the Apostles separated themselves from the Jews.
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The apostles did not separate themselves from anyone, and even became martyrs for their non separation. You even said that when you said they preached in the synagogues and temples.

The separation appears to be of men, by men. It’s not taught by Christ, or His Church.
 
BroomWagon said:
Actually, it might be a positive witness that would attract churchgoers. And that latter statement is a bit condescending. We should be able to disagree without being disagreeable.

But let’s remember, what if one is for Scouts to be morally straight. What if somehow and considering that it could actually happen, a male got into the Scouts, was HIV positive and somehow another Scout was infected? The Scout was openly gay? Maybe this is far fetched but one could see how there could be problems that arise. We are also stewards of what God has given to us.

And that is the last I will speak on this.
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Do we believe Christ can protect His Church as He said, or not? Do we have to step in and do it for Him? Think about it.
 
The Boy Scouts is not the Catholic Church. Lots of open ends here.
 
It may well send a message to one, if you act in a certain way, you are not welcome here. That is not separation but discipline and love.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
The apostles did not separate themselves from anyone, and even became martyrs for their non separation. You even said that when you said they preached in the synagogues and temples.

The separation appears to be of men, by men. It’s not taught by Christ, or His Church.
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Did they register as members of the synagogues and temples? They entered there with the intention to convert, did they not?

Could we not do the same? Form up a Catholic organization for youth with the intention to convert everyone to that organization?

Of course, the process of conversion would involve interactions, but like St. Paul did not have a membership in the Temple of Artemis, neither would we have memberships in the BSA, but in an organization more fully devoted to Truth!
 
Brendan said:
Did they register as members of the synagogues and temples? They entered there with the intention to convert, did they not?

Could we not do the same? Form up a Catholic organization for youth with the intention to convert everyone to that organization?

Of course, the process of conversion would involve interactions, but like St. Paul did not have a membership in the Temple of Artemis, neither would we have memberships in the BSA, but in an organization more fully devoted to Truth!
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They couldn’t convert by leaving and maintaining a separation. :rolleyes:
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Where did Jesus ‘dust His feet’ and abandon a group of sinners? Separating ourselves, as Christians, from sinners is not giving them opportunity to hear the Word. The dusting of feet is prematurely taking place, as you describe it. In abandoning children, to the secular world, it’s more likely that more will stumble, without those to share His influence.
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Prodigal_Son1 said:
It seems more of separating our children, and abandoning the non-believer children, because of their known sins. While it maybe a solid Catholic youth development, it is not evangelizing.
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I want to say that I believe that faithful Catholics can have differing opinions on whether or not they should continue to have parish sponsorship of their Troop. But the point that I want to make is that our Boy Scout troop is very involved in our parish life. They are members of our parish. Some attend our Catholic School, and some are homeschooled. Several of the scouts are also altar servers. As much as they love scouting, and our parish has a tradition of sponsoring the Boy Scouts for 100 years, the majority of the families put their Faith before the Boy Scouts. So the majority of them are in agreement with the sad decision that our pastor made, to no longer sponsor a Boy Scout Troop. But he let them know that they may join another Boy Scout Troop if they wanted. Our parish youth are not going to be “abandoned to the secular world”. We already have programs in place for our youth. Our pastor wrote: *“We are going to provide youth activities for any and all youth. And in our programs we will have strong mentors, good examples of Christian men and women; we will teach the Gospel; we will challenge kids to live the virtues; we will teach the truth in a very confused world; and we will invite our youth into a friendship with Jesus Christ that can heal any past hurts. Our current Fraternus and Fidelis programs are well equipped to help cultivate authentically masculine and feminine identities. We will also develop new programs to help replace what we will be losing from the legacy of Scouting.” *This certainly falls under the command to “love the sinner, hate the sin”.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Yet, the Church doesn’t explain it that way. 🤷
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If this was so, you would not have a number of Priests saying they are pulling their church’s troops out of the BSA. I would think the good Fathers would have knowledge of the Church’s teachings.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
They couldn’t convert by leaving and maintaining a separation. :rolleyes:
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They separated in the sense that the formed a new organization. They retained contact in the sense that they went out to other organization to show them how much better their new org is.

Which is exactly what I am proposing.

Was St Paul a part of the congregation at the Temple of Artemis, or did he go there with the specific intention of getting everyone to leave and join the org he was in instead?
 
zab said:
I want to say that I believe that faithful Catholics can have differing opinions on whether or not they should continue to have parish sponsorship of their Troop. But the point that I want to make is that our Boy Scout troop is very involved in our parish life. They are members of our parish. Some attend our Catholic School, and some are homeschooled. Several of the scouts are also altar servers. As much as they love scouting, and our parish has a tradition of sponsoring the Boy Scouts for 100 years, the majority of the families put their Faith before the Boy Scouts. So the majority of them are in agreement with the sad decision that our pastor made, to no longer sponsor a Boy Scout Troop. But he let them know that they may join another Boy Scout Troop if they wanted. Our parish youth are not going to be “abandoned to the secular world”. We already have programs in place for our youth. Our pastor wrote: "We are going to provide youth activities for any and all youth. And in our programs we will have strong mentors, good examples of Christian men and women; we will teach the Gospel; we will challenge kids to live the virtues; we will teach the truth in a very confused world; and we will invite our youth into a friendship with Jesus Christ that can heal any past hurts. Our current Fraternus and Fidelis programs are well equipped to help cultivate authentically masculine and feminine identities. We will also develop new programs to help replace what we will be losing from the legacy of Scouting." This certainly falls under the command to “love the sinner, hate the sin”.
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I admire your Pastor, I am sorry if the other day, I did not post a good article, I would not have known.

Just think, the BSA may be wrong but your troop might go for a 100 years and never get an “openly gay” Scout. Something to contemplate.
 
Sonic said:
So, being “gay” is about “being against punishing people for having desires and admitting to having them”?

Are you sure you don’t want to clarify that statement? 😉

Edit: I’m just kidding. Your statement is just poorly worded.
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Sorry, yeah, bad wording. :doh2:

If by “gay”, we mean people who admit to having SSA, I don’t think those people should be unnecessarily excluded from organizations like the BSA. I think that a lot of the time, “gay” simply means that one has SSA exclusively, and has nothing to do with actions. That’s not always the case, but in some cases, I think it is.

Anyways, I can’t keep up with this thread anymore. It’s really long. See you all later. 👋
 
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