Cafeteria Catholic?

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Hildebrand:
There are saintly Catholics, sinful Catholics, heretical Catholics, apostate Catholics, and some others. “Cafeteria Catholics” is a politically correct word for heretical Catholics.
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What is an apostate Catholic?
I disagree with the Magesterium of the Catholic Church on …
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  1. Nothing
  2. Matters of practice (married priests)
  3. Matters of authoritative teaching (birth control)
  4. Matters of dogma (Church isn’t visible, communion of saints, Marian dogmas, in a nutshell … Protestantism)
  5. Everything pertaining to faith (not Christian)
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I do think this would be an interesting poll and I wish someone had gone ahead and posted it because I’m really curious as to where the other so-called “cafeteria” Catholics stand on some of these things. I would like to see what kinds of dissent are most common because I’m wondering if most people are like me in dissenting only on #3. I believe in celibate priests and apostolic succession and the Communion of Saints and Marian dogma, but most especially I believe in the REAL PRESENCE of Christ in the Eucharist.

But because I question some matters of authoritative teaching (none of which I’m currently breaking, in case you are wondering. I simply question them & refuse to condemn other people for questioning them or ignoring them) I apparently should pack my bags and go elsewhere. Well, I’ve been elsewhere for the past 22 years and I’d like to know just where you would send us because there is no place else out there that has what the Catholic Church has – the REAL PRESENCE and 2000 years of continuity and many other things that I have perfect faith in. As a result of that faith, I’ll withstand whatever disparaging remarks more perfect Catholics want to charge me with and face the consequences on Judgement Day. You won’t drive me away from even the mere glimpse of the face of God that my imperfect faith gives me. If you want to work yourself into a embolism over it, be my guest.
 
Dearest Friend

Stay just where you are dear friend, no-one is any better than you, God loves us all equally, God has no favourites, the Holy Trinity resides in your precious baptised soul, you are my sister in Christ. No-one has any right to judge you or you them. God Bless you and much love and peace to you xxxxx
 
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jennstall:
What is an apostate Catholic?

I do think this would be an interesting poll and I wish someone had gone ahead and posted it because I’m really curious as to where the other so-called “cafeteria” Catholics stand on some of these things. I would like to see what kinds of dissent are most common because I’m wondering if most people are like me in dissenting only on #3. I believe in celibate priests and apostolic succession and the Communion of Saints and Marian dogma, but most especially I believe in the REAL PRESENCE of Christ in the Eucharist.

But because I question some matters of authoritative teaching (none of which I’m currently breaking, in case you are wondering. I simply question them & refuse to condemn other people for questioning them or ignoring them) I apparently should pack my bags and go elsewhere. Well, I’ve been elsewhere for the past 22 years and I’d like to know just where you would send us because there is no place else out there that has what the Catholic Church has – the REAL PRESENCE and 2000 years of continuity and many other things that I have perfect faith in. As a result of that faith, I’ll withstand whatever disparaging remarks more perfect Catholics want to charge me with and face the consequences on Judgement Day. You won’t drive me away from even the mere glimpse of the face of God that my imperfect faith gives me. If you want to work yourself into a embolism over it, be my guest.
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If you believe the Catholic church is true then why do you question the Magisterium on issues of faith and morals. Plenty of Protestant churches are liberal on the issue of birth control and would take you with open arms. If you know what the church says is true than why do you distrust Her on this issue of contraception? And if not, then why don’t you go elsewhere to be affirmed in the teaching on contraception. I’m not saying this to be self-rightous or judgemental - I just want to know why you think you can have it both ways? We’re all sinners and none of us are “perfect” catholics, but you do need to follow the church’s teachings (all of them) to really, truly call yourself a Catholic. Yes, we need to be tolerant of others but we also have to remind people of the truth in charity. Tolerance is useless if you don’t follow the truth.
 
Is the will to be right, the human will to be right, not the issues of infallible doctrine, greater than exercising love, charity and kindness? Is it the way to evangelise to condemn, or is it the way to evangelise to encourage a falling in love with Christ so deep that the heart is enveloped in Him and His merciful sacred heart and the human will is lost to this so much that God’s will is the only will that prevails?

Enough of the harshness and love much.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you all xxxxxxxx
 
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Teresa9:
Is the will to be right, the human will to be right, not the issues of infallible doctrine, greater than exercising love, charity and kindness? Is it the way to evangelise to condemn, or is it the way to evangelise to encourage a falling in love with Christ so deep that the heart is enveloped in Him and His merciful sacred heart and the human will is lost to this so much that God’s will is the only will that prevails?

Enough of the harshness and love much.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you all xxxxxxxx
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I’m not trying to condemn but speak the truth in charity. The Church’s teaching on contraception is hard, especially in this secular culture, but a close and thoughtful examination reveals that it is indeed the truth - so aren’t all the other teachings of the Church. You need to inform your conscience of the truth and then have the courage to try (notice I said try) to live the truth. We all fall down and sin but someone who knows the truth attempts to get up again and again and follow that difficult path (which is the Church and Her teachings). Following the truth is the greatest form of love because it is following the will of God. I’ll continue to pray hard that all will have the courage and fortitude to follow the teachings of the Church.
 
Dearest Riley

In all truth, I know your intentions are good, you love your faith and the doctrine of the church, but what use is it to love the law and abide in it while uncharitableness, unkindness and lack of love is held for our bretheren?

We love much when we give much, show how to live within the faith by our actions, but our words dear friend should always be of encouragement, admonishment breeds the sense of insurmountable tasks, now all things are possible in love of Christ our King, love of God our Father and love of the Holy Spirit.
Whenever we speak to another person, whenever we speak about them, as Christ resides in them we are as speaking of Christ.

The greatest and first LAW of all is to love God our Father and each other as ourselves. The spirit of love is mercy and mercy is the spirit of love, this IS Christ Jesus, who doesn’t wish to condemn but to save, who doesn’t wish to judge but to give life.

This thread is nothing but an argument and a poll over who is sinning and who is sinning more than another. It is full of pride and self congratulation, neither of which is humble, and should I now fall deep into not being humble myself, I won’t comment further in this thread

God Bless you all and much love and peace to all of you xxxx
 
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Riley259:
If you believe the Catholic church is true then why do you question the Magisterium on issues of faith and morals. Plenty of Protestant churches are liberal on the issue of birth control and would take you with open arms. If you know what the church says is true than why do you distrust Her on this issue of contraception? And if not, then why don’t you go elsewhere to be affirmed in the teaching on contraception. I’m not saying this to be self-rightous or judgemental - I just want to know why you think you can have it both ways? We’re all sinners and none of us are “perfect” catholics, but you do need to follow the church’s teachings (all of them) to really, truly call yourself a Catholic. Yes, we need to be tolerant of others but we also have to remind people of the truth in charity. Tolerance is useless if you don’t follow the truth.
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Riley, while the second suggested poll has an example of a teaching that people commonly disagree with, I’ve given no indication of which teachings I disagree with and won’t be doing so.

As to the rest, did you read all of my post? The Protestant churches do not share the same matters of faith that Catholics share in what I consider the most important points. Regardless of whether or not they would welcome me with open arms they have nothing for me. I think I made that really clear in my post.

Maybe I’m crazy, but it seems to me that if someone follows all of the Church’s teaching then they in fact would be a Saint. Unless of course, what you are really talking about is just keeping your mouth shut whenever you question something. Maybe that is what people mean by follow all the Church’s teachings. I really don’t know. But I do think it is odd that on the one hand someone says, “I’m a sinner,” and then “But I follow all of the Church’s teachings.” Well, they can’t both be true, not logically anyway. Or can they?

I accept I’m a sinner. I expect I’ll remain one for some time to come and that’ll I’ll probably continue to be a worse sinner than you.
 
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Teresa9:
Dearest Friend

Stay just where you are dear friend, no-one is any better than you, God loves us all equally, God has no favourites, the Holy Trinity resides in your precious baptised soul, you are my sister in Christ. No-one has any right to judge you or you them. God Bless you and much love and peace to you xxxxx
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Dearest Teresa, thank you very much for your kind words. They give me strength.

God bless you too,

Jenn
 
I love Cafeteria Catholics. :love: They have the potential to become our hope for the future. Most of them have no real concept about the faith they inherited. That is why they are Cafeteria Catholics.😉 These are the ones, especially the youth, who could easily become the backbone of our Church one day. Remember St Augustine, "yes Lord, but just not yet"
 
Psalm 139/13-14
Truly you have formed my in-most being
you knit me in my mothers womb
I give you thanks that I am fearfuly, wonderfully made
wonderful are your works

sounds like life to me
 
St. Louis:
Fortunately now I am trying to adhere to all tenents of the faith. Unfortunately it took me about 35 years to wake and understand that there is more to life than making money and acquiring STUFF. I had every opportunity growing up to know my faith but for whatever reason it never took hold. I see the same type attitude in many of my catholic friends. Cafeteria catholicism is a major problem.
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You, me and St. Augustine.
 
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rec:
The overwhelming percetage of #1’s surprises me, since I recently heard on Relevant Radio that only 30% of “Catholics” believe in the Real Presence!
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The people on these forums are not representative of the entire Catholic (nominal or otherwise) population.

Think about it. If you were baptized a Catholic and went to Catholic school and went your own way after that, if someone phones you with a poll questionnaire and asks what religion you are, you would likely automatically reply Catholic, even if you hadn’t been to confession or mass in 20 yrs. So in a sense, the respondents to such a poll should perhaps be categorized and qualified further. That 30% might be skewed because of an abundance of those who don’t believe in a lot that the Church teaches but were once baptized in the Church.

And probably the last place they would go on the internet is Catholic Answers Forums.
 
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Lilyofthevalley:
I think labeling someone as a “Cafeteria Catholic” is a form of self pride. It’s as if you are looking down on someone. 😦
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It could be that. We all need to remember to be charitable, especially to those that irritate us the most. Good point.
 
Binky Brown said:
Former Roman Catholic here.

**Whenever someone mentions this term, “cafeteria Catholic”, I always tell them that I got as far as the salad bar and determined that I had to dine elsewhere. 😉 **

**Seriously, it raises a meritorious question: At what point do you stop “grinning and bearing” beliefs/ practices that you cannot in good conscience accept, and seek another church? At what point do the purported"historical arguments" and triumphalistic boasts ring hollow, and you decide that you simply do not want to be a Catholic anymore, “cafeteria” or otherwise? **

It almost seems that, with some proto-Catholic types, you’re “damned if you do, and damned if you don’t.” On the one hand, it you put on blinders to a particular doctrinal point that you simply cannot accept as true and try to work around it, you’re blasted as a “cafeteria Catholic who picks and chooses” as (s)he goes along." On the other hand, if you decide to do the honest thing, and leave, you’re blasted as well: whether you’re an “apostate”, a “heretic”, or a “schismatic” can depend upon (a) their educational level; (b) their mood; (c) their definition of the terms; or (d) how much they’ve had to drink. Of course, the admonition is always to read more, study more, etc.-- but what happens when you’ve done all the research, and one still cannot reconcile those beliefs/practices with one’s conscience?

For myself, it ultimately came down to the issue of how I could better serve, know, and obey God. It also involved fellowshipping with those in whom I saw a clearer vision of Christian discipleship as exemplified by both their beliefs and their conduct. One desires to affiliate with , and to worship with, those who will inspire the better elements inside oneself, and what one aspires to become. Resolving the conflicts is never easy, and following through after decision was even harder. But I have never, ever, regretted doing what I knew was right.
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I do respect your honesty. I’m a PK raised Baptist, many years a de-facto materialist, recently a Catholic convert. I would repeat word for word the last line of your post, “But I have never, ever, regretted doing what I knew was right.”
 
There is a reason why they refer to it as “practicing”

It takes some of us a while to get it right
😉
 
Steve Andersen:
There is a reason why they refer to it as “practicing”

It takes some of us a while to get it right
😉
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Amen.

That’s what I tell anyone who sees my crucifix at work or anywhere else, and asks a question about my faith. I tell them I am a practicing Catholic, and I keep practicing because I’m not that good at it yet.

It sets them at ease with humour, it deflects some of the “holier-than-thou” criticisms, and because it is based on simple truth, it sometimes opens the door to further conversation.

(I live and work in a world of religious symbolism, Sikh, Muslim, Hindu, and so forth but I found that my faith was severely under-represented. So I started to wear the crucifix. I find that I watch my words and attitude a lot closer too, because I don’t want to bring shame on my Lord. From the truly religious of other faiths, I find I get respect as well. Suspicion too, but respect.)

Sorry, off topic a bit here.
 
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seeker63:
Well, again, if you saw my first point, I believe life begins at birth, therefore I don’t believe terminating a pregnancy prior to a birth IS killing. I’m sure you can at least see how someone who felt life begins at birth would not consider that murder. If and when I can see satisfactory scientific proof that life begins before that point, then I’ll change my views.
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The is plenty of information out there. It is not hard to find. Type in fetal developement and do asearch on you computer. You need to be informed on such a very important matter.

Example:Week 10The embryo is now about 1 inch in length. Facial features, limbs, hands feet fingers and toes become apparent. The nervous system is responsive and many of the internal organs begin to function

Week 14The fetus is now 3 inches long and weighs almost an ounce. The muscles begin to develop and sex organs form. Eyelids, fingernails, and toenails also form. The child’s spontaneous movements can be observed.

Week 26The fetus can now inhale, exhale and even cry. Eyes have completely formed, and the tongue has developed taste buds. Under intensive medical care the fetus has a over a 50% chance of surviving outside the womb.
I always urge those that are pro-choice to make an informed decision. Know what the stages of developement are and know what takes place during an abortion.

If your for something you need to know what your for.

Here’s a link to an awesome picture from a dr who performed a surgery on an unborn baby to save it’s life.
fetal-surgery.com/fs-pics.htm
 
If I joined the Boys Scouts of America, went through all the ranks, made the promise and oath, but only went to meetings when I felt like it, promised every day to be trustworthy, loyal, kind, obedient, cheerful and thrifty, but ignored the other six promises, made up my own motto (instead of Be Prepared: “whatever”), refused to help old ladies across the street, insisted on receiving merit badges without fulfilling the requirements, designed my own uniform instead of wearing the one issued to me because I consider it old-fashioned, flouted the rules on outings and caused disciplinary problems and brought disrepute on my troop members because of my actions - - – would I be called a Cafeteria Boy Scout?
 
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