Can teenagers go to hell?

[MtnDwellar]

I believe it is very difficult to go to Hell at any age! Otherwise Jesus wouldn’t have chosen to suffer and die for all of us, not only “the chosen few”. When we die we shall understand how much unnecessary suffering we caused and then we shall have the opportunity to repent and make amends - as far as we can - in Purgatory. The power of God’s love for us is so great that only diabolical hatred can withstand it. Most - if not all - of our sins are due to some form of ignorance and selfishness rather than cold-blooded pride and malice.

This was an early post on this thread and I haven’t seen anyone directly correct these statements. Has Catholic teaching changed?

If a person chooses hell it doesn’t mean that Jesus didn’t suffer and die for him, does it?

I thought that we had to repent for sins during life in order receive forgiveness. Purgatory is time for purification and atonement through suffering, not by repenting and making amends.

I can see that after these changes took effect that teenagers or even most older people will take advantage of a second chance in purgatory.

 

[tonyrey]

This was an early post on this thread and I haven’t seen anyone directly correct these statements. Has Catholic teaching changed?

If a person chooses hell it doesn’t mean that Jesus didn’t suffer and die for him, does it?

I thought that we had to repent for sins during life in order receive forgiveness. Purgatory is time for purification and atonement through suffering, not by repenting and making amends.

I can see that after these changes took effect that teenagers or even most older people will take advantage of a second chance in purgatory.

A misinterpretation of my statements.

 

[tonyrey]

Name one person who didn’t / doesn’t need a savior?

We all need salvation but that doesn’t imply that without salvation we necessarily go to hell. My post was a response to the statement “We already **deserve **Hell” (simply because of original sin!).

 

[tonyrey]

Young children who die do not go to Hell either. Not babies, not children.

Indeed. Only those who reject God go to Hell.

 

[friardchips]

I think my point is that in my experience anecdotally I really don’t see much of anything unless as a Type A tell people what to do.

You mean, you don’t get to spend time around others, as much as others? Well, theologically you were not wrong as a Type A, in this thread, either in answering the OP’s question or following our own branch topic. Prayer is action, in itself. It is not nothing. But there is also prayer in action, which is what you were saying, I think. Even hermits work. But we have to remember that even sick and bed-ridden people can act too. They might not be able to move physically so their act IS prayer. If a person really needs spiritual help then the best thing they could do is go and ask a sick person to pray for them! The sick and suffering are, IMO, some of the very closest to our Creator’s merciful heart, and so their prayers are needed.

In answer to the thread question. They can. As you were all saying, we are given the ability to reason at quite a young age, but I think it is difficult for a teenager to sin mortally with all three criteria met, so we could say “yes, but more unlikely, than likely”. I don’t really believe our moral consciences are properly formed at such an age as under 18. Hence, my post about abortion and the excommunicable age being 16 or over, for that extreme act (until confession).

 

[steve_b]

Alas, many don’t even believe in God or Hell.

Agreed, that too.

 

[truetofaith]

Our Creator is real. And so is Hell, unfortunately.

Mortal sin:

1. An act of grave matter.
2. Committed with full knowledge.
3. Deliberate consent.

If committed with full knowledge is required…then most of these poor, kids from single parent homes in the ghetto are going to be in heaven with the saints…even though they raped, robbed & murdered! Ug!

 

[Tantum_ergo]

If committed with full knowledge is required…then most of these poor, kids from single parent homes in the ghetto are going to be in heaven with the saints…even though they raped, robbed & murdered! Ug!

Apparently a lot of people think that ‘full knowledge’ means the kind of encyclopedic and in-depth ‘coverage’ required of say, a full professor.

It doesn’t.

Also it is kind of insulting to the millions of poor kids from single parent homes in the ghetto who DIDN’T ‘rape, rob, or murder’ and who had exactly the same kind of knowledge that those who committed those crimes had.

 

[truetofaith]

Apparently a lot of people think that ‘full knowledge’ means the kind of encyclopedic and in-depth ‘coverage’ required of say, a full professor.

It doesn’t.

Also it is kind of insulting to the millions of poor kids from single parent homes in the ghetto who DIDN’T ‘rape, rob, or murder’ and who had exactly the same kind of knowledge that those who committed those crimes had.

Maybe those had a religious upbringing?

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Maybe those had a religious upbringing?

And maybe they didn’t?

 

[friardchips]

And maybe they didn’t?

I think it is safer to say that every man is capable of evil lest they were born into some kind of moral upbringing - Christian or otherwise.

Purgatory is a place where people don’t want to spend too long. A day there would be like years here. I would not wish to offer something a lot worse than Purgatory to youngsters, for eternity. Eternity doesn’t end, you know.

Some acts probably do entail enough premeditation in the mind of the evil-doer to deserve Hell but I do not think this is in the majority, not for people under 18, and especially if they have had a really tough upbringing.

It is not that you are incorrect, but rather, that it is better to not only be merciful but to be thinking mercifully. Hold out hope for people etc…

There are some things I have read that I’ve thought: “That is truly horrid” and wish that person bad tidings, sure that has happened, but if I were outrageously humble, I might in those instances have rather wished for their conversion. Maybe after such an act without conversion they are on their way to Hell if they die in that state. Many people do things out of a lack of thinking, especially kids, though. Now certainly grave matter can occur frequently but what of the other two criteria:

From EWTN:

'The presents the three criteria that must be satisfied for a sin to be mortal. First, the act committed must be considered grave or serious matter. Mortal sins are heinous in the eyes of God. Throughout the moral section of the , some sins are noted as “gravely sinful” (No. 2268). For example, “The fifth commandment forbids direct and intentional killing as gravely sinful.” Second, the sinner must have full knowledge of the sinful character of the act; in other words, he must be acting with an informed intellect and must know this act violates God’s eternal law. Third, the sinner must give full consent of the will, meaning that he has reflected on doing the action and deliberately wants to do it.’

 

[MtnDwellar]

Some seem to be setting the bar for invincible ignorance low, so that nearly all serious sin is committed due to invincible ignorance.

They are also omitting the sing of negligence which can also be a mortal sin.

 

[friardchips]

Some seem to be setting the bar for invincible ignorance low, so that nearly all serious sin is committed due to invincible ignorance.

They are also omitting the sing of negligence which can also be a mortal sin.

Some seem to be setting a bar for negligable sin higher than the CCC?!

 

[MtnDwellar]

Some seem to be setting a bar for negligable sin higher than the CCC?!

Perhaps I wan’t clear. St Thomas teaches that natural law compels men to seek the truth in regard to morals and God. If one refuses to follow his own natural desire to seek truth, he is guilty of the sin of negligence. If the result is that he commits a gravely sinful act, then, the negligence is mortally sinful.

 

[tonyrey]

Some seem to be setting the bar for invincible ignorance low, so that nearly all serious sin is committed due to invincible ignorance.

They are also omitting the sing of negligence which can also be a mortal sin.

What are the criteria for invincible ignorance?

 

[MtnDwellar]

What are the criteria for invincible ignorance?

Originally the term was used to describe people who did not have access to Catholic teaching. Later, it was interpreted more like - ignorant of truth through no fault of their own.

“Through no fault of their own” is where the subjectivity can get involved. Is inherent stubbornness or an unwillingness to accept truth no fault of their own?

I would rather err to the side of safety and think the bar for invincible ignorance is high and relatively few people are excused from sin due to ignorance.

 

[truetofaith]

Originally the term was used to describe people who did not have access to Catholic teaching. Later, it was interpreted more like - ignorant of truth through no fault of their own.

“Through no fault of their own” is where the subjectivity can get involved. Is inherent stubbornness or an unwillingness to accept truth no fault of their own?

I would rather err to the side of safety and think the bar for invincible ignorance is high and relatively few people are excused from sin due to ignorance.

Yeah…I don’t care if you never even heard of God…who in their heart Doesn’t know it’s wrong to steal from another, rape & murder or lie to deceive someone

God put these laws in the caveman’s heart!

 

[agnes_therese]

If committed with full knowledge is required…then most of these poor, kids from single parent homes in the ghetto are going to be in heaven with the saints…even though they raped, robbed & murdered! Ug!

Most people, with or without religious upbringing, know that rape, robbery, and murder are wrong.

 

[friardchips]

Perhaps I wan’t clear. St Thomas teaches that natural law compels men to seek the truth in regard to morals and God. If one refuses to follow his own natural desire to seek truth, he is guilty of the sin of negligence. If the result is that he commits a gravely sinful act, then, the negligence is mortally sinful.

A lot of people attribute everything known to the Church, with St. Thomas Aquinas, and while I think he was right in many things, does not put him higher than current understanding in the RCC. I can immediately think of one detail he got wrong (not his fault, just born before it was revealed). If you are saying that St. Thomas Aquinas’ sensible reasoning explains the criteria in the CCC for mortal sin to be applicable in certain situations then that is different and we are indeed in dialogue.

 

[friardchips]

Most people, with or without religious upbringing, know that rape, robbery, and murder are wrong.

Did St. Mary Magdeline know that prostitution was wrong? Sexual sins (apart from rape) committed by young people are more understandable than other sins as I think a lot of those types of sins happen because of external pressure, and social trends or cultures, which can weigh heavily on people growing up.

I do however think that rape and murder at all ages, from the age of reason, are mortal, when premeditated (rape is no doubt always premeditated). Such acts are acts of devilry. Robbery is very serious but not in the league of rape and murder. Of course.

There is still the part in the CCC that states for a mortal sin to be mortal one must know it is mortal. But I think, as this poster said, everyone knows murder and rape is wrong, like a built in knowledge or sense. Even when young. Possibly ‘premeditation’ is a deciding factor.

So this handing out of sentences to Hell, convicts half the world guilty of abortion and euthanasia then, doesn’t it! In absolute terms, I mean.