Can We All Agree We Are One

[anode]

As an outsider, I am struck about how Christians disagree with each other, how *Catholics *disagree. No unity at all. Certainly no peace.

 

[wisdomseeker]

As an outsider, I am struck about how Christians disagree with each other, how *Catholics *disagree. No unity at all. Certainly no peace.

this is the fruit of those who left the Church.

what you mean by how Catholics dissagree?

**
“Without truth, charity ends up in sentimentalism. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled arbitrarily. It is the fatal risk of love in a culture without truth. It falls prey to the emotions and contingent opinions of the individuals, an abused and distorted word, to the point of signifying the contrary.” BXVI**

 

[CMatt25]

NO! this is wrong! We can both be wrong but we can not have 2 opposing beliefs that are truth. The Catholic Church has the full deposit of of exposed truth with regards to faith and morals. See, this is once again one of those times when either of us can say we hold the truth but we have to agree that both of us can’t. Do you not agree?
.
Peace!

Prod, I’m not surprised you would disagree. My definition of truth is probably different than yours. So my words in that post may not have been clear. I believe we have faith. I’m just, the human I am, not quite as ready to say any one human, any of us, with total and complete 100% absolute certainty and absolute total proof are capable of fully understanding every single aspect of God.

I know I’ve posted this before somewhere. But we start with faith in a Creator. Move onto faith in a Holy Book. Then faith in Christ the Messiah if our faith is Christian. After that some may put total faith in the ECFs. Someone else may not. And so on. But what one thing unites us? Christ.

And since I strive to unite rather than divide, though human so even I myself fail at times, I must continue to praise the unity we all have as one in Christ, all God’s children, and let the rest fall into place in time. Peace to you well.

 

[CMatt25]

As an outsider, I am struck about how Christians disagree with each other, how *Catholics *disagree. No unity at all. Certainly no peace.

Anode, you don’t specify any faith in your profile and that’s fine. It is difficult to explain. But we are united on Christ being Lord. Just not some of the details beyond that.

 

[CMatt25]

this is the fruit of those who left the Church.

what you mean by how Catholics dissagree?

**
“Without truth, charity ends up in sentimentalism. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled arbitrarily. It is the fatal risk of love in a culture without truth. It falls prey to the emotions and contingent opinions of the individuals, an abused and distorted word, to the point of signifying the contrary.” BXVI**

Wisdom , how long have you been a Catholic? Seriously you honestly don’t believe Catholics have disagreed down thru the yrs?

 

[wisdomseeker]

Wisdom , how long have you been a Catholic? Seriously you honestly don’t believe Catholics have disagreed down thru the yrs?

What does it matter if they dissagree? the main thing here is the teachings of the Church. it is what the Church teaches that matters. opinions of man in the Church has no merit whatsoever. the Truth is not voted by the people. the Truth was given by Christ to the Church, it is not based on opinions of the people. those who dissagree and dont come to terms with it, leave and build their own churches this way they can do and believe whatever they want. but in the CC, we have to believe what the Church teaches and obey.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but opinions are just that,
and are not to be taken as a substitute or stand-in for doctrinal truth.

"The LORD is near to all who call upon him, to all who call upon him in truth."
Psa 145:18

** They sent their disciples to him, with the Herodians, saying, “Teacher, we know that you are a truthful man and that you teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. And you are not concerned with anyone’s opinion, for you do not regard a person’s status.”
Matthew 22:16**
**
“He who speaks the truth gives honest evidence, but a false witness utters deceit.”
Prov 12:17**

"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and wickedness
of men who by their wickedness suppress the truth."
Rom 1:18

"We have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways; we refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God’s word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God."
2Cor 4:2

as you can see my friend, make sure you know who is tempering with the Word of God.

 

[CMatt25]

2Cor 5:7 For we walk by faith, and not by sight.

 

[Eric_Hyom]

Greetings and peace be with you wisdomseeker

without the True Church safeguarding the Truth throught the ages, we could not know the Truth. that is my point. it is good for Catholics to tell those who dont know the Truth where the Truth is safeguarded.

The greatest thing Jesus asked us to do, is to live by the greatest commandments, all the law and the prophets of God, hang on these two commandments.

Somehow you are making it sound like, the greatest thing Jesus commanded us to do, is to join the Catholic Church.

Which truth is greater?

Blessings

Eric

 

[wisdomseeker]

Greetings and peace be with you wisdomseeker

The greatest thing Jesus asked us to do, is to live by the greatest commandments, all the law and the prophets of God, hang on these two commandments.

Somehow you are making it sound like, the greatest thing Jesus commanded us to do, is to join the Catholic Church.

Which truth is greater?

Blessings

Eric

Should we forget the first Commandment?

how do you manage to separate the Body from the Head? how can you love the Head and not love the Body(Church)?

the Holy Church, the sheepfold, the Holy mother Church?

fr. Corapi says: "everything that is good we receive from the Church. the Eucharist, Baptism, holy orders, the Truth, she feeds us, she educates us, she leads us in love, she protects from the wolves and so forth.

would say she is no longer relevant in our days? is it not her that has been under attack?
by those who dont believe in her? if one attacks the Church, isnt this one attacking Jesus? read what St Paul says about this.

**
“Without truth, charity ends up in sentimentalism. Love becomes an empty shell, to be filled arbitrarily. It is the fatal risk of love in a culture without truth. It falls prey to the emotions and contingent opinions of the individuals, an abused and distorted word, to the point of signifying the contrary.” BXVI **

 

[Eric_Hyom]

Greetings and peace be with you wisdomseeker;

fr. Corapi says: "everything that is good we receive from the Church.

Surely everything that is good is received from God the Father, and God the Son

the Eucharist, Baptism, holy orders,

These we receive from God the Father and God the Son, even though we receive them via the church…

These are just some thoughts to reflect on, if you are looking for a greatest truth. When Jesus spent his time on Earth he would have lived by the greatest commandments.

Jesus loves God the Father with all his heart, soul, mind and strength.
Jesus loves each and everyone of us ( neighbours ) as he loves himself.

It seems that love and the greatest commandments, could have a greatest meaning for Jesus also.

Blessings

Eric

 

[Eric_Hyom]

Greetings and peace be with you all,

Could the question of how the churches unite, and be as one, hang on the greatest commandments?

Before the creation of the universe began, could the greatest commandments possibly describe part of the trinity?

God the Father loves God the Son with all his heart, mind, soul and strength.
The Father loves each and every one of us as he loves himself.

Jesus loves God the Father with all his heart, mind, soul and strength.
Jesus loves each and every one of us as he loves himself.

If we were to hang Christian unity on the greatest commandments, it might be…

How can I love God with all my heart, soul, mind and strength?
How can I as an individual, and we as a communion, love other Christians as we love ourselves?

The commandments are greatest for a reason, and they must surely be a greatest good way to bring about unity, they must be a greatest truth.

Blessings

Eric

 

[CMatt25]

Before the creation of the universe began, could the greatest commandments possibly describe part of the trinity

Hello Eric, yes I believe Christ and His greatest commandments existed before all things.

Jude1:25 to the only God our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, might, and authority, **from all ages **past, and now, and forever and ever! Amen.

Col 1:17 Christ existed before all things, and in union with him all things have their proper place.

Jn1:1-2 In the beginning the Word already existed; the Word was with God, and the Word was God.2 From the very beginning the Word was with God.

Jn 8:58 I am telling you the truth, Jesus replied. Before Abraham was born, I Am.

Peace and His blessings to you my brother in Christ. All glory is His now and forever. Amen.

 

[Tomster]

I’m afraid the good man is setting himself up for a fall here. No where in Scripture does it say that the faithful are to read the Bible and come to their own conclusions. That’s a common idea amongst Protestants but it was never one envisioned by the Apostles.

And no one is excluding anyone. Any non-Catholics, even non-Christians, may attend Mass and the other public liturgies of the Church. They may attend our universities and study Scripture in our parishes, etc. They may even go to confession, although they will not receive absolution, marry in the Church, be Christian witnesses at baptisms, etc. What they may not do is receive the Eucharist, because they are not in communion with the Church.

If the world rejects the truths Christ gave his Church it wouldn’t be the first time. This is a recurring theme down through history, but we are bound to tell the truth no matter the consequences. God doesn’t ask us to convince anyone, but only to be witnesses to the truth.

We can agree on many things. I have to point out, though that the things we agree upon are the things the Catholic Church worked out centuries ago, and decided upon in its various councils. What our separated brethren need to do is learn the history of the Church, how and why it teaches what it does. Most who actually take the time and trouble are often reconciled to the Church. Those who aren’t come away with a new respect for what they have as Protestants due to the faithfulness of the Catholic Church.

Thanks Della!

After reading this I started wondering. What if world-wide Protestantism decided to convoke their own Ecumenical Council for the sake of promoting religious unity?

What would it look like?

Who would attend?

Where would it take place?

What would be discussed?

A topic for another thread.

 

[Carlan]

I’m afraid the good man is setting himself up for a fall here. No where in Scripture does it say that the faithful are to read the Bible and come to their own conclusions. That’s a common idea amongst Protestants but it was never one envisioned by the Apostles.

And no one is excluding anyone. Any non-Catholics, even non-Christians, may attend Mass and the other public liturgies of the Church. They may attend our universities and study Scripture in our parishes, etc. They may even go to confession, although they will not receive absolution, marry in the Church, be Christian witnesses at baptisms, etc. What they may not do is receive the Eucharist, because they are not in communion with the Church.

If the world rejects the truths Christ gave his Church it wouldn’t be the first time. This is a recurring theme down through history, but we are bound to tell the truth no matter the consequences. God doesn’t ask us to convince anyone, but only to be witnesses to the truth.

We can agree on many things. I have to point out, though that the things we agree upon are the things the Catholic Church worked out centuries ago, and decided upon in its various councils.

What our separated brethren need to do is learn the history of the Church, how and why it teaches what it does. Most who actually take the time and trouble are often reconciled to the Church. Those who aren’t come away with a new respect for what they have as Protestants due to the faithfulness of the Catholic Church​

.

Amen. Thank you Stella, and the many dissidents who visit CA would be enlightened greatly also by studying and pondering all the Catholic material available to us:thumbsup: Carlan

 

[CMatt25]

Just a comment regarding reading. I know many Catholics don’t think these were meant to apply to the NT but anyway here goes.

Acts 17:11 The people there were more open-minded than the people in Thessalonica. They listened to the message with great eagerness, and every day they studied the Scriptures to see if what Paul said was really true.

Matt 7:16 You will know them by what they do.

How we will know without reading Scripture ourselves? Peace.

 

[Carlan]

Just a comment regarding reading. I know many Catholics don’t think these were meant to apply to the NT but anyway here goes.

Acts 17:11 The people there were more open-minded than the people in Thessalonica. They listened to the message with great eagerness, and every day they studied the Scriptures to see if what Paul said was really true.

Matt 7:16 You will know them by what they do.

How we will know without reading Scripture ourselves? Peace.

Hello again Matt, the word is preached and read daily in every Catholic Church the world over, and i venture to say , somewhere every minute of the day.
It was the Church who gave us the Bible, the NT, and Catholics do read it apart from hearing it and the Magisterium of our Church , the teaching authority, made up of the Vicar of Christ on earth, the Pope, and all the Bishops and Priests, have studied all of revelation to be sure they are teaching the Truth that has been handed down to us through the ages from Christ.Carlan

 

[wisdomseeker]

Just a comment regarding reading. I know many Catholics don’t think these were meant to apply to the NT but anyway here goes.

Acts 17:11 The people there were more open-minded than the people in Thessalonica. They listened to the message with great eagerness, and every day they studied the Scriptures to see if what Paul said was really true.

Matt 7:16 You will know them by what they do.

How we will know without reading Scripture ourselves? Peace.

No.
it is that we Catholics have the discernment to know that these were Jews, to them were given the Word of God, the Law, and Promises, and Prophets and not to gentiles. gentiles could not be reading Scriptures to judge if the Jews were speaking according to the Word of God. as Catholics we are just greatful we were invited into the family of God, the Jews. you cant possibly be thinking that St Paul was telling protestants here to read Scriptures and judge the CC. do you?

i have conveyed this to you probably twice. maybe if i showed you this again, perhaps you will get it.

Think again.

 

[CMatt25]

Hello again Matt, the word is preached and read daily in every Catholic Church the world over, and i venture to say , somewhere every minute of the day.
It was the Church who gave us the Bible, the NT, and Catholics do read it apart from hearing it and the Magisterium of our Church , the teaching authority, made up of the Vicar of Christ on earth, the Pope, and all the Bishops and Priests, have studied all of revelation to be sure they are teaching the Truth that has been handed down to us through the ages from Christ.Carlan

Hello again Carlan, but He and therefore naturally love existed before all those things. So I like to believe Christ gave us the Bible. And St Paul tells us in union with Him we all have our proper place. You, I, our Protestant neighbors and friends. All in union with Him in love. God bless and Peace.

Your brother in Christ

 

[CMatt25]

No.
it is that we Catholics have the discernment to know that these were Jews, to them were given the Word of God, the Law, and Promises, and Prophets and not to gentiles. gentiles could not be reading Scriptures to judge if the Jews were speaking according to the Word of God. as Catholics we are just greatful we were invited into the family of God, the Jews. you cant possibly be thinking that St Paul was telling protestants here to read Scriptures and judge the CC. do you?

i have conveyed this to you probably twice. maybe if i showed you this again, perhaps you will get it.

Think again.

Hi Wisdom, I’m unsure of your intended tone in your last 3 sentences as on an online forum the tone intended may not be as I took it, but I will just simply say Paul teaches us in Galatians 3:28,

"So there is no difference between Jews and Gentiles, between slaves and free people, between men and women; you are all one in union with Christ Jesus.

We may just have to agree to disagree but both united together in Christ.

With peace and love, God bless!

 

[wisdomseeker]

Hi Wisdom, I’m unsure of your intended tone in your last 3 sentences as on an online forum the tone intended may not be as I took it, but I will just simply say Paul teaches us in Galatians 3:28, "So there is no difference between Jews and Gentiles, between slaves and free people, between men and women; you are all one in union with Christ Jesus.

In Peace and Love, God bless.

does this passage say that the Word of God, the promises, the Prophets, the Law was not given to the Jews?