Catholics and Immigration

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kbharbert said:
the SUBSTANTIATED fear is in the small stuff.

mexican students in california holding a protest and putting the mexican flag ABOVE the american flag on the pole with the american flag placed upside down to boot.

As anyone knows those were AMERICAN citizens protesting HR4437, a particularly gruesome proposed law that was opposed by millions of marchers and voted down in Congress. Like I said our strengths are in our institutions and our Constitution is one of them. You’re afraid of FREE SPEECH! THEN YOU"RE AFRAID OF BEING AMERICAN. To be afraid because a handful of Brown American adolescents who exercised their Free Speech is nonsense. To suggest that their actions were UNPATRIOTIC is as appalling as labeling them “Mexican” FREE SPEECH is as AMERICAN AS APPLE PIE! Next you’re going to tell me that you believe in the Reconquista theory? :juggle:

**
hubbys employer losing a contract NOT to better qualified bunch of people but to mexicans (without green cards, the ability to speak english and only an elementary knowledge of the job) BECAUSE it was cheaper.
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johnstown_johnn said:
Everyone with an ounce of sense knows this bill is an AMNESTY bill.

__

Peace
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Oh really? So they won’t have to pay fines, processing fees, back taxes, go through background and health checks and stay out of trouble, learn English and go to the back of the line?

Those that call S.1348 AMNESTY don’t know what they are talking about!!
 
johnstown_johnn said:
Everyone with an ounce of sense knows this bill is an AMNESTY bill.
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Anyone with an ounce of the ability to make an objective analysis knows that amnesty is a buzzword used by politicians with an agenda.

There are amnesties that right-wingers, I mean Republicans support. For example, there are tax amnesties where all one has to do is pay their back taxes and no penalties are due. That is a true amnesty.

Paying large fines, being placed at the back of the line for the process of citizenship, etc. is not an amnesty as those are indeed penalties that would be required.

An accurate description would be a change in the penalty for illegal presence, but it is not a wholesale pardoning of the penalty.

By the way, do you support Bush pardoning Scooter Libby? That would be a form of amnesty, too.

Are you against amnesty as a rule or just for poor, brown people who violated a civil law/committed an infraction?
 
Ender said:
The proposal calls for immediately conferring legal status on all illegals; it does not call for immediate citizenship. I’m not sure how you define amnesty but overlooking their illegal entry to this country and legalizing their presence is a workable definition for me.

Ender
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Immediately upon paying a penalty/fine. That, by definition, removes it from the column of amnesty to something else, more accurately called a change in the penalty.
 
mary_bobo said:
Ituyu;2324369:
Might I suggest that we just enforce the laws that were created in 1986 when President Reagan granted amnesty to illegals. At that time there were about one million. Politicians did not see fit to enforce the law and that’s why we are where we are now. And for me, it was hard to tell how the bill was going. There were so many amendments offered and as I have said before, the bill is many, many pages long and I seriously doubt that most of those voting had read it. I have been told by a few who have read it, that one section is contradicted by another section later. There must be a way to fix this and make it equitable for all. We do need workers, but why can’t they be legal workers?
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The bill has a table of contents with 13 pages. 800 sections.

Kowabonga!!
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Ituyu said:
Oh really? So they won’t have to pay fines, processing fees, back taxes, go through background and health checks and stay out of trouble, learn English and go to the back of the line?

Those that call S.1348 AMNESTY don’t know what they are talking about!!
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AND they get FREE legal help in negotiating whatever hoops they still may need to go through.
 
LCMS_No_More said:
Anyone with an ounce of the ability to make an objective analysis knows that amnesty is a buzzword used by politicians with an agenda.

There are amnesties that right-wingers, I mean Republicans support. For example, there are tax amnesties where all one has to do is pay their back taxes and no penalties are due. That is a true amnesty.

Paying large fines, being placed at the back of the line for the process of citizenship, etc. is not an amnesty as those are indeed penalties that would be required.

An accurate description would be a change in the penalty for illegal presence, but it is not a wholesale pardoning of the penalty.

By the way, do you support Bush pardoning Scooter Libby? That would be a form of amnesty, too.

Are you against amnesty as a rule or just for poor, brown people who violated a civil law/committed an infraction?
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I’m for amnesty for the two border patrol agents who are now in prison for doing their job. They shot at an illegal drug dealer, and he is the one that got all the rights. What a mockery of justice!

Scooter Libbey should serve out his sentence. He lied to a grand jury and was part of the Neocon cabal that lied this country into a war that is our undoing. MN Mary
 
For the people opposed to illegal immigration, let me ask:

WHY?

Why are you opposed to illegal immigration?

In what ways are your lives negatively affected by illegal immigrants?
 
Herstal_Belgium said:
For the people opposed to illegal immigration, let me ask:

WHY?

Why are you opposed to illegal immigration?

In what ways are your lives negatively affected by illegal immigrants?
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We are taxed to death to pay for the education, welfare, medical care, legal aid, and any other freebies that the government is required to provide for illegals. We have to build more prisons to house their crimnal element. Our middle class neighborhoods are going down hill and becoming seedy and unsafe. People are losing their equity in their homes as a result. We are afraid to leave our homes for fear they will be burglarized. We are afraid of getting hit on the road by unisured illegals driving cars and vans that are unsafe at any speed. Need I say more?
 
Minnesota_Mary said:
We are taxed to death to pay for the education, welfare, medical care, legal aid, and any other freebies that the government is required to provide for illegals.
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Your argument is against socialism, not illegal immigration.
We have to build more prisons to house their crimnal element.
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Your argument is against violent property crime, not illegal immigration.
Our middle class neighborhoods are going down hill and becoming seedy and unsafe. People are losing their equity in their homes as a result. We are afraid to leave our homes for fear they will be burglarized. We are afraid of getting hit on the road by unisured illegals driving cars and vans that are unsafe at any speed. Need I say more?
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Once again, your argument is against violent and property crime, not illegal immigration.

So, yes, indeed you need to “say more”.
 
Minnesota_Mary said:
I’m for amnesty for the two border patrol agents who are now in prison for doing their job. They shot at an illegal drug dealer, and he is the one that got all the rights. What a mockery of justice!
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Bush has the authority to grant them a pardon. Why doesn’t he?

If it’s a state prison they’re in, the governor of that state can grant them a pardon. Why doesn’t s/he?
Scooter Libbey should serve out his sentence. He lied to a grand jury and was part of the Neocon cabal that lied this country into a war that is our undoing. MN Mary
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He should but I doubt he will.
 
Ituyu said:
Oh really? So they won’t have to pay fines, processing fees, back taxes, go through background and health checks and stay out of trouble, learn English and go to the back of the line?

Those that call S.1348 AMNESTY don’t know what they are talking about!!
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Amnesty by any other name is still AMNESTY.🤷
 
Herstal_Belgium said:
For the people opposed to illegal immigration, let me ask:

WHY?

Why are you opposed to illegal immigration?

In what ways are your lives negatively affected by illegal immigrants?
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Some of us have the old-fashioned idea that laws should be obeyed.
 
Herstal_Belgium said:
For the people opposed to illegal immigration, let me ask:

WHY?

Why are you opposed to illegal immigration?

In what ways are your lives negatively affected by illegal immigrants?
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Do you have car insurance? Why?

For every reason I can think of also applies to opposing illegal immigration.

Can you give valid reasons for not having car insurance that excuse you from driving anyway that other drivers will agree with?
 
mary_bobo said:
Some of us have the old-fashioned idea that laws should be obeyed.
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Some of us also have and old-fashioned idea that laws should serve a purpose, be FAIR and JUST. Closing the Legal door was an arbitrary and UNFAIR decision. We saw that they were coming in “illegally” to fill jobs and we did nothing because we ALL benefited. And, then we turn around and brand them as “illegal” when we needed them as much as they needed us. We’ve milked them for tax monies for services that they can never receive and we cry foul? Now we want to extract exorbitant fines just so that they can work at low paying jobs, that we could not fill, to support a family of meager means. Then we hide behind a law that we chose to ignore by not admitting the legal labor that we needed so that we could have even cheaper labor. Had we applied the law consistently we could have had the legal workforce that our economy demanded but NO WE WOULD RATHER POINT THE FINGER OF BLAME AT THEM!! I think it only right that we consider their plight from our actions and make amends.
 
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